Fantail Goldfish - New Tank Syndrome - Need Help!

On Sunday we were forced to move our two fantail goldfish into a new tank. Their old tank had developed a dangerous hairline crack allll the way across the front. They are five years old and have been stable and happy that whole time.... until Monday. The new tank is 39 gallons. The only fish in it are the 2 fantails. I know i'm not overstocked.

We DID move to a new filter as well b/c we had to replace the machine with one that would work on the new tank and it did not take the same kind of filters so we were unable to keep the bacteria. (the new tank is much larger. they went from a 28 gallon to a 39 gallon)

We were careful with the move and set up. Used bacteria starter etc. Aeration, so on. DESPITE all that we got new tank syndrome and in under a DAY. Our two fantails are named Smith (boy and smaller) and Wesson (girl and larger). They went into the new tank at 8 pm sunday. By five pm monday they were in distress from a high ammonia spike. We got on top of it IMMEDIATELY. Big water change, etc. More aeration ( we added extra aeration) and an aloe slime coat to help them heal, as well as aquarium salt and anything else we could think of. We got the water balanced and it's staying there.

Now it's Wednesday: Here is your update: Our water has been and has stayed perfect. (0 ammonia if you're wondering) We are verifying the levels hourly. Our boy is doing MUCH better and is going to be fine. Our girl, who is larger, got more poison and developed blood in the fins etc.... is touch and go. That's where I need help. Our fish store said she has septicemia developed from the ammonia burns and that's why she's so severe. We are treating her with antibiotics for that and the water is good, the aeration is good, we added aquarium salt as well. She is not getting better. She's not really getting worse either. I've looked everywhere and cannot find a description of how long this process should take, so that's my question:

How do I tell if she's getting better or worse? I mean laying there lethargic looks the same no matter what? I see some lessening of the red in her fins and last night she was holding herself upright (she'd been listing) and had her upper fin out for the first time since the incident. This morning (water still perfect I checked) she was struggling and... it looked like molting? is that her trying to heal or should I worry? our fish guy says the slime coat will cause that? is this true? But this morning she seemed MUCH worse than last night. I thought we'd lost her at first that's how bad she looked. She's still breathing and we JUST started her on the antibiotics for the septicemia. so - what SHOULD healing look like compared to getting worse? How long should I expect it to take for the antibiotics to help? I just can't tell if she's getting better or worse and it's stressing me out!

If there is anything you can think of I haven't tried or done correctly please tell me! i'm desperate. We love these two and they have always been together just them. I'd hate to lose one!

 

Sorry for your problems. I haven't had this issue but I imagine she will start moving more and coming around. If the water parameters are fine now, all you can do is treat and watch. I really doubt the bottled bacteria gave you a cycled tank already. Use Prime as needed and watch the parameters. It could still take 2 -3 weeks to get the tank cycled. Goldfish are pretty tough. What are the nitrites/nitrates? Next time you have an issue like this, if you can't move the entire filter over then just cut out the cycled filter media and stuff it in with the new filter. It will give you an automatic cycle. Keeps us posted, it looks like you are doing all you can.

 

Thank you! Yes we are newish at owning fish (we have only ever owned these two) and underestimated the trauma of a new cycle. We have learned a LOT in the last two days. We use Prime so I know that's handled. we are checking water levels every couple of hours b/c we now know about cycling etc. but the damage was already done to our girl.

Current water levels: as in I just called and had my fiance check right NOW:
Ammonia: 0
Nitrates are currently: 0
Nitrites are currently: 0
PH: 7.2
alkaline: 80 (which needs to be higher)
chlorine: 0
very soft water
current temp: 74 (which is too high and we are working on it) but it's always been that temp. it's hot where we live. Our goldfish have always been between 68 and 75 b/c that's the best we can do in our environment.

We confirmed these numbers three hours ago at the professional fish store as well by taking a sample and having him check it.

We have turned off the filtration for a little bit as of right now in order to put the antibiotics in the tank. fish store guy said to. if this is wrong please TELL ME ASAP.

It's so weird to me. Our girl has always been bigger, stronger, and more outgoing than our boy, but he's fine and she's not. I suppose the larger size means she breathes more and got more poison in her system? Otherwise it makes no sense to me.

 

Out of curiosity, what was the ammonia reading after a few hours in the tank when u say they went into ammonia shock?

 

You don't have to turn the filter off, just remove the carbon. I hate to be bearer of bad news, but the antibiotics are likely to kill any beneficial bacteria you have started. Keep using the prime and doing daily water changes while using the meds. After they are done, put your charcoal back in and let it soak up the meds. THEN add a bottle Tetra Safe Start + (you'll need to wait 24 hrs after using prime). Then keep watching your parameters. After the initial 24 hours, you can use Prime again as needed. You will see the ammonia first, then a number of days later you will see the nitrite. It will go up pretty high and stay there for a couple of weeks sometimes. Continue your partial water changes and Prime. Start also testing for nitrates. When you start getting them you know you are close to being cycled. All of a sudden, one day the nitrites will drop to 0. Once you are getting 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and have nitrates, you are cycled. Then just do about a 75% water change to get nitrates down and you are good to go. You want to keep your nitrates at 5 - 10 if possible. 40 is the absolute limit but don't let them get that high. Continue checking parameters though. Good Luck!

By the way, if you don't already have an API Freshwater test kit, get one. You will need it during the cycling. Strips aren't accurate and you don't want to run to the LFS every day, some times twice a day.

 

Out of curiosity, what was the ammonia reading after a few hours in the tank when u say they went into ammonia shock?

Unfortunately I do not know. We used the last of our conditioner and testers setting up the new tank on sunday. We were going to get more Tuesday after work, but they were in distress when we got home... So I didn't get a good reading until we'd already emergency evaced them and redone the tank. I know I should have tested it before dumping it, but again we were out of testers and it was an emergency. It's very confusing to me b/c it was less than a day which doesn't seem long enough for two three inch fantails to fill it with enough ammonia to cause this, but.... lethargy, bottom of tank, red spots on fins, etc. it LOOKS like ammonia poisoning plus sepsis for our girl. Our boy is doing just great again. totally fine. Our girl though.... it's SO weird. 20 hours in the new tank and she had red in her fins. I honestly don't understand HOW it got that bad that fast.

You don't have to turn the filter off, just remove the carbon. I hate to be bearer of bad news, but the antibiotics are likely to kill any beneficial bacteria you have started. Keep using the prime and doing daily water changes while using the meds. After they are done, put your charcoal back in and let it soak up the meds. THEN add a bottle Tetra Safe Start + (you'll need to wait 24 hrs after using prime). Then keep watching your parameters. After the initial 24 hours, you can use Prime again as needed. You will see the ammonia first, then a number of days later you will see the nitrite. It will go up pretty high and stay there for a couple of weeks sometimes. Continue your partial water changes and Prime. Start also testing for nitrates. When you start getting them you know you are close to being cycled. All of a sudden, one day the nitrites will drop to 0. Once you are getting 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and have nitrates, you are cycled. Then just do about a 75% water change to get nitrates down and you are good to go. You want to keep your nitrates at 5 - 10 if possible. 40 is the absolute limit but don't let them get that high. Continue checking parameters though. Good Luck!

Yes! Our fish guy warned us about the medicine resetting our cycle, but I don't see much choice at this point. If we don't help her she's going to die. The part that baffles me SO much is that it was only 20 hours from going into the new tank to them both being in bad shape. that doesn't seem long enough to me for serious ammonia poisoning, but new tank, new filter, etc. is hard on them so what do I know? I appreciate the advice. She's got the antibiotics in with her now and she's breathing a bit easier which is good. What the fish guy said is they had ammonia poisoning but we caught it. He said our boy recovered no problem, but our girl got septicemia from it So I think now we're battling the septicemia more than anything else. Does this sound like a likely scenario to you?

 

Ammonia poisoning and septicimia go hand in hand. She should be ok. Keep us posted

 

Ammonia poisoning and septicimia go hand in hand. She should be ok. Keep us posted

Well as of this morning she's still alive! She's trying! I keep talking to her and encouraging her. The antibiotics are doing their job I just hope they were fast enough. She's still a bit on her side but seems to be breathing more steadily and easily. we are keeping up the water changes and prime b/c we aren't cycled yet and have to do the antibiotics. (per your instructions) So far so good. water levels are staying even.

last night though right before the antibiotics? - so much red on her! under the fins. by the gills. so much worse. Anyone know how far along is too far along to stop it? I'll try and get pics, but i'm at work. When I left for work yesterday she had red in her tail and that was it. when I got home? red by the gills, under the fins, in all the fins, ugh. Thankfully we'd just gotten the antibiotics and knew what was up but I worry we we're too late anyways. but i'm not giving up and so far neither is she! thanks for all the advice and comfort. I just... these are MY fish and i'm responsible for them and I can't stand that my ignorance hurt them! If it kills them? I don't know what I'll do.

 

We all learn from our mistakes and we have all made them. I don’t understand how the new tank had so much ammonia so quickly and how the fish got affected so fast. Ammonia poisoning normally takes days or weeks to cause such damage. This is a learning experience for me as well.

 

S

We all learn from our mistakes and we have all made them. I don’t understand how the new tank had so much ammonia so quickly and how the fish got affected so fast. Ammonia poisoning normally takes days or weeks to cause such damage. This is a learning experience for me as well.

See that really surprised me too! but we really REALLY did the new tank wrong at first so maybe that's why? I mean new gravel, new filter, new tank. we did it TOTALLY wrong so who knows? **** maybe it was just stress that caused the septicemia? It really does seem too fast to me to have an ammonia spike in a 39 gallon tank with only the two fantails. so maybe it was just the stress we put on them? But yes I'm pretty baffled as well. It's simply moved SO fast. I mean the reactions of the fish say ammonia spike- red in tail, lethargic, on bottom, etc. and once we sorted the water we saw our boy drastically improve. So I can't really see it NOT being that, but yeah i'm pretty baffled as well. At any rate she's hanging in there. Hopefully we got the antibiotics soon enough and the damage is repairable.

 

Keep me posted. I just found one of my black moors with cloudy eye. Time for meds here too. Dang!

 

Keep me posted. I just found one of my black moors with cloudy eye. Time for meds here too. Dang!

Well you keep me posted too then!

 

Absolutely! Read to use Melafix so here we go...

 

Absolutely! Read to use Melafix so here we go...

I don't think she's going to make it.

She looks so much worse than this morning and this is with the antibiotics. She was perfectly fine on Sunday! Should I let her go? I'm afraid she's just in pain at this point.

 

I don't think she's going to make it.

She looks so much worse than this morning and this is with the antibiotics. She was perfectly fine on Sunday! Should I let her go? I'm afraid she's just in pain at this point.

She's gone. She started full out hemorrhaging so we had to let her go. I just don't understand. She was healthy as can be on Sunday. Our boy is FINE. Sad, but fine.

 

She almost looks as though acid has been poured on her. I’m so sorry. You did your very best to save her.

 

She almost looks as though acid has been poured on her. I’m so sorry. You did your very best to save her.

The weirdest thing is our boy is perfectly fine. They both went through the same thing. Shouldn't he also be having issues? But he tossed it off like nothing as soon as we sorted the water. He's always been with the other fish. Do we need to worry about him being alone? He stayed with her til the end.

One more question. None of this would have happened if we hadn't had to change our old tank. It developed a hairline crack across the front over the prior week and it kept spreading... Like a windshield will sometimes. We panicked that it was going to bust and here we are. What in the world would have caused that? Any ideas?

I want to thank you for helping us and being there through this. It's really very appreciated. My wife and I have been learning a lot on this site and we just wanted to say thanks!