culling deformed fry

Discussion in 'More Freshwater Aquarium Topics' started by ILikeFishies, Dec 8, 2012.

  1. ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    Well, my guppies and platies have given birth several times, and i've seen quite a number of deformed fry, and i've read pretty much everywhere that you should cull the deformed ones :eek: which i find cruel :(. I know guppys are feeder fish too but i would never cull the deformed ones =/. I have many deformed and normals now, and the deformed ones are just as normal in behaviour and everything compared to the non deformed ones. So i was just wondering why people would actually cull them =/. Because my deformed fry look pretty happy and active to me. And i dont find them an eye sore to look at either :O. I just feel that it may be the same as euthanizing any other animal or human just because they are deformed :(.

    do tell me more if i am missing out something :(?
     
  2. Matt B

    Matt BWell Known MemberMember

    I don't keep livebearers but I would imagine it may have something to do with deformed fish continuing to contribute their deformed genes to the breeding program. Personally, I kind of think of it as mercy as well, I feel terrible for the deformed fish in the aquarium trade, including the intentional like balloon fish and fancy goldies
     
  3. tunastrack

    tunastrackWell Known MemberMember

    I think Matt has a great point. I think the culling is more for serious breeders rather than people who are just looking to enjoy watching fish breeding etc. I too do not cull my deformed fish. However I have only had a couple so far.

    they are guppies, I got them from a friend of mine when I very first got my 20 gal back in July. At that time they were just babies. Today they all live in a male only tank (they all turned out to be males) and are the happiest fish I own. They are also the hardiest. They are the only ones who have never once gotten sick or given me reasons to worry.

    If I did notice a fry who was so deformed that I felt it would burden their lives beyond keeping them happy, then I would cull. But if it is something minor I would never.
     




  4. AquariaUK

    AquariaUKValued MemberMember

    It's two main reasons -

    One: If you're breeding professionally or want great fry to sell, you don't want to sell the deformed ones. Also, deformed genes in the pool is a terrible problem if they breed.

    Two: To some people they are an eyesore. I'll be honest - if I had a great tank and my livebearers gave birth I would always pick the normal fry to raise.

    Also, livebearers give birth so often it's easier to cull half the fry than to keep them all. The deformed fry sometimes have problems in later life and some die early.
     
  5. AmazonPassion

    AmazonPassionModeratorModerator Member

    I don't have the heart to cull frys as well. I once had a fry that was born deformed and really couldn't swim but i didn't have to do anything because the adult female endler just went ahead and ate the fry.
     




  6. Rejectedbread87

    Rejectedbread87Valued MemberMember

    I let my tank sort it out, I don't put the fry in the breeder box until 24 hours later. But that helps keep my tank pop low and takes care of the ones that are deformed.
    Culling will keep the deformed traits from passing on and if you don't cull you'll just end up with more and more deformed fry. It seems cruel now but the more you progress, the more heartbreak will follow. That's my opinion.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    oh i see :eek:. Well im not breeding them on purpose or anything, i just let them live their life :eek: but actually, all those fry i got, were from females being already pregnant at the fish store. But alot of the females that gave birth died shortly after giving birth :/...But the ones that survive never had a fry again, just like my 2 female guppies and 1 female platy i got at the store, they all gave birth once, but after that never again (so its quite weird seeing how people say that they can store the sperm in them and have many batches of fry)

    But i actually dont even see the deformity until they get bigger, but by then they all look to happy and active for me to cull them =/. and weirdly enough,compared to the normal ones, the deformed ones are much stronger than the normal ones :O. Like more of my normal ones die out compared to the deformed ones.
     
  8. Jaysee

    JayseeFishlore LegendMember

    Nutrition plays a large roll in fry development.
     
  9. Butterfly

    ButterflyModeratorModerator Member

    How are they deformed?
    If the spine is bent start feeding some veggie flakes or maybe some algae to nibble on. This will get some vitamin c to them.
    early on in my fishkeeping I had the same problem and a more experienced fishkeeper told me to do that for my adults of breeding age and I never had another fry deformed in that way.

    This will not cure the ones already deformed.
    Carol
     
  10. OP
    OP
    ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    oh i see :eek:, i've actually recently bought hikari mini algae wafers, and i have to say that all my fish are loving it, they're like fighting over it o.o. I pop in about 3 every alternate or 2 days, even my betta likes it xD.

    My deformed frys kind of...err have a bent spine, its like S shaped?..but not too curvy, just a little wiggly spine. But despite them being deformed, they actually look pretty, their tails have very strong colours to it.
     
  11. Butterfly

    ButterflyModeratorModerator Member

    Yep that's how mine looked. Many algae wafers are heavy on protein so check yours out.
    They will also pick at softened zucchini as well as algae.
    Carol
     
  12. OP
    OP
    ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    i think i've already mentioned this in earlier posts when someone recommended that i feed my fish zucchini, but not once in my life , in any markets here have i ever seen zucchinis o_O.

    Also, what should i be looking for in my algae wafers? any specific ingredients that are important?
     
  13. Jaysee

    JayseeFishlore LegendMember

    No Malaysian zucchini eh?
     
  14. OP
    OP
    ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    nope D:. I've googled images of them, i've seen some vegetables that look like that but i doubt it is. o.o

    THe hikari mini algae wafers i got consist of fish meal, wheat flour, wheat germ meal, starch, dried seaweed meal, dried bakery product, dehydrated alfalfa meal, alfalfa nutrient concentrate dehydrated, brewers dried yeast, soybean meal, fish oil, krill meal, spirulina, garlic, DL-methione, chlorella, astaxanthin, choline chloride, vitamin E supplement....and well,,theres alot of more LOL but do you think this would be good enough?
     
  15. Butterfly

    ButterflyModeratorModerator Member

    Look at the breakdown of % of proteins and other stuff. that will tell you what it has the most of.

    Do you have Courgette? If so it's the same as zucchini :)
    Carol
     
  16. OP
    OP
    ILikeFishies

    ILikeFishiesValued MemberMember

    hmm it looks familiar, :eek: ill go check it out soon,

    hmm im not sure how to look at all these things but if this is what you're talking about then
    crude protein min 33%, crude fat min 4.0%, crude fiber max 3.0%, moisture max 10%, crude ash 17%, phosphorus 0.8%.
    what am i supposed to look for :eek:, never really knew how to look at food o.o i just buy the normal looking ones,
     
  17. Butterfly

    ButterflyModeratorModerator Member

    That means that 1/3 of the food is protein. They need more veggie type matter in their diet to accomplish what I was talking about.
    carol
     
  18. CichlidnutFishlore VIPMember

    I always keep my livebearers on a high protein diet. At least 45% protein. 33% really isn't that much.

    As for culling, I cull deformed fry. I have large fish they really enjoy them. I do not want deformed fish in my gene pool. In the long run, you are better off culling.
     
  19. Jaysee

    JayseeFishlore LegendMember

    Yeah, I can't say I've seen many foods with less than 33% protein.
     
  20. Butterfly

    ButterflyModeratorModerator Member

    Nope not even the ones with veggie in the title. Thats why I add veggies for all my fish.
    Many of the Livebears come from habitats that has lots of algae present and this is important to their diets still.
    Carol
     




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