Future gbr tank questions

Hi, I'm planning on buying a new tank soon but have some questions on stocking breeding tank size (smaller than 30g) best filter/light etc for a good price.
I would like a well planted tank with a breeding pair of GBR. My tap water is soft with a ph around 6.5 so I understand that suits the gbr. I want to ask people who have experience with breeding gbr what helped them breed in regard to best plants or other decor. Also what tank mates could I keep that wouldnt touch the fry I'm thining a small group of tetra and a clean up crew either shrimp or otos or whatever will not touch fry. The preferable tank size would be about 20 gallon and any advice would be appreciated on tank mates plants breeding and scape. I believe coralbandit has a lot of experience so if you chimed in I would be very happy
Thanks,Lucas

 

20 gal
temp: 82
2 gbrs
7-8 ember tetras
8 otocinclus vestitus

Btw: I'd kill for your water. jk jk Where abouts do you live?

 

20 gal
temp: 82
2 gbrs
7-8 ember tetras
8 otocinclus vestitus

Btw: I'd kill for your water. jk jk Where abouts do you live?

Alright sounds good! Maybe ill switch up the tetras for others but that sounds nice anyway. I recently discovred otos and I love them. Any ideas for hardscape and plants from any experienced ram breeders? Btw I live in belfast, ireland so ill ship you some water if you want haha, it was a great quarantined st paddys day here on tuesday also I live in ireland so I would prefer °celcius pls

 

Only O. vestitus does well in warmer water. Well there is one other oto that dos well in warmer water but it is really rare.
I don't breed rams but coralbandit does! You're paing for the shipping right? lol I feel sorry for you. 27.5-28c

 

Thanks, you can pay for shipping in the form of toilet roll

 

Toilet paper? Sure! We have a bunch (no, I don't hoard. We went to Costco and got one of those big packs a month before covid-19 even came out).

 

Ok so after some research my plan is to hopefully buy a 20 gallon off amazon very soon(any recommendations?)
This will be a good project during isolations and I will begin with scaping and heavily planting with some easy and hardy plants in a sand capped gravel substrate.
After the cycle completes and hopefully the virus passes I will begin by stocking with about 8 ember tetras as they will not eat the potential gbr fry. Then I will add about 5 otos maybe more if I think I can fit more and finally add the gbr pair which I need to find, any tips on how to id a pair?
I will keep the tank at 27°C and will provide flat rocks and driftwood for spawning.
Now question time...
Best plants, light/filter/tank /heater recommendations, extra ideas welcome and should I add amanos too? I'm hoping for some advice responses here so don't hold back and act like this is your own tank.

 

I won’t have a lot of specific input on the GBR but for the equipment.

If you want a 20 gal I would shoot for a 20L if you can. it gives you a longer foot print to setup territory for the Rams to give all space while spawning. It also gives more space and flexibly for your plants and other scaping.

Filter: I personally like Marineland filters. I use
them with DIY foam media setup and I ditch the bio wheels. But I feel the are reliable and do a great job for the price. They just released a new Pro line which are very nice but not as readily available.

Heater: I have a Eheim Jager and a Fluval heater and both have not given me any issues. I only slightly prefer the Fluval due to that they are a little smaller then the comparable wattage Eheim. But the Eheim gets rave reviews on this forum.

Light: There are a lot of options here! With a 20gal whether long or standard Height it will be easy to provide good light since they both aren’t particularly tall tanks. I think lights with the built in 24/7 features are pretty nice. They also usually give you the ability to customize the light more as well with brightness, color spectrum etc.

but pretty much any light for planted tanks should give you decent results on a 20 gallon.

 

Thanks cody I was planning on a 20 long and probably shouldve mentioned that whoops. So the filter is the biggest question for me as I'm not that experienced in setting them up and how they run as my other tank came with one and my main tank was set up by my dad. Does the filter you recommended go inside or outside the tank and is it relatively easy to set up and maintain? Also for lighting I will try to get one of those bluetooth ones so I can customize the brightness, times and colours.

 

The Marineland Bio wheel filters are easy to setup. They hang on the back and you just fill the chamber with water and plug it in and it runs! The new pro models are self priming though so those you literally just hang it and plug it in.

Any hang on the back style filter will be pretty easy to maintain honestly. Make sure you use a pre-filter on the intake too so your future fry do not get sucked up.

That being said you may want to consider using a sponge filter as well.

I bought foam filter media off of amazon and cut it to fit and use that instead of the stock filter cartridges. Then every few months you just give them a squeeze to get some of the gunk off. This can be done on pretty much any filter and it lasts for years rather then buying Replacement filters.Not a right or wrong way to do it. That’s just my preference.

 

Alright thanks a lot for the help

 

Here's a good video on keeping rams in general:

Also goes into breeding, with some very cool footage.

Setup - a 20L is a great size for a pair of rams. Lighting wise, depends on your intent with regard to plants?
Filter - lot of options here and it will depend on your tank's bio-load. Generally, something like an Aquaclear50 hang on back filter would work well. I usually recommend Eheim heaters, but there are plenty others that work ok. An Eheim 250 external canister filter would also be a good option if you want to spend a bit more.
I loathe gravel vacuuming so would advocate using an Aquasoil of some sort- makes life easier and grows plants well.

Breeding is another matter, but I'd suggest buying a TDS pen (cheap on Amazon) - it's a useful tool in measuring water hardness. Rams needs soft water for their eggs to become fertilised, but can withstand a fair range of hardness once their older (eg. 100 - 350ppm TDS). I find it best to keep the water a bit warmer for breeding purposes - 84F/ 30C but that may come down to my tanks all being rimless/ open topped. I just found things just improved a bit when I moved from 28 - 30C.
And your pH of 6.5 is perfect for them.

They're great fish to keep. Some Otos' are a good call, but most shoal fish will eat the fry. Green neons are also a pretty nice option and can handle warmer water, much as Cardinals or Rummynose tetras can.
The warm temperatures mean its best to use fairly hardy plants and to make sure any other fish are well suited. SterbaI Corys' are another nice option but tend to prefer some sand as a substrate.

They are fairly demanding as to water quality and consistency but with adequate filtration, water and maintenance will be fine. I'd recommend you let the tank mature a month or two at least (beyond being cycled) if this is an all new setup.
Good luck and keep us posted!

 

Thanks a lot cale. I actually watched thst video earlier today, its really good, especially about determining sex as I need to make sure I'm getting a pair.
I do want a 20L but I live in the uk and I'm struggling to find one but ill work it out.
Thanks for the suggestions fo filters ill have a look at them and also for the aquasoil I was acc planning on using that capped with with only a thin layer of sand, would that be fine?
I really want the otos I think they are very cute and gentle and rummy nose terras are a good option but I think I'm going for embers just for their smaller size so less likely to kill all fry.
I'm planning on amazon swords, anubias java fern and a few types off moss.
Would all these fish be ok at a standard temp of 28°C and the occasional bump to 30? I don't really mind loosing some fry as I would have to many, I just want a pair so they are nice with each other and just a couple of fry for my other tank.
Ill definitely let the tank mature for a while, and grow some algae for the otos, I probably won't be adding rams until after summer, I'm going to wait to find a healthy pair from a local breeder hopefully or from on here, thanks for the help and is there and 20 longs in the UK!!!???

 

Thanks a lot cale. I actually watched thst video earlier today, its really good, especially about determining sex as I need to make sure I'm getting a pair.
I do want a 20L but I live in the uk and I'm struggling to find one but ill work it out.
Thanks for the suggestions fo filters ill have a look at them and also for the aquasoil I was acc planning on using that capped with with only a thin layer of sand, would that be fine?
I really want the otos I think they are very cute and gentle and rummy nose terras are a good option but I think I'm going for embers just for their smaller size so less likely to kill all fry.
I'm planning on amazon swords, anubias java fern and a few types off moss.
Would all these fish be ok at a standard temp of 28°C and the occasional bump to 30? I don't really mind loosing some fry as I would have to many, I just want a pair so they are nice with each other and just a couple of fry for my other tank.
Ill definitely let the tank mature for a while, and grow some algae for the otos, I probably won't be adding rams until after summer, I'm going to wait to find a healthy pair from a local breeder hopefully or from on here, thanks for the help and is there and 20 longs in the UK!!!???

No problem. Embers (and otos) can handle warmer water too although might still snack on some fry. Making sure you have space/ hides for the tank is pretty important as oftentimes the pair of rams will fight a bit, usually the male chasing after the female if a spawn doesn't work out or if she isn't ready to spawn in the first place.
Plants all sound good too.
As to tank size, a 20L is a good guideline but you could look out for a 60 litre (+-15 US gallons) or a bit bigger.
I have pairs in 37l and 54l tanks at present (no other fish with them) and they do just fine, but with other livestock a bit bigger is better.
Around 75/80 litres would be a good size and is close in volume to a 20Long.

 

Yeah ill make sure there are densely planted sections fo hiding thanks. Ill keep this thread up to date with progress

 

HI I have found a
30×15×12 tank
A filter
A ehiem jager heater
A nicrew 24/7 light
And a thermometer
For a total of £126/$150
Is this a good price?
All I need now is some aqua soil substrate and plants and let it cycle

 

HI I have found a
30×15×12 tank
A filter
A ehiem jager heater
A nicrew 24/7 light
And a thermometer
For a total of £126/$150
Is this a good price?
All I need now is some aqua soil substrate and plants and let it cycle

That list all sounds good - hard to guage prices as they are dependent on the area you live in, etc.

 

All ordered now including some plants substrate ammonia and tss. I can't wait, now it just has to arrive and it will help me survive quarantine!!

 

Fo hardscape I have some spider wood, driftwood, dragon stone and grey mountain stone.
I have read that grey mountain stone can contain calcium and minerals that harden water. If this is true can it be prepared in a way that it won't have this effect? Possibly a vinegar bath???

 

Fo hardscape I have some spider wood, driftwood, dragon stone and grey mountain stone.
I have read that grey mountain stone can contain calcium and minerals that harden water. If this is true can it be prepared in a way that it won't have this effect? Possibly a vinegar bath???

I think if they do contain anything that is non-intert it will affect the water forever. You can test it with vinegar to see if it reacts but I don’t think. you can rid it if the minerals.

 

Fo hardscape I have some spider wood, driftwood, dragon stone and grey mountain stone.
I have read that grey mountain stone can contain calcium and minerals that harden water. If this is true can it be prepared in a way that it won't have this effect? Possibly a vinegar bath???

Unless you have loads of the rock in the scape I wouldn't worry about it- usually the effect is fairly marginal to hardness. First off you need to see exactly how hard your water is - a LFS will be able to test KH and GH if you don't have the liquid tests.
You can always soften the water by adding alder cones, catappa leaves and other tannin leeching things if need be, but again I wouldn't think it necessary.

 

Unless you have loads of the rock in the scape I wouldn't worry about it- usually the effect is fairly marginal to hardness. First off you need to see exactly how hard your water is - a LFS will be able to test KH and GH if you don't have the liquid tests.
You can always soften the water by adding alder cones, catappa leaves and other tannin leeching things if need be, but again I wouldn't think it necessary.

I know my tap water is soft because I looked up my post code on the water supplier's website. It's only 2kg of stone so fingers crossed I'm ok.

 

I have a marimo moss ball sitting around in a spare tank atm. In the new tank it it possible to rip it into flat moss to put on rocks or wood without it dying? Would it spread? Could I impale it on the top of some spiderwood to create a tree look?

 

The first plants have arrived. I'm keeping them in a basin of water with flourish to keep them alive until I have the tank to plant them

 

Hardscape:


Plants:



I have it full now and filter running, ill post photos when the bubbles are gone