Cycling with gravel from estabished tank: some questions

HI guys and gals.

Am cycling fishless with gravel from my established tank, and have some questions. Care to enlighten me? Here is my setup: 150L (39G) with gravel (new) and water since yesterday. Yesterday, I also added 10 algae wafers (to get the ammonia going) and sprinkled generous amounts of flake food to the new tank. I also sprinkled flake food in the foam part of the filter (it's got 3 compartments: biological, filter foam and what I believe is AC, but not sure). I"d like to use some of the filter media from my established tank, and some of its gravel too, to precipiate things. My established tank is 10G.

Here are my questions:

1/ I rinsed off excess goo (in established tank water) from my established tank yesterday as it was badly due a clean up. The filter pad never really left the water in the process, though. Can I use that recently rinsed sponge to kick in my cycle in the new tank or do I have to wait for it to clog up again?

2/ If I remove the filter pad from my established tank, and replace it with a new one, won't I kick in a minI cycle in that tank? That tank has 2 filter compartments: one biological, and one mechanical (the foam pad I wanted to transfer to the new tank). I recently vaccuumed parts of the gravel in that tank too, and rinsed off the biological filter too (it really was in a state).

3/ How much gravel do I transfer from old tank to new tank?

4/ Where do I put the transferred gravel? The filter intake is quite high up, so no possibility to put it very close to there (unless I pile up lots of stuff and perch the gravel on top...)

5/ How do I take the gravel from my established tank without making the water completely cloudy?

6/ Can I just leave the transferred gravel in a container of its own, or must it be able to 'contaminate' the new gravel?

's about it for now, your expert help is, as ever, appreciated!

 

Woo-hoo! Fun with bacteria!

1) Having just rinsed your filter sponge in tank water will not affect its bacteria colony. You should be able to use it to jump start your new tank.

2) If I understand correctly, your established filter has both a sponge and a cartridge (pad)? If so, you probably have bacteria living on each, and removing 1 temporarily will not necessarily cause a mini-cycle, although it could. Only one way to find out for sure.

3-4) I have not done this, but what I have read is to put a couple of handfuls of established gravel into something pourus, like a stocking, and put it in the tank. This will allow you to easily
retrieve the old gravel when you are done with it in the new tank, but will still allow the bacteria to colonize. I am not sure if location within the tank is overly important...hopefully someone else can speak to that.

5) You don't. Slow, gentle movements should help minimize the problem, and I would expect the water to clear back up again fairly quickly.

6) See 3-4 above.

If you are able to move part of your filter media, I'd love to hear how long your cycle ultimately ends up taking. I suspect it will be quick!

 

he he he. Thanks, SGould. Precious help as ever. I'll let you know how it goes.

 

Great results! I'm glad that worked so quickly for you!

Did pulling the filter media cause any problem readings in the older tank?

 

I actually only took the time to measure the nitrates in the original tank, and these were quite high. I'll measure ammonia/nitrite tomorrow morning out of curiosity. Did a water change today in the original tank, and treating with Prime, so I have some margin for error even if I don't measure until tomorrow morning.

 

Oh dear. I spoke to soon. ;D. This morning, my ammonia was 0.5, as were my nitrates. Ah well, am sure it'll be way quicker than 4 weeks anyway. Keep your fingers (and toes) crossed for me! If we manage to have all our fish in the same tank in a months' time, I can go on holidays with my mind at ease. I just wouldn't trust the fish-sitter to handle 3 different populated tanks.

 

Mmmmm. Not much progress on my fishless cycle: 1 week since fillling the tank and adding the used filter/gravel, and my readings are: 0.5 ammonia, 0.5 nitrites, 50 nitrates. Not much progress thus.

My boyfriend forgot to 'feed the bacteria' every 12 hours when I was away for 3 days (i.e. he added flakes only 1x per day). I figured with the used filter/gravel, it would cycle in, like, 2 days. Ooooh the disappointment.

 

Bummer! I was guessing maybe about a week, but I think it has been about that now.

 

Oh well that's good news. Means am getting there. Yes, it's been about a week. Hurray, not so long to wait. I'll keep my fingers crossed.

 

Don't take it to the bank...it was just a guess! :-\

 

Well, the shorter the guesstimate, the better. Any shorter guesses?

Seriously, I cycle with fish in about 4 weeks, so am hoping that my fishless tricks would take it down to max 10 days, or not that much added value in using old gravel/sponge.

 

Any shorter guesses?

27 more minutes and you should be golden! ;D

 

You looooose (sadly). Wish you were right, SGould!

 

Curses! Foiled again!

 

Even if it didn't save you any time (remember you have to have actually had good bacteria in the media you transfered to actually help speed things along) you will have cycled without fish and a fairly high ammonia level. That means that you can fully stock your fish tank when you are cycled rather then having to add fish 2 or 3 at a time. So no matter what there is a lot of benefit to cycling the way you are rather then with fish.

 

Well am not actually using ammonia, which is surely where I go wrong. I just overfeed the tank.

 

Well am not actually using ammonia, which is surely where I go wrong. I just overfeed the tank.

Same thing really. You are still going to get out of this world ammonia levels in that tank. Much higher then if you cycled with fish where you should never get above 0.5ppm if you can help it (easier said then done of course). So because of those over the top ammonia levels (remember in this case that is a good thing) you will have more then your normal amount of good bacteria in the tank. And when you add fish you will actually have a lower level of ammonia in the tank (even if you fully stock the tank) and some of the good bacteria will actually die off due to lack of food (which is normal, don't panic at that statement ).

 

The thing is, my ammonia levels are wayyyy lower wihtout fish. I've peaked at 0.5 or 1 if I remember well. I'll measure tonight if I have the energy. I've been away for 2 days, so the miracle may have happened.

 

If that is all that you are getting in ammonia readings, then use more food per dosage. You should still see the high readings of 3-5 ppm even when just doing it with food rather then pure ammonia.

 

I'll go buy cheap food then. How much were you thinking for each of my 2 daily doses (it's a 39G tank). I tend to shake the flakes out on the surface for a few seconds.

 

If you are actually shaking the flakes out over the surface then that should be more then enough. It is possible the low reading you are getting is because you seeded the tank. It might be enough in there to eat a part of the ammonia being produced, because with the amount it sounds like you are adding it should be much higher then 0.5ppm by now.

 

Well the thing is I am away 3 days a week, during which I give my b'friend a break and just ask him to put food in there, and not measure. This morning, ammnonia = 0, nitrites = 0, nitrates = 40. I'd jump with joy if I was sure that the ammonia peak was high enough, and that the tank is ready for a bioload higher than 0.5 ammonia.

I could of course assume that the ammonia happened to be high on the days I did not measure, and plomp all my fish in there at once, but I am not confident. I think I'll go to the hardware shop and try to get my hands on some pure ammonia, to really top it.