Fin rot wont go away(betta splendens

2 weeks ago I noticed my betta got fin rot despite having pristine water conditions(0,0,0) I have had him for a while so im unsure what could have caused it. I treated it with cleam water for a while to no avail then switched to API erythromricin hes been on that for about 3-5 days. Its just not getting better and im starting to run out of ideas on what to do. He now swims with clamped fins, ive never had to deal with fin rot like this in my 5+ years of fish keeping any advice?

 

2 weeks ago I noticed my betta got fin rot despite having pristine water conditions(0,0,0) I have had him for a while so im unsure what could have caused it. I treated it with cleam water for a while to no avail then switched to API erythromricin hes been on that for about 3-5 days. Its just not getting better and im starting to run out of ideas on what to do. He now swims with clamped fins, ive never had to deal with fin rot like this in my 5+ years of fish keeping any advice?

Could you post some pics that show the clamping and the fin damage?

 

If it is fin rot on the tips of the fins, one possible course of treatment is surgical amputation of the affected area. You can capture the fish and use a pair of very sharp scissors to cut away the infected area. Be sure you do not leave any infected tissue. While this seems drastic, the amputated tissue will regenerate over time. While the fish is out of the aquarium, you can also apply a drop of methylene blue directly to the area like you might apply an antiseptic to a cut on your skin.

 

If it is fin rot on the tips of the fins, one possible course of treatment is surgical amputation of the affected area. You can capture the fish and use a pair of very sharp scissors to cut away the infected area. Be sure you do not leave any infected tissue. While this seems drastic, the amputated tissue will regenerate over time. While the fish is out of the aquarium, you can also apply a drop of methylene blue directly to the area like you might apply an antiseptic to a cut on your skin.

Wouldn't I have to sedate him for that? At what point would that be the best course of action? Because he is a short finned betta to begin with so I fear cutting off the infected bit plus I would assume a little extra to make sure it's all gone would leave him with little to no fin left

 

Wouldn't I have to sedate him for that? At what point would that be the best course of action? Because he is a short finned betta to begin with so I fear cutting off the infected bit plus I would assume a little extra to make sure it's all gone would leave him with little to no fin left

Do you think you could fill out the emergency template? It’d help us help you but a clear image of the fish taken from a side profile would be very useful to see. Clamped fins are not typical of fin rot, btw, so there may be more than one issue going on here.

Aquatic Emergency Template | Freshwater Fish Disease and Health Forum

Fin rots can be secondary infections caused by impaired immunity because there is another health issue taking the fish’s energy. If that’s the case, using a little aquarium salt would help him osmoregulate a bit easier and thus save some energy he’d normally use for that, so he can use it to heal.

Though DIY surgery is possibly an option to consider in some circumstance, I would not consider it for fin rot and I’d want to use an anesthetic too.

Personally, I think that about the only time I’d even think about surgery for a fin rot would be, perhaps, if it was one of the thankfully rare cases that I think of as ‘fin melt’ where the infection is moving so fast you can almost see the fin getting smaller in front of your eyes. Those infections need really aggressive treatment, often multiple antibiotics and if you can’t get antibiotics, then maybe surgery would be worth considering.

But even under those circumstances I’d try hydrogen peroxide first, not surgery.

 

peroxide first, not surgery.

What is the water volume of the tank? 10 gallon
How long has the tank been running? 2 years
Does it have a filter? Yes
Does it have a heater? Yes
What is the water temperature? 80
What is the entire stocking of this tank? 1x betta splendis (Please list all fish and inverts.)

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? 2× a month
How much of the water do you change? 25%
What do you use to treat your water? Imagitarium betta conditioner
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Vaccume

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? Yes
What do you use to test the water? Api test kit
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia:0
Nitrite:0
Nitrate:0
pH:7.5

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? Everywhere day
How much do you feed your fish? 4 pellets or 5 flakes
What brand of food do you feed your fish? Omega one and fluval
Do you feed frozen? Yes
Do you feed freeze-dried foods?yes

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? 5ish months
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? 2 weeks ago
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? Fin rot
Have you started any treatment for the illness? Erythromycin,water changes
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? No just ragged fins

Explain your emergency situation in detail.
(Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)
Fin rot for about 2 weeks doesn't seem to be getting better fins were clamped but I realized the heater was unplugged from a water change

 

What is the water volume of the tank? 10 gallon
How long has the tank been running? 2 years
Does it have a filter? Yes
Does it have a heater? Yes
What is the water temperature? 80
What is the entire stocking of this tank? 1x betta splendis (Please list all fish and inverts.)

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? 2× a month
How much of the water do you change? 25%
What do you use to treat your water? Imagitarium betta conditioner
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Vaccume

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? Yes
What do you use to test the water? Api test kit
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia:0
Nitrite:0
Nitrate:0
pH:7.5

How often do you feed your fish? Everywhere day
How much do you feed your fish? 4 pellets or 5 flakes
Do you feed frozen? Yes
Do you feed freeze-dried foods?yes

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? 5ish months
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? 2 weeks ago
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? Fin rot
Have you started any treatment for the illness? Erythromycin,water changes
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? No just ragged fins

Explain your emergency situation in detail.
(Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)
Fin rot for about 2 weeks doesn't seem to be getting better fins were clamped but I realized the heater was unplugged from a water change

You feed 4 pellets or 5 flakes a day? Anything else?

Your fish is too thin and while I am sure your intentions are good, if that’s all that you’re feeding, it amounts to a slow starvation diet, I am very sorry to say. It makes it very difficult for the fish to heal anything if he’s not getting enough calories to maintain boxy condition.

I also think the fish has been biting its tail. Fin rot doesn’t usually show such jagged edges or chunks taken out. He might have some mild infection, maybe, but I think most of the damage has been self inflicted.

I would start by feeding him at least three times a day for the next while and give him a lot more food but in small meals. Frozen bloodworms or tubifex worms would be a good addition to his diet 3x a week for the next few weeks too. The tubifex have more fat which he can use.

I would change half the water every day or every other day for the next week to ten days and that should take care of any infection he may have.

 

Wouldn't I have to sedate him for that? At what point would that be the best course of action? Because he is a short finned betta to begin with so I fear cutting off the infected bit plus I would assume a little extra to make sure it's all gone would leave him with little to no fin left

Trimming the tips of fins is similar to cutting your hair or fingernails. No sedation is required normally. However, if the infection has reached the flesh, then trimming us not advised.

 

Just one thing to add...Erythromycin works on gram positive bacterial infections, but does little to nothing for gram negative, which accounts for the majority of fin rot infections.

I agree with daily water changes. If you don't see regrowth in a couple of weeks, then I would maybe add some aquarium salt for about 2 weeks. Just follow the dosing instructions on the package. And only put back the amount of aquarium salt that may be removed during a change...so if you do a 50% water change, only add back a half of a dose of aquarium salt. The only way to remove aquarium salt from the tank is by water changes.

Hope he gets better soon!!!

 

Trimming the tips of fins is similar to cutting your hair or fingernails. No sedation is required normally. However, if the infection has reached the flesh, then trimming us not advised.

Sedation may not be needed for pain but to keep the fish still, I’d use it anyway. I want both hands and full concentration for the task and so the fish needs to remain still - which it’s not likely to do if it’s awake.

 

Sedation may not be needed for pain but to keep the fish still, I’d use it anyway. I want both hands and full concentration for the task and so the fish needs to remain still - which it’s not likely to do if it’s awake.

The only thing about sedation is that with smaller fish, it is difficult to tell how much sedation is too much. If you have a large fish, sedation is probably going to be needed, but I have snipped away infected fins from small fish with no issue. It is certainly easier than trying to trim the nails of my cat.

 

The only thing about sedation is that with smaller fish, it is difficult to tell how much sedation is too much. If you have a large fish, sedation is probably going to be needed, but I have snipped away infected fins from small fish with no issue. It is certainly easier than trying to trim the nails of my cat.

I can relate to the nail trimming - got 3 cats! And you make a good point about the problem with sedating very small fish. Fortunately for me, I don’t think I’ve ever had a fish with fin rot, so I’ve not had the need. Hopefully I never will.

 

You feed 4 pellets or 5 flakes a day? Anything else?

Your fish is too thin and while I am sure your intentions are good, if that’s all that you’re feeding, it amounts to a slow starvation diet, I am very sorry to say. It makes it very difficult for the fish to heal anything if he’s not getting enough calories to maintain boxy condition.

I also think the fish has been biting its tail. Fin rot doesn’t usually show such jagged edges or chunks taken out. He might have some mild infection, maybe, but I think most of the damage has been self inflicted.

I would start by feeding him at least three times a day for the next while and give him a lot more food but in small meals. Frozen bloodworms or tubifex worms would be a good addition to his diet 3x a week for the next few weeks too. The tubifex have more fat which he can use.

I would change half the water every day or every other day for the next week to ten days and that should take care of any infection he may have.

Is it even possible for a betta being able to nip the back of the ventral or dorsal fin? He's quite chunky hence the smaller food portions it dosent look like in the photo but he's got a big stomach.

 

They can bite thier tales off have a male I caught doing it.

 

They can bite thier tales off have a male I caught doing it.

A big stomach? Can you post another current image showing the fish clearly from a full side profile, please? And yes, if the fins are long enough they can get almost all their tail fin and large chunks of anal and dorsal,

 

A big stomach? Can you post another current image showing the fish clearly from a full side profile, please? And yes, if the fins are long enough they can get almost all their tail fin and large chunks of anal and dorsal,

Sorry for the late response been very busy but here's that pic
I'm going to try upping the water temp from 80 to 85

 

Sorry for the late response been very busy but here's that pic
I'm going to try upping the water temp from 80 to 85

Had the fish just eaten when you took these images? If not, he does appear to have a slightly swollen stomach - not severely so but if it’s like that all the time, that’s not a great sign to see.

Given the shape of the edges on that tail, he’s got to be biting chunks out of it. it doesn’t look infected but it could have some rot - if so, it’s mild. But the bulge in the stomach, unless it only shows up after a meal and then goes away within a few hours, is a concern.

Is he eating well?

 

Had the fish just eaten when you took these images? If not, he does appear to have a slightly swollen stomach - not severely so but if it’s like that all the time, that’s not a great sign to see.

Given the shape of the edges on that tail, he’s got to be biting chunks out of it. it doesn’t look infected but it could have some rot - if so, it’s mild. But the bulge in the stomach, unless it only shows up after a meal and then goes away within a few hours, is a concern.

Is he eating well?

Eats VERY well never any left over food he had eaten a an hour or two before the pic he still has the stomach bulge but not as bad attached pic is him in the morning before feeding. I've never had a betta nip before and only thing that has changed is his filter, what do I do to get him to stop? I applied methylene blue on his tail a week ago and have him a bath in it. I got him over the summer when I was working from home but I'm back working in person now so his schedual is slightly different so I'm not sure if that could cause it?

 

Eats VERY well never any left over food he had eaten a an hour or two before the pic he still has the stomach bulge but not as bad attached pic is him in the morning before feeding. I've never had a betta nip before and only thing that has changed is his filter, what do I do to get him to stop? I applied methylene blue on his tail a week ago and have him a bath in it. I got him over the summer when I was working from home but I'm back working in person now so his schedual is slightly different so I'm not sure if that could cause it?

Fin biting seems to be a behavioural problem but sometimes I wonder if there might also be some genetic factor involved. What tail type was he originally? A popular theory is that the fish with the very large tails, halfmoons, Rosetails etc., are the ones that fin bite, to reduce the drag factor & burden of the huge fins. Plakats (short finned) rarely if ever bite their tail fins.

Once fish start tail biting, there’s no sure way to get them to stop, though we usually advise trying to distract them as much as is possible. Feed live foods that they have to spend time to chase and catch, see if you can teach them some simple tricks, switch up the tank decor regularly to make it more interesting, that kind of thing.

And to discourage fin rot from becoming established, 50% water change 3x a week are also a good idea.

Meth blue is useful if there is fin rot that’s mild to moderate and it’ll show, by the extent of the staining, if any, how much tissue is infected and if it’s getting better too - as it will stain less and less if the area is healing and the stains fade away as cells age and are replaced.

I find it most useful to apply MB directly to the fish, just as it comes from the bottle, no dilution, to see how much, if any, infection there is to start with. It will only stain where there is no slime coat, which is useful unless fish are blue or very dark coloured.

It will also treat a moderately bad fin rot but not the most severe forms, as well as wounds and especially fungal infections, for which MB is truly excellent. I was taught to use MB this way eons ago by a vet and it’s served me and a lot of fish very well over the years.

I’m sorry this guy has started this behaviour but pretty much all we can do is manage it as best we can so they don’t get infected on the bitten edges and the extra water changes go a long way to accomplish that.

As for the stomach - in the new image it looks quite normal. It should look like that within hours of eating always and not keep the bulge ‘til the next meal or next day. Swelling of the stomach that won’t go back to normal is a concern because it can progress to full blown bloat and that’s usually fatal sooner or later.

Just on the off chance he might have a hidden infection that’s causing the stomach to swell, you might consider using an antibiotic laced food for him - something like Kanaplex and maybe combine it with Nitrofurazone, which is a highly effective combination for a lot of nasty infections.

I’m no fan of throwing antibiotics at problems just on the off chance they might help but if this IS a very early indication of an internal infection, the sooner antibiotics are given the better the chance to heal it. Usually by the time people notice this, the swelling is more advanced and the fish has stopped eating and it’s just way too late to do anything.

 

Fin biting seems to be a behavioural problem but sometimes I wonder if there might also be some genetic factor involved. What tail type was he originally? A popular theory is that the fish with the very large tails, halfmoons, Rosetails etc., are the ones that fin bite, to reduce the drag factor & burden of the huge fins. Plakats (short finned) rarely if ever bite their tail fins.

Once fish start tail biting, there’s no sure way to get them to stop, though we usually advise trying to distract them as much as is possible. Feed live foods that they have to spend time to chase and catch, see if you can teach them some simple tricks, switch up the tank decor regularly to make it more interesting, that kind of thing.

And to discourage fin rot from becoming established, 50% water change 3x a week are also a good idea.

Meth blue is useful if there is fin rot that’s mild to moderate and it’ll show, by the extent of the staining, if any, how much tissue is infected and if it’s getting better too - as it will stain less and less if the area is healing and the stains fade away as cells age and are replaced.

I find it most useful to apply MB directly to the fish, just as it comes from the bottle, no dilution, to see how much, if any, infection there is to start with. It will only stain where there is no slime coat, which is useful unless fish are blue or very dark coloured.

It will also treat a moderately bad fin rot but not the most severe forms, as well as wounds and especially fungal infections, for which MB is truly excellent. I was taught to use MB this way eons ago by a vet and it’s served me and a lot of fish very well over the years.

I’m sorry this guy has started this behaviour but pretty much all we can do is manage it as best we can so they don’t get infected on the bitten edges and the extra water changes go a long way to accomplish that.

As for the stomach - in the new image it looks quite normal. It should look like that within hours of eating always and not keep the bulge ‘til the next meal or next day. Swelling of the stomach that won’t go back to normal is a concern because it can progress to full blown bloat and that’s usually fatal sooner or later.

Just on the off chance he might have a hidden infection that’s causing the stomach to swell, you might consider using an antibiotic laced food for him - something like Kanaplex and maybe combine it with Nitrofurazone, which is a highly effective combination for a lot of nasty infections.

I’m no fan of throwing antibiotics at problems just on the off chance they might help but if this IS a very early indication of an internal infection, the sooner antibiotics are given the better the chance to heal it. Usually by the time people notice this, the swelling is more advanced and the fish has stopped eating and it’s just way too late to do anything.

He was a plaket to start with im considering getting some shrimp for him to terrorize and im hoping his offspring don't develop this problem. I will dose w expel P bc thats all I have on hand right now and in my area its very hard to find any fish stores. His stomach usually goes back to normal with in a few hours I just didnt get a chance to take a picture of him until later in the day. Ive breed him once before and would like to bc hes a good dad but im thinking it might be better to retire him?

 

He was a plaket to start with im considering getting some shrimp for him to terrorize and im hoping his offspring don't develop this problem. I will dose w expel P bc thats all I have on hand right now and in my area its very hard to find any fish stores. His stomach usually goes back to normal with in a few hours I just didnt get a chance to take a picture of him until later in the day. Ive breed him once before and would like to bc hes a good dad but im thinking it might be better to retire him?

Might not be a great idea to breed him again, assuming there is some genetic component to tail biting but if he was a Plakat to start with, at least that means there’s not as much of his tail missing as there could be.

If he looked like this but started out as a Halfmoon, that would be much worse in terms of tail biting not that it’s much consolation.

Expel P is just a wormer. The levamisole in it is not going to have any effect on a potential bacterial infection. It shouldn’t hurt him but I’ve never seen the point of using any medication if it’s not necessary.

 

Might not be a great idea to breed him again, assuming there is some genetic component to tail biting but if he was a Plakat to start with, at least that means there’s not as much of his tail missing as there could be.

If he looked like this but started out as a Halfmoon, that would be much worse in terms of tail biting not that it’s much consolation.

Expel P is just a wormer. The levamisole in it is not going to have any effect on a potential bacterial infection. It shouldn’t hurt him but I’ve never seen the point of using any medication if it’s not necessary.

I can check w the breeder just to be safe? It seems to have stopped getting worse the past few days Im going to treat with Expel P just in case