40 Gallon Tank Fishless cycle - is this going okay? (Sorry, long)

Hi everyone! Apologies in advance for the length — I wanted to make sure you had all the info you need. Short version: is my fishless cycle going okay, or is there something else I need to do?

I started setting up a 40 gallon breeder a couple of weeks ago, and want to get two fantail goldfish when the tank is ready (or would three be okay?). In the tank I’ve got: Stoney River Premium Aquarium Substrate, a few (acrylic? Plastic?) gems scattered around, some landscaping river rocks from Home Depot (soaked in a 10:1 water/bleach solution for 24 hours, then rinsed thoroughly), a Fluval Aquaclear 110 filter, and two anubias nanas and three Java ferns from Petsmart.

The water temperature was at about 72 degrees for the first week, then I added a heater and raised the temp to 84. The Java ferns developed some brown patches (still mostly green), so I lowered the temp. It’s been at 81 for the last four days or so and the Java ferns haven’t gotten worse. I plan to lower the temp to 72 once the cycle is done, before I get the goldfish.

Two weeks ago I set up the tank, added Aqueon water conditioner, waited 24 hours, then added Dr. Tim’s ammonia enough for 4 PPM. Then I added TSS+. Then I read that 4 PPM ammonia is probably too high for TSS+. Whoops.

Tested ammonia regularly, didn’t see a change. Then a couple of days ago I thought it might, maybe, have gone down a little, so for fun I tested the nitrites and got a reading. Hooray! Then I tested the nitrates, and got another reading! Hoor—wait, what? What now? So here’s what’s been happening over the past few days:

Tap water (well water):
pH 8.4
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrates: 0

Tank:

9/23
2 or 4 Ammonia - can’t tell
.25 nitrite
Between 0 and 5 nitrate - not sure it’s quite 5, but it’s not zero
pH looks to be at 7, or 6.8 depending on the light
Temperature 81

9/24
Ammonia - 2ppm
Nitrite - 1ppm
Nitrate - 5 ppm? Hard to read the API chart
forgot to test ph

9/25
Ammonia 2 ppm
Nitrites 5? Dark purple on the API test kit chart
Nitrates 5 ppm
pH 6.8

9/26 1 AM, 12 hours after 9/25 test
Ammonia 1 ppm
Nitrites 5 ppm? Higher?
Nitrates 10 ppm? Higher than 9/25
pH 6.6

9/26 (today) 1 PM
Ammonia .5 ppm
Nitrites: same as 9/26, 5 or higher
Nitrates 10? Maybe 5. Depends on the light
pH 6.5? A little lighter than the last test, but not 6.4

If it matters, the nitrite testing drops are turning dark purple as soon as they hit the bottom of the tube, before I shake the tube. I’m guessing that the level is higher than 5 ppm.

So, is this all going okay? Is there anything I should be doing now? Adding more ammonia? How much more? Water change? Water change and ammonia? If so, would conditioning the added water cause problems with the added ammonia? Is the changing pH going to be a problem?

Thanks for your help, and thanks especially for taking the time to read all of this.

 

So, as for the water parameters, I'd say you're on track. I'd personally do a water change to reduce your nitrites to below 4 or so, as I've always heard that values much higher than that can start to stall your cycle. Your PH will also be a tad on the low side for fancies, so you'll want to watch for fin curling and skin acidification. Can you get a water hardness test kit? The fact that your water was 8.4 out of the tap and has dropped to 6.5 in your tank makes me think that maybe your water is just a little soft.

Your cycle will be "complete" (it never finishes, as it's a cycle!) whenever you read 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite, and probably some nitrate. Once that occurs, you'll want to do a big water change to bring nitrates down to under 40 (I usually just do a 100% water change at this point to start fresh), and you'll be good from there. I'd still test frequently, as a tank won't mature for months or years after it's set up, and brand new tanks tend to be unstable while adding fish.

As far as how many fish to add, I'd personally say you'd be okay with three for a while. Keep in mind that these fish have the potential to be too big to comfortably turn around in a 5 gallon bucket - I've seen it happen. If they get that big, I'd say one will eventually become uncomfortable in a 40 alone. However, that's many, many years down the road, and I'd say that 2-3 will do well in a 40 for a long time.

 

Your cycle seems to be working fine for now , keep testing and watching for those nitrates lowering . Do you have a pic of the algae on the plants ?
I agree with ChrissFishes101 about further down the road they may become too large , what’s the tank dimensions ?

 

The tank is 36” long, 18” wide, and 16” high. It’s a little wider than a conventional 40 gallon, so I’m hoping it’s enough space. Leaning towards getting two goldfish — I’d hate to get three small ones and a couple of years down the line find that they’ve outgrown the tank.

I’ve attached pics of the Java ferns. I should clarify: the “three” packages actually contained several Java ferns tied together at the roots with thread, so really I have a lot of one- and two-leaf ferns, glued to three rocks. I’ve been leaving them alone. (The white specks you might see see floating around are just bubbles; as the tank water has evaporated, the filter water is splashing more. That’ll be fixed with the water change.)

I don’t have anything to test how soft the water is, but I’ll get a kit.

And of course I have more questions:

I’ve read that if the pH gets too low it can stall the cycle — is that true?

Re the water change, am I correct in thinking I remove the water I’m swapping out, add enough conditioner to the remaining water for the full 40 gallons, then I can just add the new water?

I’ve only added ammonia the one time when I started this. Should I be adding more to keep it at a certain level?

Thank you so much for your help!

 

I’ve read that if the pH gets too low it can stall the cycle — is that true?

Yes if it gets too much below 7.

Re the water change, am I correct in thinking I remove the water I’m swapping out, add enough conditioner to the remaining water for the full 40 gallons, then I can just add the new water?

If you are using a Python people generally add for the whole 40g. You can just add to each bucket if you are doing changes that way. This is what I do.

I’ve only added ammonia the one time when I started this. Should I be adding more to keep it at a certain level?

Yes you should try to keep it to the level you started at until you see a nitrite level start. Then only re-dose it when it gets to zero.

Does everything make sense so far? I can explain more if needed.

 

It makes perfect sense, StarGirl. Thanks!

 

I like your plants. Stargirl has already answered so I don’t have anything to add really. If you need help with the test kits and numbers just ask ..

 

One thing to add. Wait at least 2 weeks after adding TSS+ before doing a water change. The only test you need to be running during this time is the pH and ammonia. The pH to make sure it stays above 7 and the ammonia so you know when to add more. Add more once it gets down to or close to zero.

I see your pH dropped from above 8 down to just below 7. This tells me your water lacks the buffers to hold it up to the original level. You may want to consider getting some crushed coral to help stabilize it. Run the over night test on your well water. Put some in a container. Run the pH test as soon as you put the water in the container and again 24 hours later. This will give you a rough idea as to what your pH is going to be in the tank. It would be better if you could run an airstone in this container to mimic what happens in the tank. If you can't run an airstone then just stir the water a few times a day.

 

I changed about 85% of the water last night, added the water conditioner, and had this:

Ph between 7.2 and 7.6
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 2
Nitrates 5 ppm? Close to it

I added some ammonia, tested 30 minutes later - 1 ppm.

Today:
pH 6.6
Ammonia .25 and .5
Nitrites 2? 5? Higher? Not really worrying about it right now
Nitrates around 5

The pH drop is worrying me. I’ve ordered the GH and KH test kit, and I guess I’ll be getting crushed coral.

Every time I think I’ve learned something, I come across five more things I need to figure out. Oddly I’m not frustrated — this process is turning out a lot more interesting than I expected. (Ask me again in a few weeks if it’s still not cycled.)

I’m gonna have this tank so fine-tuned the fish’ll be like, “****, woman, enough — just throw us in already.”

 

Yeah the crushed coral sounds like a good plan!

 

Reminder....rinse the coral good before adding it. The dust will spike the pH quickly. Just so you don't think omg I added too much.

 

Reminder....rinse the coral good before adding it. The dust will spike the pH quickly. Just so you don't think omg I added too much.

Good reminder. Since this is a fishless cycle a quick rise in pH isn't going to be a problem but we do want to avoid an OMG moment.

The good thing about crushed coral is it is only going to raise the pH so much and no more no matter how much we put in there. The pH level it settles in at will be different than it is for me. Where it stops depends on the chemistry of our water so where it is for me will be different that it will be for you. It is the most natural way I know of to stabilize the pH.

 

No massive weirdness happening with the tank — things seem to be under control so far. Thanks for your help, and thanks especially for helping me avoid any OMG moments — I hate those!