Fin rot +pop eye? Medication/tank questions

Cocobeans008

remember when I mentioned my white bettas tail starting to fray ? Well in the last 3 days he kept getting more and more frayed and clamped fins. He still ate well, eager. And surfing around his tank normally… just not very fast. But I did notice his eyes looking a little bulgier than usual. I think his eyes have always been bulgy since I got him but I thought it was normal and that’s what made him so super cute from a frontal view of his face. Anyway, I started reading about pop eye and it kind of going hand in hand often with fin rot. And since his fin has continually deteriorating and he’s not as fast and lively looking as usual I think he may have pop eye and fin rot. :( immediately 3 days ago I took out all the fake plants and have been doing 1-2 water changes a day of about 50-75% but that wasn’t helping so last night I transferred him into a QT, moved his heater, put a little bit of new larger sized smoother gravel on the bottom and one of his favorite silicone sea anemone floating decorations that we weren’t using in the main tanks at the moment because he likes to rest in it by the surface (rather than it anchored down at the bottom he won’t go near it) and conditioned water with a dose of BettaFix. I acclimated him during the transfer and carefully added him making sure not to stress him out too much. I made sure his temp stayed at 80 deg. Today he doesn’t seem too bad. His fin looks like the deterioration has slowed down and his activity level is a little more active than the last 3 days, still eating well. Still has clamped fins though and kind of “sickly” looking overall coloration. His gills kind of look a tiny bit inflamed and he is staying at the surface a lot just floating around in his anemone. Then taking an occasional lap around the (1 gal) bowl. Just tested the waters and ph is 7.4-7.6 temp 80deg amm nit and nat are 0-0-0. I just bought him some API aquarium salt and was wondering what ur advice is…. Should I add the aquarium salt to his QT tank with a water change? And I did clean his main tank with a 100 percent water change, gravel vacuum, and scrubbed any algae slime off the walls and off the thermometer and air tubing and took out the carbon filter cartridge and turned off the lights, and added 2 small Indian almond leaves to that tank. I’m pretty sure I disrupted whatever stage in the cycle process I was at- which I don’t think it was cycling anyway- due to that back step should I just empty the entire tank and disinfect everything with bleach and restart it all? Or could I just dose the tank with salt and or bettafix as is and keep going? And should I leave my lil guy in the qt tank that is unfiltered without an air stone… or since he’s solo in his main tank should I move him back to main tank and just do the salt and betta fix dosing in the main tank seeing as it’s the same size as qt tank but at least I’ll be able to run his air stone in it.
Last question, I’ve read that betta fix being all natural diluted yea tree oil might not work the best (after I purchased it, smh another mistake on my part) and that maybe I should try an actual antibiotic medication for bacterial infections so I was considering api fin and body cure , api e.r. Erythromycin, or fritz maracyn two. Any thoughts or steering in any helpful direction? Also I read that feeding them frozen brine shrimp, and frozen bloodworm cubes is good for them so going to grab some of those tomorrow for them.
The first 7 photos of him and the tests pic were taken today in the qt tank.. and the last pic of him was 3 months ago when I first brought him home from the store.
 

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Gennasharples

just make sure the water is clean and I would recommend indian almond leaves. boil for 30-60 minutes. let cool. put leaves in the tank and then slowly add the water in which the leaves were boiled in so as to quickly add tannins and stuff to the water. add slowly though as it will lower the ph
 

Rose of Sharon

Hi,

From those pics, I can tell you first, he is so stinkin' cute I can't stand it, and 2nd, he does not have pop eye. His eyes are normal.

I'm also thinking that his tail issues may be caused by his nipping his own fins. White bettas are prone to fin nipping for some reason. If you see him swimming in a sort of tight circle, that is definitely fin nipping behavior. And those injuries can lead to fin rot if the water parameters are not good. When you see chunks missing, that is a good indicator that there is some fin nipping going on.

He's looking a little thin, so adding the frozen foods to his diet would be great.

I do not recommend using bettafix. The tea tree oil can sometimes interfere with their labyrinth organ, and that will affect their breathing. Plus it smells up the tank. I think most new betta parents buy either bettafix or melafix (same thing but stronger) because it's offered in most pet stores, but it never helped any of my bettas and I just didn't want to take the chance of it hurting them. So I would stop using that.

I don't think that you need to start over in the other tank. You gave it a good cleaning, so a good water change, and put him back into his main tank. I would use the aquarium salt and the Indian almond leaves, and do those frequent water changes. Remember to only add back the amount of salt that you take out according to the amount of water that you change. Aquarium salt is only removed by water changes, so you wouldn't want to over dose him.

I think that having an antibiotic on hand is a good idea, even if you end up not using it now. All of the ones that you mentioned are good. If you want only one, then I would go with the API fin and body, then Maracyn 2 would be my 2nd choice.

I think that you are safe with using the low range ph test only. It looks like you have a good 7.5 ph in your source water, so you won't need the high range test.

I hope that I answered all of your questions. Regarding his fin issues (if he really is fin nipping), it is sometimes hard to figure out why they might be nipping their own fins. If he is doing so, then some people have has success with things like rearranging everything often, or trying to actually train the betta a little and teach them tricks of some sort (distracts them).

I hope this helps a bit, and I hope he gets better soon!!! :)
 

Cocobeans008

Hi,

From those pics, I can tell you first, he is so stinkin' cute I can't stand it, and 2nd, he does not have pop eye. His eyes are normal.

I'm also thinking that his tail issues may be caused by his nipping his own fins. White bettas are prone to fin nipping for some reason. If you see him swimming in a sort of tight circle, that is definitely fin nipping behavior. And those injuries can lead to fin rot if the water parameters are not good. When you see chunks missing, that is a good indicator that there is some fin nipping going on.

He's looking a little thin, so adding the frozen foods to his diet would be great.

I do not recommend using bettafix. The tea tree oil can sometimes interfere with their labyrinth organ, and that will affect their breathing. Plus it smells up the tank. I think most new betta parents buy either bettafix or melafix (same thing but stronger) because it's offered in most pet stores, but it never helped any of my bettas and I just didn't want to take the chance of it hurting them. So I would stop using that.

I don't think that you need to start over in the other tank. You gave it a good cleaning, so a good water change, and put him back into his main tank. I would use the aquarium salt and the Indian almond leaves, and do those frequent water changes. Remember to only add back the amount of salt that you take out according to the amount of water that you change. Aquarium salt is only removed by water changes, so you wouldn't want to over dose him.

I think that having an antibiotic on hand is a good idea, even if you end up not using it now. All of the ones that you mentioned are good. If you want only one, then I would go with the API fin and body, then Maracyn 2 would be my 2nd choice.

I think that you are safe with using the low range ph test only. It looks like you have a good 7.5 ph in your source water, so you won't need the high range test.

I hope that I answered all of your questions. Regarding his fin issues (if he really is fin nipping), it is sometimes hard to figure out why they might be nipping their own fins. If he is doing so, then some people have has success with things like rearranging everything often, or trying to actually train the betta a little and teach them tricks of some sort (distracts them).

I hope this helps a bit, and I hope he gets better soon!!! :)
Ugh I love you! You have been such a great help with directional advice, and easing of my worried mind. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate you taking the time to read and reply and offer your (very well educated) knowledge and detailed instructions to help me get through all these new “oh shoot!” Moments of panic lol. I guess there are some genuinely kind people still left in the world…

ok back to my lil guy… isn’t he like adorable!!! I thought I was just a weirdo who thinks some betta faces are so cute I just want to scream lol glad you adore them too :) his personality is funny too he’s normally like the equivalent to what we would consider a good ball or class clown. He’s doin okay still, not too much different or better but seemingly not any worst so that’s a positive step.
Ok so hold off on any further betta fix doses… I’m getting ready to put him back to his main tank…. Which now I’m assuming is uncycled…. Took the carbon filter out, added 2 small Indian almond leaves, has airstone and gravel substrate but no decorations now. The water was conditioned with stress coat plus during water change, I added a few fish pellets yesterday along with a couple drops of quick start in hopes to get the tank to start cycling while my guy is in the qt tank … since the water in his qt tank contains bettafix, salt, and stress coat, I added 50 percent of treated salt water to the main tank so his transition wouldn’t be too drastic. Was that right to do? Or should I not do salt in the main tank at all?
Now that you mentioned it, I looked at his pics from when I got him and his tail isn’t tooooo much different so maybe he has been tail biting. He definately can curve his skinny body in a circle pretty easily and can reach for sure… and yes bits and chunks kept popping up floating in his tank . Now the only mystery is why his color seems so blah when before he was so bright white and rainbow irresdencent shimmery and lively to now a full greyish white and noticeabley thinner. Maybe I’ll up his food intake a tad because I did decrease his feedings to 3-4 pellets twice a day … when I first got him I was feeding him 3 times a day with 5-6 pellets each time lol then I read to not over feed due to SBD and dropsy and fouling the water too quick,
 

Rose of Sharon

I am glad to help! And he is so cute!

Using some of his water from the qt was ok to do. He has already been acclimated to your source water, so it would have been ok to just use all new if you wanted to, as long as the water was temp matched to what he was in before you moved him.

He may be looking a bit dull due to the medication (?), but I still see that beautiful Iridescence. And as bettas age, they do tend to change color a bit. I had a pink go to dull red, a really red boy go to almost orange like red, a dark purple to a redish blue violet color, so that happens to most bettas that are solid colored, and even more for those that have a marbling gene.

It sounds like you are feeding him enough with 3-4 pellets twice a day. Maybe introducing some frozen meaty foods to his diet will help with color and shape - frozen daphnia, blood worms, brine shrimp. I highly recommend the frozen daphnia because it serves 2 purposes - it's a really good high protein option, and it will keep his digestion in tip-top shape. Daphnia acts as a natural laxative, so feeding it a couple of times a week keeps things moving.

I do hope that he gets better soon!!!! :)


Edit: I wanted to mention that there is a supplement called vitachem that's put out by Boyd Enterprises, which is like a vitamin supplement for fish. It smells like orange juice (lol), and you can put it directly in the tank, or soak the betta's food in it. It does help some with over all health and color. Just something for you to ponder in case you are interested.
 

Cocobeans008

Wonderful info thank you:) I just ordered a 4 pack variety of frozen ( not freeze dried) foods by San Francisco Bay which has a mix cube called freshwater frenzy that has daphnia brine shrimp bloodworms and looks like a ton of vitamin supplements, emerald entree which has a bunch of vegetables and supplements, then it comes with bloodworm cubes and brine shrimp cubes also. So that should arrive later today.
Final question then I’ll give ya a break… lol um since I have Indian almond leaves in both main tanks for both bettas… and a little salt/betta fix in the white ones tank… should I keep the filters out since the filters have carbon in them? They are those mini air pump driven aqueon filters with premade disposable cartridges so I can’t customize the media myself. My options are to either put the filter back in or not at all…. I do have an airstone in each tank though currently still. Honestly I don’t really care for the filter setup I chose and would love to get different ones that I can customize the filter media
 

Rose of Sharon

The food sounds good! And he will love it, too...

The filter cartridges won't interfere with the aquarium salt. It's when you dose antibiotics or antifungals or antiparasitic meds that you would have to remove it, if the carbon is still active.

The carbon in each filter cartridge eventually becomes inactive, so it will be there to house the beneficial bacteria. I have a cartridge in a tank that has been running for over a year and a half. It's where a lot of the beneficial bacteria live. I don't throw those away unless they are just falling apart.

I found some cut to fit filter media, and cut a piece that could fit into the small space in my hang on back filter. I also bought a sheet of polishing pad, and I cut some of that and just stuffed it into my filter, lol! Now all of it is full of beneficial bacteria. I don't mess with that unless it is just full of yuck and is stopping the water from flowing through it.

Here's an example of cut to fit filter material. This isn't what I bought, but it's like what I have.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08BK5MCW...jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==


Oh, and after you get 50 posts, you will be able to pm members directly by clicking on the little envelope in the upper righthand corner. It will be ok to contact me that way if you have any specific questions that you would like to ask. :)
 

Cocobeans008

The food sounds good! And he will love it, too...

The filter cartridges won't interfere with the aquarium salt. It's when you dose antibiotics or antifungals or antiparasitic meds that you would have to remove it, if the carbon is still active.

The carbon in each filter cartridge eventually becomes inactive, so it will be there to house the beneficial bacteria. I have a cartridge in a tank that has been running for over a year and a half. It's where a lot of the beneficial bacteria live. I don't throw those away unless they are just falling apart.

I found some cut to fit filter media, and cut a piece that could fit into the small space in my hang on back filter. I also bought a sheet of polishing pad, and I cut some of that and just stuffed it into my filter, lol! Now all of it is full of beneficial bacteria. I don't mess with that unless it is just full of yuck and is stopping the water from flowing through it.

Here's an example of cut to fit filter material. This isn't what I bought, but it's like what I have.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08BK5MCW...jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==


Oh, and after you get 50 posts, you will be able to pm members directly by clicking on the little envelope in the upper righthand corner. It will be ok to contact me that way if you have any specific questions that you would like to ask. :)
Yay thanks! I actually attempted to private message you initially because I knew my questions to you would have a lot of extra dialogue and specifics to what we have talked about in other posts.. but there was not option to PM you yet but hopefully I’ll get there soon since im somewhat active on this site I check it daily and at night when im bored or trying to fall asleep haha

oh dang I had a feeling maybe I should’ve left those disposable cartridge pods in. I already took them out and they’ve completely air dried and ones in the trash already. I have 2 new ones that I just bought so I’ll just have to install and leave those this time. Oh but good news isssss I did happen to keep the foam sponge part that goes around the cartridge in their tanks just free floating around right now and I didn’t rinse them outside their tanks I just kinda swished it around in the tank water and then siphoned out parts of the water that looked like it had little particles of floaties that came off the sponge. Hopefully that kept a little BB still. But on the white fishs sponge foam I moved it into his qt tank with him cuz I wasn’t sure what I was doing yet lol so idk if the salt and betta fix kills any bb but if not then cool I can just move it back to his main tank
 

Rose of Sharon

Salt and betta fix would not kill of any bb that is growing... and you will be at 50 posts before you know it! :)
 

Cocobeans008

Hii!! I just wanted to update you that your advice for everything worked so well!!! My lil guys back in his normal tank and happier than ever and active, coloring came back to a nice, more even opaque white irredescent and his fin looks like the frays are starting to fill in smooth, and his bulgy eyes are not as protruding, (although I think he looked super cute like that haha) and he’s eating great! The frozen worms and shrimp cubes helped his color. Same goes for my red betta his color is super blood red and he seems to have gotten a lot bigger even in just the last week from the new foods and Indian leaves being added. He had a little white fuzz or algae looking thing hanging on the tips of his 2 fins that dangle below his belly and I put 1/4 dosing of betta fix in his tank and it seems to have helped clear that off the fin tips and uncurl them a tiny bit but they are still pretty curled up. They were like that when I got him. Maybe it’s permanent damage from the pet store keeping him in a cup for however long he was in that cup. And I got him a betta leaf hammock thing and I re-scaped both tanks in hopes to keep them busy and not get as bored so hopefully they don’t go back to tail biting. I might get betta hoops for them to play in and swim thru. But I have tons of different tank decor stuff that I’ll just keep swapping around to keep them busy exploring.
Thanks a ton and hope you have a great day :)
 

Rose of Sharon

Great! I'm so glad!!! :emoji_heart:

Good food goes a long way, doesn't it!!!

I hope they stay happy and healthy and that they both have very long lives!!
 

Cocobeans008


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Rose of Sharon

Gorgeous!!!! They both look lovely!!!
 

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