Do not overdose flourish excel!

  1. uncclewis

    uncclewis Well Known Member Member

    I followed some advice on a plant forum which went against the bottle of flourish excel.

    I read up a bit more of what it is... It is partly-

    This is a sterilizer and fixative. Therefore, for sensitive fish, there is potentially organ failure... Therefore, while some consider it safe using 2-4x more than is suggested on the label in online forums, in many cases this is likely not safe. Please do not do this!

    Also, I wanted you to see this too, @TexasDomer and CindiL

    this one is more technical, but it has a lot of information on it as a bactericide.

    This ingredient is measured in the workplace to ensure a safe work environment... According to that website. .05ppm was the ceiling limit at one point. This means that was the maximum allowable level. That is extremely low, we are putting more than that in there. I think it is 2% by volume. I won't be using it anymore.
  2. clk89

    clk89 Fishlore VIP Member

    Yeah I have read not to overdose on it myself especially when you have inverts in your tank, and/or fish without scales. I have seen people mention here even some plants don't like a full dose of excel so you have to build up on the dossage slowly to get those specific plants use to it. I'm don't do well with the scientific terminology, but interesting read with what I did understand.
  3. OP

    uncclewis Well Known Member Member

    Well, I did not know :( I think I killed many fish'

    My fish had internal bleeding and multi-organ failure (varied between swim bladder, liver, kidney- all based upon their symptoms these were guesses), stomach perfusion (could be seen visually) and swelling. They were terrible deaths. I used 2-3x the dosage recommended by Seachem.

    I am not alone evidently:

  4. CindiL

    CindiL Fishlore Legend Member

    Did you use 2 to 3 times the recommended initial dose or the recommended daily dose?

    I have used 2 to 3 times the recommended daily dose but have never even felt comfortable using their initial dose as it seems so high. I haven't even been using it all lately as some of my plants did not like it (mostly the java ferns).

    Edit I do know that due to the EPA they can only label it a certain way but at higher doses it is certainly an algaecide.
  5. OP

    uncclewis Well Known Member Member

    I used 2-3x the initial dose, followed by 2-3x daily doses, and 2-3x equal to the dose when making water changes. I nearly always treated WC as initial dosages.

    EDIT: Yeah, I was using it against stag horn, it was working well. But, now it was working toward my fish, and my plants begin wavering too. My wisteria is not as green anymore.
    I only noticed it now that I was looking for it, it is minor. My fish were definitely the first to be affected!!! Other than the algae

    I dont cry a lot but when I saw my fish today, and how bad off they were- and that I might have caused it, I was definitely about in tears.

    This is one of the ones who fared better than others. [​IMG]
  6. j

    jpm995 Well Known Member Member

    Sorry for your loss. I'm always leary of ferts but never had any hard evidence. Thanks fot the info.
  7. CindiL

    CindiL Fishlore Legend Member

    I'm so sorry for your loss, it is awful to do something unintentionally. :console:

    Did you read somewhere you could dose 2-3x the initial dose for algae or something?
    It was probably this dose that did it. I'm wondering if it dropped your ph greatly after that type of dose.

    Have you done a huge water change?
  8. OP

    uncclewis Well Known Member Member

    Yeah, I did 3-4 50% water changes yesterday and some of my fish seem to be picking up (the ones that are still alive). Yeah, I read a lot of forums where people did not have an issues with it. Still, I shouldn't have done that! It was not from fishlore! This makes me realize I need to get my source information from here even more, ha! I did google searches for Excel overdose and it showed me other forums where people said it was just fine to overdose and it killed their algae. I was definitely not one of those.

    EDIT: Im thinking many of those people just didnt update the forum after they have done it for a while because it appears that none of them have explicitly said they did this for an extended period. When I read more on overdose killing fish, I encountered lots of other people killing their fish with it. When I left yesterday for vacation, I removed another dead loach.

    Another UPDATE: OK I returned from vacation (about 5 days later) to see three* less loaches and three less siamese algae eaters, however ALL of my fish are WAY more healthy. Darn Excel will never go in there again. :)
    @CindiL thank you for your support, and you were right, it was definitely seachem excel!