Cycle Trouble- Bad Quality Tap?

Hey fishlore friends. So I recently got s 10 gallon tank (about a month ago) and I’ve been trying to cycle is without fish. To be honest, I was sold fish the next day (tiger barbs) and they quickly died off. Since then I’ve don't a lot of research to find out I can’t have barbs in a 10 gallon and you cannot just plop fish in the next day the tank must be cycled properly. So that’s what I intend to do. That said, I found out that my tap water has about 2 ppm of ammonia in it (I use the apI liquid test kit). This seems to have worked, along with the few days I had fish to start a cycle. Fast forward a few weeks and I decided to get a bubbler system, new filter cartridges and a tank heater. My levels are as follows: ammonia has been at 1ppm for as long as I’ve been testing. My nitrites were at 2ppm but have since dropped to 1ppm. HERE IS THE PROBLEM- I cannot seem to get the bacteria that converts nitrite to nitrate to flourish. I’m testing between 0-5ppm for nitrate. I’ve tested so many times I’m questioning if there is any nitrate at all. I recently turned my heater up to 86 degrees to try and help. I’ve been using API quick start as well as water conditioner. I did a 1/3 water change last week and am just playing the waiting game. Any suggestions? I do not have any plants either and I occasionally throw some fish food in to keep the ammonia going. (Not sure if I should stop this) oh and I will not be gettin tiger barbs in the future. Tetras and guppies. Maybe a Cory cat. Is there any possibility that the tap water is causing all this delay in nitrogen. Current tank is 1ppm ammonia 1ppm nitrite and 0-5ppm nitrate. Probably zero.

 

If you are using the API test kit...Did you super dooper shake the Nitrate bottle 2 for 30 seconds before adding it? It won't show anything if you don't.

 

If the nitrite dropped, it was converted into nitrate. As Joyo15 said, you have to vigorously shake bottle two before adding it, then shake the test tube with both solutions added to it for one minute, then wait 5 minutes for the color to develop. When you changed all your filter media, you restarted your cycle. 99% of the bacteria live on your filter media. Additionally, never rinse filter media with tap water, chlorine kills the bacteria. One more thing, don’t let the bacteria go without ammonia for more than 24 hours, they’ll starve and die.

 

If you are using the API test kit...Did you super dooper shake the Nitrate bottle 2 for 30 seconds before adding it? It won't show anything if you don't.

Yes I’ve been shaking the heck out of hat thing and banging it on the table too

I changed my filter yesterday and I did rinse it with tap water very quickly. But you think my whole cycle is restarting all over again now? Sigh!

If the nitrite dropped, it was converted into nitrate. As Joyo15 said, you have to vigorously shake bottle two before adding it, then shake the test tube with both solutions added to it for one minute, then wait 5 minutes for the color to develop. When you changed all your filter media, you restarted your cycle. 99% of the bacteria live on your filter media. Additionally, never rinse filter media with tap water, chlorine kills the bacteria. One more thing, don’t let the bacteria go without ammonia for more than 24 hours, they’ll starve and die.

becaus

 

Just a gentle suggestion. A wall of text is really hard to read. Paragraphs are much easier on these tired old eyes of mine.

You are getting some good advice though so I will just follow along and offer help when I can.

 

Yes I’ve been shaking the heck out of hat thing and banging it on the table too

I changed my filter yesterday and I did rinse it with tap water very quickly. But you think my whole cycle is restarting all over again now? Sigh!

becaus

If you changed the filter or washed it under tap water, yes.

 

Update- my ammonia had dropped to.5ppm and the nitrites were between .75-.5ppm and the nitrates seem to be showing a definitive 5ppm.

So— I got some fish a few days ago and PRIME to detoxify any remaining toxic compounds.

Two days later:
Ammonia- 1ppm
Nitrite- 0.5ppm
Nitrate- 5ppm

I lowered the temp to 76 because the tetras were going after each other.

Any suggestions?

If I do a water change it turns out my tap has 2ppm ammonia in it and would make everything worse.

 

You should return those fish and turn the heat up and just fishless cycle.

 

You should return those fish and turn the heat up and just fishless cycle.

I already did that for 3-4 weeks and when the levels where dropping I got the fish

 

You gotta wait until you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and 5-40 nitrates to be cycled. Otherwise you just added too much at once and caused a spike. I just remembered that you washed your filter in tap water too. You’re gunna have to figure out a different source of waterc because you cannot safely keep fish with tap water coming out with 2 ppm of ammonia.

 

So can you give me an example of an alternate way to change the water? I was thinking distilled water but do I need to put minerals back Into that water??

You gotta wait until you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, and 5-40 nitrates to be cycled. Otherwise you just added too much at once and caused a spike. I just remembered that you washed your filter in tap water too. You’re gunna have to figure out a different source of waterc because you cannot safely keep fish with tap water coming out with 2 ppm of ammonia.

 

Update- my ammonia had dropped to.5ppm and the nitrites were between .75-.5ppm and the nitrates seem to be showing a definitive 5ppm.

So— I got some fish a few days ago and PRIME to detoxify any remaining toxic compounds.

Two days later:
Ammonia- 1ppm
Nitrite- 0.5ppm
Nitrate- 5ppm

I lowered the temp to 76 because the tetras were going after each other.

Any suggestions?

If I do a water change it turns out my tap has 2ppm ammonia in it and would make everything worse.

Once cycled the ammonia in your tap water won't be as bad as it can be while doing a fish in cycle. You just need to do smaller water changes. If you do 25% water changes, that ammonia at 2 will be diluted down to .5 and Prime will neutralize that small amount and the cycle will take care of it.

Even though you washed your filter media in tap water and probably killed off some of the bacteria all isn't lost because once you have some living in your tank it will grow back fairly quickly. Bacteria grows on all surfaces of a tank. It is just that the majority of it does live on the media. It is possible that your media now has bacteria back on it.

Now you just have to give it time to grow enough to process the ammonia your new fish are adding constantly. Is it at all possible for you to get water for your water changes somewhere else until this tank finishes its cycle? If you could buy just regular drinking water I feel sure it wouldn't be long until you can go back to using your tap water.

 

Once cycled the ammonia in your tap water won't be as bad as it can be while doing a fish in cycle. You just need to do smaller water changes. If you do 25% water changes, that ammonia at 2 will be diluted down to .5 and Prime will neutralize that small amount and the cycle will take care of it.

Even though you washed your filter media in tap water and probably killed off some of the bacteria all isn't lost because once you have some living in your tank it will grow back fairly quickly. Bacteria grows on all surfaces of a tank. It is just that the majority of it does live on the media. It is possible that your media now has bacteria back on it.

Now you just have to give it time to grow enough to process the ammonia your new fish are adding constantly. Is it at all possible for you to get water for your water changes somewhere else until this tank finishes its cycle? If you could buy just regular drinking water I feel sure it wouldn't be long until you can go back to using your tap water.

Wat if I use spring water from the grocery store. Will that work?

 

Wat if I use spring water from the grocery store. Will that work?

Spring water would work but just plain drinking water would too. You don't want to use distilled water because it has none of the necessary minerals spring or drinking water has.

 

Or you can buy an RO unit and remineralize it.

 

Update***

Did a 40% water change (4 gallons of spring water from the grocery store)

Treated the water with prime and a little extra stress ease conditioner. Will read levels tomorrow.

 

Just use a Prime, not the other too. They both have slime coat replacement in them.

 

Update***

Did a 40% water change (4 gallons of spring water from the grocery store)

Treated the water with prime and a little extra stress ease conditioner. Will read levels tomorrow.

Ammonia 0.5PPM
Nitrite 0.25ppm
Nitrate 5ppm
PH 7.8

Added some PH down but that’s all. Thoughts? Fish are still alive too

I was also told my water is very hard at 150...anyone know about hardness?

 

Please throw the PH Down into the nearest trash can, lol. That stuff is terrible and won’t do a thing to your hardness. Your PH and hardness are fine, as long as they’re stable. Don’t play with them.

 

Another update:

Levels are still the same-
Ammonia 0.5PPM
Nitrite 0.25ppm
Nitrate 5ppm

I have fish in the tank so I am assuming that despite the fixed readings, something is happening to keep the levels the same. If there was no converting bacteria then I believe atleast ammonia or nitrite would spike up. The weird part is that the nitrates haven’t spiked yet

Not sure where I am anymore on this cycle but the fish seem to be doing well aside from one of them hiding from the others in the corner but that’s a territorial ordeal and I’m focused on water right now. Any thoughts??

 

Based on your readings, the tank isn't cycled. Since the water parameters haven't changed, you need to hold in there. What you are looking for is a drop in the ammonia level and rise in Nitrites. This will indicate that the bacteria colony is starting to grow.

Since your tap water has ammonia in it, do very small water changes frequently - like 1 gallon every two days. Since you have ammonia in your water, you will not need to add food just for the cycle. Just feed you fish sparingly.

Most of all keep the filter away from tap water as the chlorine in will kill your bacteria colony. If you do need to rinse the filter, use water out of the tank.

Good luck - and lots of patience......

 

Based on your readings, the tank isn't cycled. Since the water parameters haven't changed, you need to hold in there. What you are looking for is a drop in the ammonia level and rise in Nitrites. This will indicate that the bacteria colony is starting to grow.

Since your tap water has ammonia in it, do very small water changes frequently - like 1 gallon every two days. Since you have ammonia in your water, you will not need to add food just for the cycle. Just feed you fish sparingly.

Most of all keep the filter away from tap water as the chlorine in will kill your bacteria colony. If you do need to rinse the filter, use water out of the tank.

Good luck - and lots of patience......

I did a 10% water change with my tap (has about 2ppm so (.10x2)+(.9x.5)= 0.65ppm ammonia. Used prime to condition the water.

 

My ammonia is still up..between 0.5ppm-1ppm since I did a tap water change.

My nitrites however are a flat 0ppm which means that bacteria is developed.

I’m going to do a 4 gallon water change tomorrow with spring water. I don’t want the ammonia levels higher, I want to lower them while the bacteria colony is developing. I did a tap water change but thinking back I feel it was counter productive...

 

Prime will neutralize that amount of ammonia and it will still be there to feed your cycle. Once your bacteria has grown a good solid colony it will utilize all of the ammonia including the small amount added when using your tap water. Of course in all things you must do what you feel most comfortable doing.

 

Prime will neutralize that amount of ammonia and it will still be there to feed your cycle. Once your bacteria has grown a good solid colony it will utilize all of the ammonia including the small amount added when using your tap water. Of course in all things you must do what you feel most comfortable doing.

Does prime permanently neutralize the ammonia or is it temporary like 24 hours?

 

Does prime permanently neutralize the ammonia or is it temporary like 24 hours?

I just went back and reread your first post in this thread and see that you are doing a fishless cycle. I wouldn't be adding any kind of water conditioner to this tank until the cycle is complete. You will need to condition the water you top it off with when needed but you want to just let the ammonia do its thing. You don't need to neutralize it for the cycle (bacteria) to grow.

When we suggest adding Prime every 24 hours it is to protect the fish from the ammonia....no fish....nothing to protect so no reason for Prime at this time. When fish are in there they are constantly producing ammonia. It is said that the prime keeps working for 24 hours, some folks say 48 but after that its effectiveness is gone so needs to be re-dosed.

 

My ammonia is still up..between 0.5ppm-1ppm since I did a tap water change.

My nitrites however are a flat 0ppm which means that bacteria is developed.

I’m going to do a 4 gallon water change tomorrow with spring water. I don’t want the ammonia levels higher, I want to lower them while the bacteria colony is developing. I did a tap water change but thinking back I feel it was counter productive...

Why are you trying to keep the ammonia level low? If the bacteria colony is building and your nitries have dropped to zero, then don't drop the ammonia level down as the bacteria feed on the ammonia to produce the nitrites.

The fact that you have nitrites at zero level, seems to indicate that you are further down the nitrogen cycle then you think. The second set of bacteria oxidise nitrites to nitrates which seems to be happening in your case as the nitrites are down to zero!

What is your nitrate level? Is it going up? If it above 40, then that should be a good reason to continue doing 10% water changes daily.

 

Why are you trying to keep the ammonia level low? If the bacteria colony is building and your nitries have dropped to zero, then don't drop the ammonia level down as the bacteria feed on the ammonia to produce the nitrites.

The fact that you have nitrites at zero level, seems to indicate that you are further down the nitrogen cycle then you think. The second set of bacteria oxidise nitrites to nitrates which seems to be happening in your case as the nitrites are down to zero!

What is your nitrate level? Is it going up? If it above 40, then that should be a good reason to continue doing 10% water changes daily.

I’m keeping the levels low because there are fish in the tank and I want to also be conscious of that. I did a 4 gallon spring water water change to drop the ammonia while bacteria is still developing.

 

I’m keeping the levels low because there are fish in the tank and I want to also be conscious of that. I did a 4 gallon spring water water change to drop the ammonia while bacteria is still developing.

With you....... I too was under the impression that the cycle is fishless.
I still believe that your cycle is advancing sine the Nitrites dropped to zero. Monitor your nitrates. Are they going up? If so then your ammonia should be going down BEFORE a water change. Are you monitoring the ammonia level before the water change?

 

Alright guys! We did it!!

I did a 4 gallon water change and tested the water 48 hours later.

Water was:
Ammonia-1ppm
Nitrite- traces but close to 0
Nitrate- 5-10ppm

48 hours after water change and addition of two new fish
Ammonia- 0.25ppm
Nitrite- 0 ppm
Nitrate- 5ppm

I will follow up with 0 ammonia to conclude this thread. Thanks to all for the help

 

Well done............ the fact that your nitrates may have dropped slightly is not an issue of your plants are showing growth - i.e. they are increasing in size / volume.

Good job. and show share a pic of your new fish in their new home.