Fish in vs Fishless cycle?

Hello! I'm setting up my 20 gallon tank today (as long as our water get turned on in time) and I have a few questions regarding fish-in cycles. Mainly; what are the benefits of doing one as apposed to a fishless cycle?

My current plain is to do a fishless cycle using fish food or pure ammonia but I'm curious about fish-in cycles. What are some ways to safely do one? Would something like tetra safestart plus work for that?

As I said, I had already planned to do a fishless cycle so I don't mind waiting the weeks it'll take. If it makes a difference, I will be getting some live plants on sunday for the tank. Filter is a marineland penguin 150 and I also have a small sponge filter.

 

Hello! I'm setting up my 20 gallon tank today (as long as our water get turned on in time) and I have a few questions regarding fish-in cycles. Mainly; what are the benefits of doing one as apposed to a fishless cycle?

My current plain is to do a fishless cycle using fish food or pure ammonia but I'm curious about fish-in cycles. What are some ways to safely do one? Would something like tetra safestart plus work for that?

As I said, I had already planned to do a fishless cycle so I don't mind waiting the weeks it'll take. If it makes a difference, I will be getting some live plants on sunday for the tank. Filter is a marineland penguin 150 and I also have a small sponge filter.

It's all up to preference. Most people will say it's in humane ect. To use a fish for a cycle but in my experience I have always used one or two tetras or danios to start my cycles and have never experienced a loss and noticed the cycle was complete in about a month. I did add bacteria and some substrate from previous tanks as well. As long as your ammonia ppm doesn't get above 2 ppm you should be golden for a fish in cycle. Again it's preference and again I've never had a loss when doing fish in cycle.

 

I prefer fish in cycling. The main difference between the two is the number of water changes. With fish in you will be doing them before the ammonia level gets up to one and even more often when the nitrites spike.

 

Providing you have the time and energy to do fish-in, it's fine. It does mean a lot of water changes and testing while the tank cycles, so be sure you are able to commit to it before you put any fish in the tank!

I personally prefer the fishless cycle - it's way less stressful - no worrying whether or not your fish are suffering at all. And very few water changes. You can spend the weeks looking at different kinds of fish and researching them while you wait, stress-free

 

Thank you for your inputs! If I added something like API quick start or tetra safestart and did a fishless cycle would it speed up the cycling process or just do nothing?

Also, I'm planning to get some pygmy cories and a betta so if I did do a fish-in cycle I'm not really sure what type of fish i'd use.

 

I've never used those additives before... but I gather they mess with your test results sometimes. Not sure on how effective they are. My feeling is that if they worked really well, people would be recommending them all the time. Which they don't appear to be

The quickest way would be to add some cycled media from a healthy, cycled tank - if you can get that.

 

Hello! I'm setting up my 20 gallon tank today (as long as our water get turned on in time) and I have a few questions regarding fish-in cycles. Mainly; what are the benefits of doing one as apposed to a fishless cycle?

My current plain is to do a fishless cycle using fish food or pure ammonia but I'm curious about fish-in cycles. What are some ways to safely do one? Would something like tetra safestart plus work for that?

As I said, I had already planned to do a fishless cycle so I don't mind waiting the weeks it'll take. If it makes a difference, I will be getting some live plants on sunday for the tank. Filter is a marineland penguin 150 and I also have a small sponge filter.

Hello Raf...

The fish in cycle will allow you to have fish in the tank pretty much right away. If you're the patient type, then use the fishless method. Just make sure you're consistent with dosing the ammonia. The ammonia source must be steady in order to end up with a stable water chemistry. I prefer to add the fish and feed them a little every day. This will ensure a consistent source of ammonia.

Old

 

Bottled bacteria works for some folks but there are just as many if not more folks that it doesn't do anything to speed up the process. I think conditions have to be perfect for it to work. Perfect is often very difficult to accomplish.

 

I've never used those additives before... but I gather they mess with your test results sometimes. Not sure on how effective they are. My feeling is that if they worked really well, people would be recommending them all the time. Which they don't appear to be

The quickest way would be to add some cycled media from a healthy, cycled tank - if you can get that.

I wanted to see what other people thought of those sort of products, thank you! I don't have access to any established filter media sadly.

Hello Raf...

The fish in cycle will allow you to have fish in the tank pretty much right away. If you're the patient type, then use the fishless method. Just make sure you're consistent with dosing the ammonia. The ammonia source must be steady in order to end up with a stable water chemistry. I prefer to add the fish and feed them a little every day. This will ensure a consistent source of ammonia.

Old

I'm not sure if I'll be able to provide a steady ammonia source, that's one of the reasons I'm looking into doing fish-in cycle. What would be an okay fish to add in while it cycles? I know bettas can be pretty hardy so I'd imagine it would be better than adding the cories to cycle the tank, though I am a little worried about harming what would be my 'main' fish.

 

I used zebra danios and had no losses

 

Personally I prefer fishless. Way easier not doing daily water changes Fairly easy to get your hands on an ammonia source really. Of course you can help yourself along if you can get your hands on some already seeded filter media.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to provide a steady ammonia source, that's one of the reasons I'm looking into doing fish-in cycle. What would be an okay fish to add in while it cycles? I know bettas can be pretty hardy so I'd imagine it would be better than adding the cories to cycle the tank, though I am a little worried about harming what would be my 'main' fish.

Depends on what fish you want in your tank which will be suitable for a fish in cycle.

 

Hello! I'm setting up my 20 gallon tank today (as long as our water get turned on in time) and I have a few questions regarding fish-in cycles. Mainly; what are the benefits of doing one as apposed to a fishless cycle?

My current plain is to do a fishless cycle using fish food or pure ammonia but I'm curious about fish-in cycles. What are some ways to safely do one? Would something like tetra safestart plus work for that?

As I said, I had already planned to do a fishless cycle so I don't mind waiting the weeks it'll take. If it makes a difference, I will be getting some live plants on sunday for the tank. Filter is a marineland penguin 150 and I also have a small sponge filter.

Personally I have Done Both cycles and for me the fishless cycle was way More messy and irregular than the fish in cycle. With the fish in one I did have to do 20% water changes every two days. I guess it depends on the person. ( none of My fish died from the cycle.)

 

Personally I prefer fishless. Way easier not doing daily water changes Fairly easy to get your hands on an ammonia source really. Of course you can help yourself along if you can get your hands on some already seeded filter media.



Depends on what fish you want in your tank which will be suitable for a fish in cycle.

My plan for my tank is a betta and a school of pygmy cory. I'm also considering maybe a group of some kind of tetra (not neons) or rasbora if the stocking isn't too much.

 

I wanted to see what other people thought of those sort of products, thank you! I don't have access to any established filter media sadly.



I'm not sure if I'll be able to provide a steady ammonia source, that's one of the reasons I'm looking into doing fish-in cycle. What would be an okay fish to add in while it cycles? I know bettas can be pretty hardy so I'd imagine it would be better than adding the cories to cycle the tank, though I am a little worried about harming what would be my 'main' fish.

Raf...

There are a lot of hardy fish species you could use. 3 to 4 small to medium sized adult fish for every 10 gallons of water are enough to do the job. Here's a list of hardy fish species: Guppies (females), Platys, Swordtails, any of the minnows and Rasboras. Other species aren't as tolerant of changes in the water. If you're a fan of Goldfish, then use a few Comets. They're really tough fish and don't get extremely large. Just monitor the tank water closely. If you need some help, just ask.

Old

 

Thank you for your inputs! If I added something like API quick start or tetra safestart and did a fishless cycle would it speed up the cycling process or just do nothing?

Also, I'm planning to get some pygmy cories and a betta so if I did do a fish-in cycle I'm not really sure what type of fish i'd use.

In my experience it might speed up the cycle but not that much. I used Seachem stability on a fish tank that I had to set up immediately due to an emergency and it still took a little over 2 weeks to fully cycle. Luckily you can use Seachem Prime which temporarily binds to ammonia and nitrites (says it does for roughly 48 hours) so that they aren't poisonous.

worked like a charm and I didn't lose any fish despite my ammonia ratings being like 8+ at times. Before anyone scolds me yes I still was doing water changes, but due to the emergency it was way overstocked for a little while until I could make things better.

 

Raf...

There are a lot of hardy fish species you could use. 3 to 4 small to medium sized adult fish for every 10 gallons of water are enough to do the job. Here's a list of hardy fish species: Guppies (females), Platys, Swordtails, any of the minnows and Rasboras. Other species aren't as tolerant of changes in the water. If you're a fan of Goldfish, then use a few Comets. They're really tough fish and don't get extremely large. Just monitor the tank water closely. If you need some help, just ask.

Old

Thank you : ) Is it okay to do a fishless cycle for a few days until I get plants and then if I decide to do a fish in cycle, add them a day or so after the plants?

Also, is there a guide or topic of some sort that goes over some of the steps to do a fish-in cycle?

In my experience it might speed up the cycle but not that much. I used Seachem stability on a fish tank that I had to set up immediately due to an emergency and it still took a little over 2 weeks to fully cycle. Luckily you can use Seachem Prime which temporarily binds to ammonia and nitrites (says it does for roughly 48 hours) so that they aren't poisonous.

worked like a charm and I didn't lose any fish despite my ammonia ratings being like 8+ at times. Before anyone scolds me yes I still was doing water changes, but due to the emergency it was way overstocked for a little while until I could make things better.

Thank you! I have seachem prime to use as a tap water conditioner, but it's nice to know that it will do that temporarily.

 

Hi, I personally prefer fishless, because you can mess with the water (if needed) without shocking the fish such as pH swings or pH spikes. But if you do fishless, you will need to watch the paramters and do regular daily water chances and probably get a bottle of Seachem prime to protect your fish from compounds until the tank is cycled.

Like said before, its a preferance thing, some people have good experience with fish in and some don't. B

 

Fish-in. Black skirt tetras can’t go wrong

 

Providing you have the time and energy to do fish-in, it's fine. It does mean a lot of water changes and testing while the tank cycles, so be sure you are able to commit to it before you put any fish in the tank!

I personally prefer the fishless cycle - it's way less stressful - no worrying whether or not your fish are suffering at all. And very few water changes. You can spend the weeks looking at different kinds of fish and researching them while you wait, stress-free

I've never used those additives before... but I gather they mess with your test results sometimes. Not sure on how effective they are. My feeling is that if they worked really well, people would be recommending them all the time. Which they don't appear to be

The quickest way would be to add some cycled media from a healthy, cycled tank - if you can get that.

In my experience it might speed up the cycle but not that much. I used Seachem stability on a fish tank that I had to set up immediately due to an emergency and it still took a little over 2 weeks to fully cycle. Luckily you can use Seachem Prime which temporarily binds to ammonia and nitrites (says it does for roughly 48 hours) so that they aren't poisonous.

worked like a charm and I didn't lose any fish despite my ammonia ratings being like 8+ at times. Before anyone scolds me yes I still was doing water changes, but due to the emergency it was way overstocked for a little while until I could make things better.

Seachem prime is awesome

 

Thank you : ) Is it okay to do a fishless cycle for a few days until I get plants and then if I decide to do a fish in cycle, add them a day or so after the plants?

Also, is there a guide or topic of some sort that goes over some of the steps to do a fish-in cycle?



Thank you! I have seachem prime to use as a tap water conditioner, but it's nice to know that it will do that temporarily.

Just make sure to redose the prime every 48 because it only works for a little bit. That part is key

 

Also, is there a guide or topic of some sort that goes over some of the steps to do a fish-in cycle?

Test every day, do water changes necessary to keep combined ammonia and nitrites at 1 ppm or below. That's it.

I've always used feeder goldfish from the LFS for cycling. Different stores have been glad to loan me some to cycle tanks. I return them a few months later looking more like pigs than feeder fish. Then they go into the pond goldfish tanks.

I've always used fish-in cycling, and never used bottled bacteria. Reading the steady stream of people having trouble using bottled bacteria makes me never want to use it. When I started cycling tanks from scratch with fish in, and added live plants for a bacteria seed bed, my tanks have cycled completely in about three weeks.

 

Test every day, do water changes necessary to keep combined ammonia and nitrites at 1 ppm or below. That's it.

I've always used feeder goldfish from the LFS for cycling. Different stores have been glad to loan me some to cycle tanks. I return them a few months later looking more like pigs than feeder fish. Then they go into the pond goldfish tanks.

I've always used fish-in cycling, and never used bottled bacteria. Reading the steady stream of people having trouble using bottled bacteria makes me never want to use it. When I started cycling tanks from scratch with fish in, and added live plants for a bacteria seed bed, my tanks have cycled completely in about three weeks.

I'm not sure if I'll be able to find a place for a feeder fish afterwards if I get one to cycle the tank.

I have my tank set up and running right now and I added about .5ml of prime. I decided to go ahead and test the pH and ammonia levels of my tap water (without prime). The pH was really high (8.4) and the ammonia was at .50ppm. Should I still add some fish food since there is now prime in the water?

I'm worried I won't be able to lower the pH enough for the fish, especially during the cycle. I'm planning on getting some driftwood (I already have a piece but it's a very unfortunate shape) and I have some Indian almond leaves left over from when I had fish a couple years ago.

 

Don't spend the money on anything. Just find someone with a tank or go to the LFS and get some dirty filter floss or mulm to seed the thank with and stock it lightly right away. Or better yet, get some aquarium plants that are from a cycled tank and play those.

 

I'm not sure if I'll be able to find a place for a feeder fish afterwards if I get one to cycle the tank.

If you get feeders from an LFS they'll be glad to take them back when you're done. They sell for a few cents apiece at feeder size, but sell for a few bucks apiece when you take them back all fattened up.

 

Although many fish will adapt well to a high Ph (8.4 Is certainly on the high end), I would suggest stocking your tank with livebearers or another fish that is happy in harder water (some rainbows for example ) Make things easier on yourself and your fish by stocking your tank based on your water parameters. Why take the hard road and try to continually create conditions that aren't naturally present in your tank? Messing with Ph too much can be very harmful to your fish.

Have you tested Kh and Gh? With a Ph of 8.4, I'm going to guess those readings are also fairly high. No amount of driftwood or leaves is gonna bring that down, if that's the case.
Re the .50 ammonia in your tap water, once the cycle is well established, that ammonia will be processed faifly quickly.

Is it okay to do a fishless cycle for a few days until I get plants and then if I decide to do a fish in cycle, add them a day or so after the plants?

Pick one or the other. If you add a bunch of ammonia to the tank to start fishless, then add your fish, the ammonia is going to harm them. Prime is only going to bind so much of it. Plants can be added at any point, ideally before fish, so you're not messing about in the tank and causing them stress.

 

Thank you! I will try doing some more research before I decide

Although many fish will adapt well to a high Ph (8.4 Is certainly on the high end), I would suggest stocking your tank with livebearers or another fish that is happy in harder water (some rainbows for example ) Make things easier on yourself and your fish by stocking your tank based on your water parameters. Why take the hard road and try to continually create conditions that aren't naturally present in your tank? Messing with Ph too much can be very harmful to your fish.

Have you tested Kh and Gh? With a Ph of 8.4, I'm going to guess those readings are also fairly high. No amount of driftwood or leaves is gonna bring that down, if that's the case.
Re the .50 ammonia in your tap water, once the cycle is well established, that ammonia will be processed faifly quickly.


Pick one or the other. If you add a bunch of ammonia to the tank to start fishless, then add your fish, the ammonia is going to harm them. Prime is only going to bind so much of it. Plants can be added at any point, ideally before fish, so you're not messing about in the tank and causing them stress.

I don't have a test kit for Kh and Gh but I might be able to get one. I'm on a bit of a budget right now. I guess the fish I wanted are out of the question then. I wish I had known this before I had my heart set on them. Would Platy be okay?

I meant to ask if I could have the filter running a few days before I added the fish and did a fish-in cycle but I worded it wrong, sorry! Okay, I will be buying some live plants on sunday

(Sorry for the double post, I didn't see your post until right after I posted)

 

Yes you can certainly do platys! Just be sure to get males only, otherwise you will soon have a tank overrun with babies!
Set up your tank and let it run for a couple of days if you like. It will give everything a chance to settle, and you can make sure the tank is at the temperature you want it at, hardscape is how you like It, etc.
I didn't mean to break your heart, if it's set on specific fish, you may be able to keep them. It will depend on the water conditions they are used to, and how well they adjust to your water. I just wanted to warn you that it's a bit risky, even for those with lots of experience. If you are just getting started, I would suggest doing what you can to set yourself up for success! Put your dream fish on the For Later Shelf for now

 

Yes you can certainly do platys! Just be sure to get males only, otherwise you will soon have a tank overrun with babies!
Set up your tank and let it run for a couple of days if you like. It will give everything a chance to settle, and you can make sure the tank is at the temperature you want it at, hardscape is how you like It, etc.
I didn't mean to break your heart, if it's set on specific fish, you may be able to keep them. It will depend on the water conditions they are used to, and how well they adjust to your water. I just wanted to warn you that it's a bit risky, even for those with lots of experience. If you are just getting started, I would suggest doing what you can to set yourself up for success! Put your dream fish on the For Later Shelf for now

I had planned to get some pygmy cory and a betta originally. It will probably be a long time before I get get the cories, but it's better than I having them die because they couldn't handle the pH. I was already considering getting some Platys so I will probably get them I had a few a couple years ago, though I had all females not all males. I had a blue mickey who was super cute! Are there any other fish you would recommend with or without platys?

I'm glad to know my tank can run for a bit first! It was super cloudy when I set it up yesterday because of the sand (It cleared up a lot since then but it's still pretty cloudy).

 

You could do guppies (male) with your Platys. They both come in lots of different colours and patterns, so it will look like a colourful, varied stock, even though they are all Platys and guppies. I have a variety of both and they're awesome. Always active and exploring, never shy

 

Endlers would work too!

 

You could do guppies (male) with your Platys. They both come in lots of different colours and patterns, so it will look like a colourful, varied stock, even though they are all Platys and guppies. I have a variety of both and they're awesome. Always active and exploring, never shy

Maybe I will get some guppys to go with platys then. My lfs has some gorgeous guppies. I like endlers too but I don't think I've seen them in store. My lfs my have them but I can't remember. Would Platys be okay if I did a fish-in cycle (as long as I kept the ammonia low enough)?

Would my pH be bad for live plants?

 

Platys are pretty hardy so it should be fine

 

Platys are pretty hardy so it should be fine

Okay, I think I'll end of doing a fish less cycle anyway. Once I get plants, I'll be less tempted to get fish right then

 

I've only ever done fish in cycles and they are not hard at all for me; I didn't even use a test kit for one of them(I wouldn't recommend doing that tho). Bacteria in bottle worked for me, I used the apI one. In my opinion, fish in cycles are better for me. Its more efficient and as long as you do it correctly and you aren't lazy its fine. It really isn't that inhumane, it would only be inhumane if you didn't do anything and let the ammonia, nitrite or nitrate levels rise to high and that's a you problem, not the methods. Overall though, fishless cycles are also really good since you don't risk killing any livestock.

 

I've only ever done fish in cycles and they are not hard at all for me; I didn't even use a test kit for one of them(I wouldn't recommend doing that tho). Bacteria in bottle worked for me, I used the apI one. In my opinion, fish in cycles are better for me. Its more efficient and as long as you do it correctly and you aren't lazy its fine. It really isn't that inhumane, it would only be inhumane if you didn't do anything and let the ammonia, nitrite or nitrate levels rise to high and that's a you problem, not the methods. Overall though, fishless cycles are also really good since you don't risk killing any livestock.

Thank you! I ended up going with a fishless cycle and it finished yesterday I'm hoping to get a few fish today because its the only time I can get to the lfs for at least a week.

 

good job! what fish are you getting?

 

You do need to get something in there fairly quickly to produce ammonia to feed the bacteria. I'd assume there will be some ammonia and nitrite showing up, so test frequently and do water changes if necessary. You'll know pretty quickly if your tank is set up to handle the bioload of the fish you add. If you do have any toxin readings, it should sort itself out in a few days.

 

The benefit is having fish right away instead of waiting. I tried it once as an experiment and did not enjoy it. I have seeded filter material and eventually gave up and just seeded it for the insta cycle. I got tired of testing and water changes Haha

 

The benefit is having fish right away instead of waiting. I tried it once as an experiment and did not enjoy it. I have seeded filter material and eventually gave up and just seeded it for the insta cycle. I got tired of testing and water changes Haha

True, the water changes can get pretty frequent and probably tiring on bigger tanks.

 

I am getting some platys today and maybe a nerite snail! Last I fed fish food was right after the water test yesterday, but it’s all back to zero (except nitrate which are not at 10ppb). I’ll be testing fairly often until I can make sure the parameters are stable.

I’ve done a couple water changes already and boy is it exhausting carrying all that water up and down stairs! Good thing my back is so forgiving lol