Fishless Cycle - High Nitrites and Nitrates

Hi folks,

not sure what to do next with my cycle. 55g fishless been cycling for almost 4 weeks. Was adding Ammonia at first which was reading 4.0PPM for a couple of weeks.

Currently my ammonia is zero and my nitrites and nitrates are very high, almost off the API charts. It has been like this for 3-4 days. 2 days ago I added more ammonia and brought it up to 2.0PPM but was back to zero again the next day. It seems the cycle is working fine but my nitrites will not go down

I did a 20% water change yesterday, same results

What should I do next? Do I keep adding ammonia? Do I need a bigger water change to bring the nitrites down?

 

As long as your ammonia is still going down within 24 hours your cycle is still moving forward. Doing a very large water change might help speed things up a bit but as long as the ammonia is going down it isn't necessary. I would continue to add ammonia every other day. If you stop adding it you won't know if your cycle is still moving forward.

You can find out just how high both nitrites and nitrates are but doing dilution tests. Start out with 1ml tank water and 4 mls source water in the test tube instead of all tank water. Mulitply the number you get by 4 and you will know how high they are.

If the colors in the test tubes are still off the chart I will recommend you change out most of the water. As long as you temp match and dechlorinate the fresh water a large water change will not hurt the cycling process.

 

Sounds like this is going just as it should. Cycle has two parts; ammonia processing and nitrite processing. Ammonia processing starts first and nitrite processing starts second. Cycles usually take about six weeks, but can be anywhere from 3 weeks to more than 8 weeks. I would guess you will be done in a couple more weeks.

I would do a water change to get nitrites below 5 ppm, maybe even below 2 ppm. Then keep doing what you are doing until 2 ppm ammonia processes to zero ammonia and zero nitrites in 24 hours.

Then do a big water change to get nitrates lower. How low is low enough is subject to debate. You can worry about that later.

Right now, do whatever water changes are necessary to keep nitrites below 5 ppm at the most, I prefer 2 ppm since I cannot tell the difference between 2, 5 and off the charts.

It will might take big water changes (like 50% to 80%) to get nitrites down below 2 to 5 ppm.

 

You're almost there. That nitrite spike lasted for about 10 days for me. After that, you should be cycled. I'd keep dosing ammonia and get the bb to be able to process more ammonia than you think you'll need with fish in for a week or two after that. That way, you can introduce more fish initially without nearly as much risk of an ammonia spike.

To clear those nitrates and get them measurable again, were it me I'd do something on the order of a 95% water change. At this point, it shouldn't affect the cycle. The bacteria you're growing don't live in the water, they live on the surfaces in your tank, especially the surfaces in your filter. Now's a good time to start working to keep your nitrates under 40 (preferably 30) as much as possible. Nothing to do with the cycle. That's almost done, but it's a good practice to get into once you've got fish in there.

 

If this continues to bother you, I recommend getting API Nitra-Zorb packets for your filter. They are a staple of my tank and really help regulate my cycle. You can get them for about $15 on Amazon and they last forever since you can “recharge” them with a salt water solution.

 

If this continues to bother you, I recommend getting API Nitra-Zorb packets for your filter. They are a staple of my tank and really help regulate my cycle. You can get them for about $15 on Amazon and they last forever since you can “recharge” them with a salt water solution.

I agree, Nitra-zorb is a very good product that does what it says it will do but I don't think one would want to use it while doing a fishless cycle.

 

I agree, Nitra-zorb is a very good product that does what it says it will do but I don't think one would want to use it while doing a fishless cycle.

Fair point mattgirl!

Just keep it in mind as you begin adding fish. I originally added mine because I tend to run a fully stocked tank, and it saved me from dealing with the sudden spikes that often come when your tank is still maturing.

 

50% water change done. Levels still high but not as high. I added more ammonia and will check levels again tomorrow. *Levels in pic checked before adding ammonia. **Levels checked 2 hours after water change

 

After a 50% water change and more ammonia added 2 days go it appears I'm cycled! Do i need to do another wc to lower my nitrate (between 10-20ppm) before adding fish? Also, do I need to gradually add my stock or can i add all at once?

 

After a 50% water change and more ammonia added 2 days go it appears I'm cycled! Do i need to do another wc to lower my nitrate (between 10-20ppm) before adding fish? Also, do I need to gradually add my stock or can i add all at once?

Congratulations!!! It looks like your cycle is complete. The number of fish one can add all at once depends on how much ammonia the tank will process in 24 hours. If you plan on heavily stocking this tank I will recommend you be sure it will process at least 3ppm ammonia, 4ppm may be even better. It is better to have too much bacteria instead of not quite enough.

You have been very patient up to this point. You may want to be patient for just a little while longer. What I would do is dose the tank up to 3ppm. If it is back to 0 within 24 hours I would then dose it up to 4ppm. If the cycle will process that amount back to 0 within 24 hours then it is time to do a water change big enough to get the nitrates back down to less than 20 and get your fish. If the cycle will process that much ammonia then you can add all your fish at once.

 

Congratulations!!! It looks like your cycle is complete. The number of fish one can add all at once depends on how much ammonia the tank will process in 24 hours. If you plan on heavily stocking this tank I will recommend you be sure it will process at least 3ppm ammonia, 4ppm may be even better. It is better to have too much bacteria instead of not quite enough.

You have been very patient up to this point. You may want to be patient for just a little while longer. What I would do is dose the tank up to 3ppm. If it is back to 0 within 24 hours I would then dose it up to 4ppm. If the cycle will process that amount back to 0 within 24 hours then it is time to do a water change big enough to get the nitrates back down to less than 20 and get your fish. If the cycle will process that much ammonia then you can add all your fish at once.

Would this be considered heavily stocked for a 55g?

4 glow tetras
2 guppies
2 angel fish
5 cribs
4 dwarf gourami
2 nerite snails
1 otocinclus catfish

 

Would this be considered heavily stocked for a 55g?

4 glow tetras
2 guppies
2 angel fish
5 cribs
4 dwarf gourami
2 nerite snails
1 otocinclus catfish

I wouldn't consider that heavily stocked. If your tank will process 3ppm ammonia through to nitrates within 24 hours I would think you could comfortably add all of these fish at the same time. Just keep a close eye on the parameters and be prepared to do water changes if needed.

 

I wouldn't consider that heavily stocked. If your tank will process 3ppm ammonia through to nitrates within 24 hours I would think you could comfortably add all of these fish at the same time. Just keep a close eye on the parameters and be prepared to do water changes if needed.

Thanks Mattgirl for all your help! Wish I could send ya a beer lol

 

Thanks Mattgirl for all your help! Wish I could send ya a beer lol

You are so very welcome. I'll take a Dr. Thunder

 

I was taking a look at your stocking plan and have a few suggestions to think about before you purchase -


4 glow tetras - Tetras are a shoaling fish. They will be happiest if you have 6 or more of them. With a 55 you could easily have a group of 10 in your tank without issues, and I promise you they would be much more of a show. With 4 they are likely to hide a lot.
2 guppies - guppies are potentially in danger from the other fish in this tank (DC/Cribs/Angelfish)
2 angel fish - If you are purchasing these make sure you get the smallest juveniles you can find. If Angels aren't raised with other community fish (such as guppy/tetra etc) they are very likely to eventually think of the smaller fish as a snack.
5 cribs - I haven't raised these myself, but they are typically only kept with faster/more aggressive community fish (such as Tiger barbs - you can get glofish tiger barbs, btw). I'm pretty sure they would harass your guppies. They also are known to get territorial, so I'm not sure offhand how many are safe in a 55.
4 dwarf gourami - If you would like a group of smallish gourami I highly recommend you switch these to either honey gourami OR thick-lipped gourami (usually sold as 'Red honey gourami or sunset gourami). Dwarf gourami also get very territorial and typically pet stores only sell males, so you can't typically get 1M,3F which is what you would want in a community tank. You'd be running a risk they would all end up fighting with one another.
2 nerite snails - make sure you have a tight lid, these are known to be escape artists.
1 otocinclus catfish - Oto cats are great fish to have. I currently keep them. Two things about them though - a) they are a shoaling fish, so you'd want 5-10 of them (which your 55 could definitely hold). b) they have a reputation as coming half-starved from pet stores, leading to a +/- 50% death rate in the first month or so. I currently have 5 in my tank, and that is from first purchasing 10. Once they get established they are a very fun fish, but if you only purchase one it's pretty likely they will die.

My apologies if I'm delivering hard news, I just wanted you to be warned what you might be in for with this tank build.

 

I was taking a look at your stocking plan and have a few suggestions to think about before you purchase -


4 glow tetras - Tetras are a shoaling fish. They will be happiest if you have 6 or more of them. With a 55 you could easily have a group of 10 in your tank without issues, and I promise you they would be much more of a show. With 4 they are likely to hide a lot.
2 guppies - guppies are potentially in danger from the other fish in this tank (DC/Cribs/Angelfish)
2 angel fish - If you are purchasing these make sure you get the smallest juveniles you can find. If Angels aren't raised with other community fish (such as guppy/tetra etc) they are very likely to eventually think of the smaller fish as a snack.
5 cribs - I haven't raised these myself, but they are typically only kept with faster/more aggressive community fish (such as Tiger barbs - you can get glofish tiger barbs, btw). I'm pretty sure they would harass your guppies. They also are known to get territorial, so I'm not sure offhand how many are safe in a 55.
4 dwarf gourami - If you would like a group of smallish gourami I highly recommend you switch these to either honey gourami OR thick-lipped gourami (usually sold as 'Red honey gourami or sunset gourami). Dwarf gourami also get very territorial and typically pet stores only sell males, so you can't typically get 1M,3F which is what you would want in a community tank. You'd be running a risk they would all end up fighting with one another.
2 nerite snails - make sure you have a tight lid, these are known to be escape artists.
1 otocinclus catfish - Oto cats are great fish to have. I currently keep them. Two things about them though - a) they are a shoaling fish, so you'd want 5-10 of them (which your 55 could definitely hold). b) they have a reputation as coming half-starved from pet stores, leading to a +/- 50% death rate in the first month or so. I currently have 5 in my tank, and that is from first purchasing 10. Once they get established they are a very fun fish, but if you only purchase one it's pretty likely they will die.

My apologies if I'm delivering hard news, I just wanted you to be warned what you might be in for with this tank build.

Thanks for all the information, as a beginner I appreciate every bit of help I can get

Glo tetras and guppies are from my 10g before I upgraded. I am thinking about getting 2 more tetras but the lfs said I'm at my max when I tried to buy a BN pleco today!?! The guppies seem ok so far and are not being bothered by the others. Actually all of tge different fish seem to be getting along so far, only been 2 days lol

The angels and 9 (typo earlier when I said 5) crips are babies and have been in their own tank together for a month now.

The dwarf gourami's are young as well and I do have 1 male and 3 females

I also purchased a rainbox shark yesterday. I'm keeping a close eye on him too, young one

Question if you don't mind. During my fishless cycle I was using a sponge filter from my old 10g. Now that the tank is cycled and the bacteria is on my fluval canister can I remove the air hose from the sponge filter? I'd like to hook up an air stone

Also in the opinion, am I fully stocked?

 

Thanks for all the information, as a beginner I appreciate every bit of help I can get

Glo tetras and guppies are from my 10g before I upgraded. I am thinking about getting 2 more tetras but the lfs said I'm at my max when I tried to buy a BN pleco today!?! The guppies seem ok so far and are not being bothered by the others. Actually all of tge different fish seem to be getting along so far, only been 2 days lol

The angels and 9 (typo earlier when I said 5) crips are babies and have been in their own tank together for a month now.

The dwarf gourami's are young as well and I do have 1 male and 3 females

I also purchased a rainbox shark yesterday. I'm keeping a close eye on him too, young one

Question if you don't mind. During my fishless cycle I was using a sponge filter from my old 10g. Now that the tank is cycled and the bacteria is on my fluval canister can I remove the air hose from the sponge filter? I'd like to hook up an air stone

Also in the opinion, am I fully stocked?

Wow! Thanks for the updates. Given that you have quite a few fish that will get 4+ inches, I'd definitely say you are reaching capacity. I'd give your new tankmates a few months before considering adding anything. Many times fish get along fine when they are juveniles, but once they start to reach maturity/breeding age you'll get changes in behavior. If the community seems copacetic once the fish are approaching full size, then you can start to tinker.

It will also give your tank's cycle time to reach a new equilibrium. It's not uncommon when adding a fair number of fish to have a few algae blooms/nitrate spikes etc. With respect to your sponge filter, if it has been a month you are probably just fine to switch it out, there should be plenty of BB in other parts of your tank by now.

And don't be afraid to share some pics!