Fish Keep Dying

Rtessy

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Well, finally time to come here for help. I keep thinking that I've solved the problem, but now I'm stumped.
This is my betta imbellis tank (babies I raised), 20 long planted walstad. 0/0/0 for params, haven't checked pH in a while, somewhere around 6-6.6 probably. Water changes every 2-4 days, 25%. Had 25 babies, now around 10.
I just randomly get deaths. They seem to be suffocation or poisoning or something, but they have a lot of surface agitation, and params are perfect.
Some have black spots like ammonia burns, some don't, but there isn't any ammonia, not even right after some die. All different sizes and all, no aggression what so ever. I had a similar issue with another tank, and now I'm afraid that there is something very wrong with my water, as the other issue only went away after adding carbon.
Let me know if this is a disease or something, the parents were wild. Babies have been treated with prazipro, but that's it so far.
2nd pic is one with spots.
I've been through a couple of things with this, upgraded the filter, added aeration, added a lot more plants, dosed prazi, upped the water changes, got rid of cyanobacteria, but nothing is working and it's killing me.
Honestly, I'm considering just selling all of them in one big package at this point.
 

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Rtessy

Rtessy

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PheonixKingZ said:
I don’t know man, I’m really sorry!! Is this betta fry, or another species?
Betta is a genus, it's a different species than the normal splendens, they're imbellis. Most are mature adults, I wouldn't consider any fry, I mainly meant that I raised these little guys
 

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Sorry to hear this bad news.
I noticed you have a lot of plants in the tank - are you feeding them with ferts or micro/macro minerals?

I think I would isolate them in a tank with no plants........ just a much more sterile environment for the brine. {edit: fry not brine}
 
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RSababady said:
Sorry to hear this bad news.
I noticed you have a lot of plants in the tank - are you feeding them with ferts or micro/macro minerals?

I think I would isolate them in a tank with no plants........ just a much more sterile environment for the brine.
No, I was planning on starting EI tomorrow, but I'm going to hold off. No ferts for the past 2 months.
I don't have another area to isolate them to, and all my tanks have plants and have been cross contaminated with this tank. Having issues with only one other tank, similar, but not quite the same.
 

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Betas sometimes have black spots on them. Could this be velvet? i.e. is the whole skin area sort of fluffy?
Have a look at Bettafix on amazon........, but still think you need to isolate the fry. Maybe a large jar to start off until you can set up a tank for the fry.
 
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Rtessy

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RSababady said:
Betas sometimes have black spots on them. Could this be velvet? i.e. is the whole skin area sort of fluffy?
Have a look at Bettafix on amazon........, but still think you need to isolate the fry. Maybe a large jar to start off until you can set up a tank for the fry.
I think there was a bit of a misunderstanding, they're not fry, I just meant they're fish I raised. They have their own tank, a 20 long, they're imbellis, so even as adults, they all get along.
Definitely not velvet, no reflective gold sheen, just the natural green imbellis iridescence.
I'm not a big fan of betta fix since it doesn't do much, and my asthma messes with me if I use any thing tea tree oil based :/
Edit: oh and imbellis never have black spots, just black horizontal stripes, I'm sure the black is an illness or at least related.
 

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What's your water source? Tap, well, RO?

Any liquid carbon products such as Excel in use?
 
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Rtessy

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AvalancheDave said:
What's your water source? Tap, well, RO?

Any liquid carbon products such as Excel in use?
Tap, TDS 40-50, gH 3, kH 0. No Excel or anything else in use.
It's just so puzzling!!! The dead ones die and look like poisoning/like they can't breathe. I've tried every possible way to increase oxygen, but they've got labyrinth organs!
 

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Rtessy said:
Tap, TDS 40-50, gH 3, kH 0. No Excel or anything else in use.
It's just so puzzling!!! The dead ones die and look like poisoning/like they can't breathe. I've tried every possible way to increase oxygen, but they've got labyrinth organs!
Some people have found their substrate was killing their fish.

Do the deaths somewhat follow water changes? What dechlorinator are you using?
 
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AvalancheDave said:
Some people have found their substrate was killing their fish.

Do the deaths somewhat follow water changes? What dechlorinator are you using?
No, they're just random, no pattern. I'm starting to wonder, it is a walstad so sand capped dirt, but it's been set up for 3 months, and I've spilled the dirt in another tank and didn't notice and didn't have issues... I don't know, I may strip it, maybe do flourite or something instead.
It would have to be a few days, I gotta take care of my mom for a while.
Edit: prime
 

AvalancheDave

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Rtessy said:
No, they're just random, no pattern. I'm starting to wonder, it is a walstad so sand capped dirt, but it's been set up for 3 months, and I've spilled the dirt in another tank and didn't notice and didn't have issues... I don't know, I may strip it, maybe do flourite or something instead.
It would have to be a few days, I gotta take care of my mom for a while.
Edit: prime
If you've tried just about everything then it might be worth changing the substrate.
 
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Rtessy

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AvalancheDave said:
If you've tried just about everything then it might be worth changing the substrate.
Sounds good. Do you happen to know if flourite releases ammonia? What should I do if the substrate change doesn't work?
Hopefully I'll have time Monday, not sure
 

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So with a walstad tank how often and what % are water changes ?
For fish of the same sp. water changes do more then remove nutrients .
They remove GIH [Growth Inhibiting Hormones].
While fry grow many times the alphas of both sex can emit a hormone/pheromone .
What issue with your water do you think you fixed using carbon ?
I filter my fish water ?
 
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Rtessy

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coralbandit said:
So with a walstad tank how often and what % are water changes ?
For fish of the same sp. water changes do more then remove nutrients .
They remove GIH [Growth Inhibiting Hormones].
While fry grow many times the alphas of both sex can emit a hormone/pheromone .
What issue with your water do you think you fixed using carbon ?
I filter my fish water ?
Yeah, I'll go change my original post, I shouldn't have said fry, sorry for confusing everyone.
Most of them are mature adults, I have a 10" tall dual sponge filter, a very large airstone, water change of 25-30% every 2-4 days.
In my pleco tank, they got all skinny and ended up dying gasping, still haven't solved the skinny issue, but they would die with red gills and sometimes red stomachs, params were 0/0/5, water changes of 50-80% every 2-3 days at the time, added a HOB with carbon, deaths stopped.
 

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when do the deaths usually occur?

what's the temp during the day and night?

if you suspect the substrate, i'd do bare bottom and only use floating plants.
 
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Rtessy

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Skavatar said:
when do the deaths usually occur?

what's the temp during the day and night?

if you suspect the substrate, i'd do bare bottom and only use floating plants.
Now that you mention it, probably the night, but I've definitely had some during the day. Well, probably 3-4 during the day, so I guess that's about 1/4-1/2, I normally notice really fast, there are only two I've gotten to after the eyes clouded over, rest were fresh dead.
I did have a temperature spike yesterday and today up to 84 (yikes!), but it's normally 80ish.
Well, the floating plants do an awesome job with the nitrates anyway, I'd be up for trying, but I don't have anywhere else to put the plants, half my tanks don't actually have lights and the other half either have TB or goldfish, lol
 

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If a hob with carbon helped the other tank it would be worth a try.
 
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Rtessy

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david1978 said:
If a hob with carbon helped the other tank it would be worth a try.
If my PetSmart (going tomorrow, may grab some regular gravel, lol) has decent prices, I'll grab one then, if not, I saw one on Amazon that may work. I'll probably take out all cartridges and just fill it with carbon.
 

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Rtessy said:
I think there was a bit of a misunderstanding, they're not fry, I just meant they're fish I raised. They have their own tank, a 20 long, they're imbellis, so even as adults, they all get along.
Definitely not velvet, no reflective gold sheen, just the natural green imbellis iridescence.
I'm not a big fan of betta fix since it doesn't do much, and my asthma messes with me if I use any thing tea tree oil based :/
Edit: oh and imbellis never have black spots, just black horizontal stripes, I'm sure the black is an illness or at least related.
Sorry - just totally read your post wrong.
With you now........ and nothing more to add. I hope someone has something wiser to recommend
 

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