Gender Observations In Angelfish

MalJ

I currently have two angelfish and while I know that when trying to determine gender opinions range from waiting until breeding age - gender behavior. So I figured I'd ask those with more experience with this incredible species, if there are any subtle or obvious ways (besides breeding tubes) to determine gender.

My two angels spend 99% of their time together. WOuld this occur even if they were the same sex? I'm asking because the only other species I've kept from the cichlid family are apistos and in every case the females never interacted, the males would fight and flare constantly. I'm wondering if the same applies here.

I've seen them peck at each other from time to time but not aggressively. In truth, it looks more like a "kiss" since the reviving angel never even flinches. FInally, Age. From the broadest part of their body (not including fins) their size is roughly 3 inches in height and width.

My attempt to get an accurate size

Dj8rK3R.jpg
 

Rok55

Very nice looking specimen you have there, probably several years old. While not always true, my experience has shown the males will have somewhat of a "bump" about 1/3 of the way up on the forehead while the females tend to be more linear. I currently have 10 Angels spread between three tanks and all 3 of my males exhibit this trait.
 

Jocelyn Adelman

They are definitely “of size” to breed... there are a few things one can look for, (shape of forehead, etc) but most of this is subject to interpretation... as far as I know there isn’t really a way to conform sexes until their breeding tubes show... or if you’ve had them for awhile and nothing has happened you could likely assume they are the same sex
bizaliz3 any thoughts here?
 

MalJ

Very nice looking specimen you have there, probably several years old. While not always true, my experience has shown the males will have somewhat of a "bump" about 1/3 of the way up on the forehead while the females tend to be more linear. I currently have 10 Angels spread between three tanks and all 3 of my males exhibit this trait.

I'm surprised by the age? Because of that info about the bump I went ahead and too a couple of pics. The redness on their gills/fin was quite prominent when I first introduced them to the tank but it gets less red day by day.

Sharziz

rY8V9oN.jpg

Fams

qkbZ2K0.jpg


They are definitely “of size” to breed... there are a few things one can look for, (shape of forehead, etc) but most of this is subject to interpretation... as far as I know there isn’t really a way to conform sexes until their breeding tubes show... or if you’ve had them for awhile and nothing has happened you could likely assume they are the same sex
bizaliz3 any thoughts here?

I really want a pair. After watching them spawn on youtube and read journals of it online I think raising a spawn from fry to adults would be a really awesome thing to document. I have a 47gal.
 

Cljensen

I currently have two angelfish and while I know that when trying to determine gender opinions range from waiting until breeding age - gender behavior. So I figured I'd ask those with more experience with this incredible species, if there are any subtle or obvious ways (besides breeding tubes) to determine gender.

My two angels spend 99% of their time together. WOuld this occur even if they were the same sex?

Dj8rK3R.jpg


Yes, I had 3 18 month old in the same tank 2 males and 1 female hoping a pair would form . Well it did my males decided to pair off, yes my males and the female took extreme offense to it and got super aggressive.

As for sexing you really need to see the breading tubes, I have males with a bump and males without a bump. Males that totally look like females. The only time I would sex based on the bump on their head is when it is extremely pronounced. Some females can have a slight bump on their head.
 

MalJ

HI Corrie

I started off with 3 but returned one to my lfs because fams seemed to be warning the third away. I was told about how aggressive they can be so decided to put a halt to it before any real aggresion started but now, I'm wondering if I acted to quickly. I cam across a aquarium with the exact same dimensions as mine with 5 angelfish so I'm thinking perhaps...?

The tank dimensions are 92X 41X 55CM holds 180L (47.55 US gal)
 

Cljensen

47 g is a bit small for 5 angels full grown. If there is 2 pairs the 5th will definitely been a huge target.

I had the 3 because they got along so well for a very long time but one day put of the blue she took after thec2 males and o e of them suffered some fairly major damage to his fins. Luckily I have multiple tanks and can relocate the fake pair.

I would personally wait it out and see what happens. If they get along then that is great. If you are trying to breed them it will be a waiting game to see what happens. I have a female who is 18 months and still hasn't laid a clutch and has only been gravid once.
 

MalJ

47 g is a bit small for 5 angels full grown. If there is 2 pairs the 5th will definitely been a huge target.

I had the 3 because they got along so well for a very long time but one day put of the blue she took after thec2 males and o e of them suffered some fairly major damage to his fins. Luckily I have multiple tanks and can relocate the fake pair.

I would personally wait it out and see what happens. If they get along then that is great. If you are trying to breed them it will be a waiting game to see what happens. I have a female who is 18 months and still hasn't laid a clutch and has only been gravid once.

I noticed something this morning and I'm not exactly sure what it means. I don't have a new pic so I'll use paint on one of the above. I noticed this morning that this section of fams' body was protruding slightly. Up close it looks noticeable and I'll try and get a pic if needed but the section between the pectoral and vertical fins definitely looks more plump that it did yesterday. Also this morning fams was acting slightly erratic?

TCTJ301.jpg

The other angel (Sharziz) doesn't appear to have developed a similar bulge?
 

Mcasella

It is either food or eggs, same area for them to bulge.
 

MalJ

It is either food or eggs, same area for them to bulge.

This is hopeful news. I spotted the bulge this morning, a full 12 hours since their fast feed and it was still there when I got home. The other angel hasn't changed. Perhaps they're just growing but I'm hopeful it's the beginning of "her" getting a gravid.

My Cory cats started spawning recently and I picked them up at the same time as the angels so i'm hopeful that my parameters are stable enough. That said, my API ammonia test is consistently 0.25ppm.
 

Mcasella

Your ammonia should read zero, have you tested the source of your water?
 

MalJ

Your ammonia should read zero, have you tested the source of your water?

I use apI as my main test but also use nutrafin liquid tests (30 mins for results) which has read 0ppm consistently. Also, my nitrites has always been 0ppm even when the ammonia is reading 0.25ppm. There seems to be some discussion around API's 0.25 ammonia reading.
 

MalJ

Two more pics of Fams. I'm not sure his/her stomach is gravid or not, Hopefully this might make it easier for others to tell.


qGqSjBe.jpg

q4VQ1uH.jpg
 

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