Crazy Idea-Betta Pond - Page 14

Alphonsus

Is this the biggest thread besides the ones with pics? LOL. If it is then you, flowingfins are the proud owner of the biggest thread on fishlore.
 

Flowingfins

That's Jaxsco's right, not mine. Their thread was like 100 pages...
 

Jaxsco

Yeah, I own it. Hehe. About 1300 posts :-D
 

thepianoguy

Yeah, I own it. Hehe. About 1300 posts :-D

wow!

that is... pretty... pretty pretty big...lol
 

Jaxsco

Aw shucks! It even has a separate pt. 2 thread going but I wouldn't consider them the same thread since they aren't, well, the same thread even though they're the same topic.
 

thepianoguy

Aw shucks! It even has a separate pt. 2 thread going but I wouldn't consider them the same thread since they aren't, well, the same thread even though they're the same topic.

what are you quite saying? you mean this thread is... what? sorry I don't speak english well.

(ps, the competition is really SUCKS!1 I get like freakin 2nd place for TWICE when supposedly, the mixed up and I am supposely to get FIRST Place! BIGGGG DIFFERENCE!
 

Jaxsco

Basically: the thread got so long I started another one to continue it on so I don't know if you'd consider them one thread.

Are you talking about the photo contest?
 

mg13

are you guys soo
 

Flowingfins

Well, the girlies are in a sorority tank.

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I'm working on getting taller plants.
And....

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A HUGE thanks to Mcasalla for sending me Snow White. She's settling in really well
Here are some pond pics.

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Mcasella

Looks beautiful! I'm so glad she made it so easily - crossing my fingers for you and her lol. She might try and eat the bacopa; she liked nibbling on the cardinal plant I had with her. The ponds look great with the flowers being so pretty!
 

Flowingfins

Thank you, both tanks aren't to my liking, but they're ok for now.
I'm not too worried about her eating the bacopa, I have a ton of it.

One of the lotus bulbs sprouted, can't wait for that to flower!
 

cooneyms

Beautiful photos!!!

Sent from my SM-J320P using Fish Lore Aquarium Fish Forum mobile app
 

Flowingfins

Thanks Cooneyms

I moved The Cow to a small 1.5 so they can see each other(only for a fee minutes a day, they are separated by a piece of paper the rest), excuse the cloudy water, I just set it up.
 

WishyFishy

I just read through this whole thing, and wow! The betta pond is awesome!
 

Flowingfins

Thank you
I just found around 20 betta fry... I need help.
 

Jaxsco

Wow! Hardy betta fry you've got! Just send me your aquarium stuff and I'll take care of it. You're welcome.
 

Flowingfins

Haha, I like my fish, gives me something to do.
From what I can see the babies don't have ventrals, not exactly breeders but I can sell them on here.
 

chloep123


photographer! That will be your job!
 

Mcasella

Thank you
I just found around 20 betta fry... I need help.

I guess they did find each other in the pond then?
 

Five 97

photographer! That will be your job!
Exactly what I was thinking! got ninja'd to it.
 

Tiny goatfish

The pond and bettas look great !
 

Annie424

This has been a fabulous thread, Flowingfins. I'm so glad you had this idea and went with it! You are quite lucky to be able to do this, and I thank you for sharing your experience. I've learned a lot, and seen some beautiful fish and plants to boot.
 

Flowingfins

Thanks guys
I got some new fish today. 2 Florida Flag Fish, 2 female bettas(the sorority girls were getting pretty aggressive so I got them to spread aggression out and because they are pretty) a Mexican dwarf cray, and some ghost shrimp.
 

Annie424

So where's the pics?
 

Flowingfins

When I get home I forgot to add that I got 4 sparkling gourami's. Flag fish are going in my pond, bettas and shrimp in the sorority, and the SG and CPO are going in their own tank.
 

Mom2some

So how big do the baby beta's have to be before they go in the grow out pond? For those of us who are ignorant about bettas, what do you mean that they don't have "ventrals" and therefore "not exactly breeders".
Also - these aren't babies that were born to the bettas in the community pond are they? I am so confused again!
 

Flowingfins

Once they are around 1/2 an inch. They are around 1/4 an inch right now, and with better water and actual food they should go in soon.
Ah, no babies were born in the pond. These were from one of my attempts in a spawn tank, my CT spawn. I didn't see the eggs, so I removed the male and female and was going to try again in a few days so I left the water in. Life got busy and I forgot about the tank, 1 month later I find about 20 babies in there!
Ventrals are the fins that are just behind their head and in front of their analfin. Lack of these fins is a common deformity caused be eating too much of the same food at a young age. Since they don't have these fins, and the trait will be carried off into offspring, they cannot be bred to get "show quality" fish. I could breed them, but it's not worth it. Most breeders would cull any fry without ventrals, but I'm going to raise these guys and see how they do.
 

WishyFishy

Pictures of your new fishies and the betta fry? No rush, I'm just excited to see them lol
 

Flowingfins

Sorry for the wait, I had to acclimatize them.

Here's one of the flag fish


Here are some ghosties






These are the new girls, yellow is having some swim bladder issues I didn't see in the cup

I had to put koi in time out, I saw her rip a chunk out of purple girls tail.


Sparkling gourami's, I have to order a light and filter for their tank.




And here is the cutest crayfish ever!
 

Tiny goatfish

Its too bad the yellow is having problems, she's so pretty! Love the crayfish!
 

chloep123

What size does a crayfish need? It's so cute I may have to get one
 

WishyFishy

Very pretty! I hope the yellow female get better soon

I have a few questions what I hope you won't mind answering. How many tanks do you have, and how long do they take to clean?
 

Flowingfins

Yellow seems to be a bit better today, maybe she was just constipated.

Chloe, the dwarf variety(like Felipe) need a minimum of 5 gallons for one, a 20 long if you are keeping more than one. The larger varieties need a 20 long for each, no tankmates. The dwarf varieties are more peaceful, so you can keep them in small groups snd with small, peaceful fish like sparkling gourami's and ember tetras.

Wishy, those are some good questions lol. 2 ponds, 4 10 gallons, 3 20 gallons, 2 5 gallons, 1 100 gallon... It usually takes the while day since the ponds are so large!
 

Annie424

Lack of these fins is a common deformity caused be eating too much of the same food at a young age. Since they don't have these fins, and the trait will be carried off into offspring, they cannot be bred to get "show quality" fish. I could breed them, but it's not worth it. Most breeders would cull any fry without ventrals, but I'm going to raise these guys and see how they do.

Wow, I did not know about this kind of deformity, and that it was common with bettas. I learn something new here all the time! But I have a question about it - if the lack of ventral fins is caused by a dietary issue when they are fry, it does not sound like it is a genetic issue, but an early environmental development one (i.e. nutrition-lack of variety). If this is the case, how can the trait be carried to any of their offspring? Unless I'm not understanding what you have said, the gene for normal development is there but was turned off due to an environmental issue specific to those fish. That being the case, they should pass on a normal gene to any progeny. Can you offer more details so I can better understand? I applaud your decision to allow them the opportunity to grow and let nature take it's course, knowing in advance that they may or may not make it and that you could have challenges with them down the road that you may not have with a 'normally formed' betta. I imagine once you saw the fry in that 'forgotten' tank you must have been quite surprised!
 

Flowingfins

Essentially yes, the gene was turned off. I read that they pass it on somewhere, I'll have to find it again. I'm guessing certain lines can be more susceptible to missing ventrals though, and the IBC says that if it is now showable, it is not breed able.
 

Annie424

If my understanding of genetics is correct, just because the gene was turned off in a particular individual does not necessarily mean it is turned off for good...the DNA is still there in the fry to pass on. Environment has much, much more to do with what happens than you'd think - whether it's with humans, fish, fowl...whatever. The genome of life is onwards and forwards, we as a race may not totally understand it as yet. If you can find the source you are thinking of, I'd love to read it. Genetics has always fascinated me (I used to be very up on it where budgerigars were concerned as once I had a few clutches many, many years ago I was hooked on it!) and though I may not use the knowledge in practical application nowadays, I am still a science geek at heart. Anything biology-related is intriguing to me! I'm not wanting to necessarily debate anything, it's just my inner geekiness coming out... Do you understand?
 

Jaxsco

Yep, it would mean it's recessive. If you know the genes involved you could make a Punnett Square and calculate the probability of it occurring again. Genetics is a really cool field and very complex.
 

Annie424

Ah man... punnet squares... Now that can be exciting for some of us....and others will just cringe or worse.... But I don't know that it's a recessive gene in play here. I'm still very interested in Flowingfins source material.
 

Aquaphobia

I think you're talking about Epigenetics here and yes, it can be passed on to the offspring...maybe
 

Flowingfins

I'm going through genetics in school right now
I couldn't find the link, sorry Annie
I don't mind punnet squares actually, kind of like a brain teaser!
 

WishyFishy

Genetics are really interesting From what I've read, missing ventrals on fry is caused by bacteria from microworms. But no one seems to know for sure why bettas sometimes end up without them. It would be neat to see some sort of study on missing ventrals.
 

Flowingfins

I might do an experiment on them, I looked through s to n of scientific papers and couldn't find any. Obviously if it led to any deformities or diseases I would stop.

Pond update




 

Annie424

Wow, those photos are just gorgeous! I'll bet it is relaxing sometimes just sitting there and looking at the pond.
 

Flowingfins

Thank you I'm only using the camera on my iPhone 6s, nothing special.

It is, although with all the lilles it can be hard to see them sometimes.
 

Annie424

Some of those flower pics create a very "Zen" moment for me. I have an iPhone 6 too, good photos but not as good as I was expecting. You must have either a very good eye for placement or a steadier hand (or both, LOL!) as you seem to manage to catch not only a moment but a story if you really look at your photos. Thank you, and keep posting them! I find them relaxing at the end of a workday.
 

Flowingfins

Aww thank you
As requested-




 

thepianoguy

ahhhhhhh!!!! so AMAING111 can you post a picture of baby betta?
 

Flowingfins

I have 2 threads on them. AAH! Baby bettas and The Cow X Snow White.

They're so small my camera won't focus.
 

chloep123

Can we start a 'fins photography' thread???
 

WishyFishy

Aw, they are so cute!
 

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