Completely at a loss... please help.

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Asinity

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Well, it looks like Kyler has broken out with finrot... again, for a third time.

In light of trying more aggressive medications, I can't think of anything else I can do. I've given him Fungus Clear, two doses twice. I have kept the tank clean and heated at 78 degrees. I've been conditioning the water with NovAqua+ and have been giving him Vita-Chem daily in the tank, and on his food.

What the heck am I doing wrong with him? Christen is doing very well in her 2 gallon at room temp. without filtration, not sick or anything - just a hungry, hyperactive betta. I'd really rather not keep giving him meds, but what else can I do?
 

chickadee

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The temp is a little cool. It should be 80-82 at least and 50% water changes every day. Try a tank with no gravel or plants or decorations (just water, heater, and airstone and filter) and do a 50% water change (hopefully NovAqua+ conditioner) and VitaChem 2 drops per gallon of tank size per day in the water. Vacuum out all the debris from the bottom daily with the water change ... clean is the key. If you have the slightest amount of nitrate in the water Spring Water from the store would be great. I know I am asking a lot but in a stubborn case things get drastic. This is what is going on at my house right now with Nate so you are not alone, believe me.

Rose
 

Jendayi

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I'm in the same boat as you, Asinity. Cujo was in the middle of a second round of maracyn/maracyn2 for fin rot and his tail shredded while I was eating dinner tonight. I think I am going to just go the immaculate water route, too... It just can't be good for these fish to be constantly medicated, and their water gets so cloudy during the medication period. Cujo has been on meds for almost an entire month.
 
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Asinity

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That's exactly my problem, it's been about 3 weeks with doses of Fungus Clear... I'm sick of it.

I think I will go that route tomorrow and tear everything apart... sucks though because I'm gonna kill off all of the good bacteria in the gravel... but it happens I guess. Could aquarium salt help? I've thought about it but I really don't know... too many mixed thoughts on it.

Granted it's likely obvious, but how do I go about preventing this from occurring again. I'm so sick of seeing my little bud all sick, at least he doesn't seem to notice it. I've got him eating Hikari Bio-Gold pellets, he loves them ever since he was first able to chew one after I softened it... it doesn't even matter now, he crunches loudly every time.
 

chickadee

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I think the idea is nothing at all added to the water but the vitamins and conditioner that contains vitamins or aloe (not Amquel, Amquel+, or Prime; ONLY StressCoat or NovAqua+).

We need to get rid of as many chemicals as possible.

You will still be running your filters so you will have a bacterial bed so even though you do not have the gravel, it will build up again within a week or so after you replace it. You cannot bleach the old gravel but you can wash the heck out of it and wash it some more with dechlored water and let it dry in the sun. and store it until you can replace it.

Rose
 
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COBettaCouple

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Asinity said:
Here's another little question... does activated carbon remove vita-chem?
No, you can leave the carbon in when using vita-chem.
 

genie

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UGH! guys I am in the same boat with everyone else. Cobalt's finrot is back again! He is in the office, so my resources are limited. Will it help to remove all of the gravel and wash it? I am afraid of a mini-cycle.
 

COBettaCouple

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Genie said:
UGH! guys I am in the same boat with everyone else. Cobalt's finrot is back again! He is in the office, so my resources are limited. Will it help to remove all of the gravel and wash it? I am afraid of a mini-cycle.
well Aslan's finrot came back last week too and we have him on trisulfa now and are giving him the vitachem starting today. I don't think you need to do anything with the gravel. i didn't feel like blue water again or messing up the cycled tank plus i wanted to go with a stronger med, so that's why we picked the trisulfa. Best of luck with Cobalt, hopefully we'll all knock out the stuff soon.
 
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Asinity

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Well I've stripped the tank, and have been going about the daily changes with vita-chem and novaqua+. Should I be seeing any kind of result at this point? While a few patches have healed (he had a huge hole in his dorsal which was gone in a couple days) his tail still looks as bad, if not a little worse than it was at the beginning of the week when I started this.

The temperature has been at a steady 82, with the exception of water changes when it drops a couple of degrees. Is there anything I can do to prevent this?

Am I missing anything here? I just feel like there should be some progress on the tail, but it's really not looking great.
 

chickadee

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You know I really hate to be the one that always has to be the bearer of bad news but the fins can take weeks to regenerate. You are doing great to have had the hole heal up. Nate is just now starting to see a little regeneration on some of the raggedy areas but he looks super bad. I am sure he will be in the hospital tank all summer and will not be at all surprised. It is not at all unusual. Patience is the name of the game when it comes to the growth of new fins. This is a vicious and horrible disease and their whole system is disturbed by it. It takes a major amount of work for their systems to regrow their lost tissue. The Vita-Chem and NovAqua+ will make it happen a lot faster so it may not be that long but it is still going to be weeks not days.

Rose
 
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Asinity

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You know, I'm really worried if it takes that length of time. I am moving in a little over 2 months, and the last thing I need is for Kyler to have his fins fall apart again after the move from the stress. Mom's Blue-Boy (Veil Tail) may not be around much longer (he's gotta be at least 3 years old now)... maybe I'll leave Kyler behind for her to eliminate the possible stress of him moving.

I'm also trying to figure out where would be best to put him in the new place, it's not a very big home and my new 21 gallon is getting a nice spot in the living room - my fiance has already put her foot down about bettas in the bedroom (I'll remember this when we have kids, lol) which really just leaves the kitchen or a spot on an end-table. Maybe keeping him behind would be the best course of action, for him.

It would definitely suck leaving him behind though. He and Christen are my partners in crime, the team just wouldn't be complete
 

COBettaCouple

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We're doing the same as you on Aslan's fins and are just going to keep it up along with keeping his water clean and wait for his poor fins to regrow. Rose's advice is so good and we're just going to spoil Aslan and watch those fins grow back in time. He's really full of himself lately, always flaring when he sees me (loves my wife though ) and i laugh to see him full of energy and fire.

Rose has great advice on moving Kyler if it's a long move. I know how i'd hate to leave our little bettas here if we have to move out to Denver but would be concerned for their stress levels also. We wish you the best with Kyler.
 

antisen

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I hope this is reassuring to you... Dory had reoccuring finrot over the past several months, and he was juuuust barely starting to recover when I was forced to move him 4 hours south without my supervision as I had to leave my dorms and was going straight on vacation. Dory took the move amazingly well and when I returned to my parents' house he was looking better than he EVER has since the rot started. I was only gone for a week and there was at least a half-centimeter of growth when I got back, which I was really impressed by. My mom was not treating him with anything but reduced intermittent doses of bettafix... she didn't even change his water at all aside from when she refilled it upon arriving at the house.

I hope the same holds true for you. Also, if you need any info on how I moved him w/o stressing him out, just ask

In the meantime I wish you the very best of luck!
 
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Asinity

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I'm really getting fed up with all of this nonsense. I've been doing faithful daily water changes, giving Kyler daily Vita-Chem and the tank is empty (except heater, filter, air stone and Kyler) and has been at a constant 82. His tail is looking jagged again, and now his caudal fin has what looks to be the beginning of rot on the tips. Even the tips of his ventrals are looking a little rough. What's worse, he seems to have some kind of lesion on the top of his head, I noticed it two days ago and it's a little bigger now - it looks more like a scrape than anything.

I am getting very, very discouraged with all of these problems Kyler is having.

Christen on the other hand is doing ridiculously well, and she seems to have a liking for Kyler, she's always watching him from her tank which is about a foot away from his.

Is it possible that a tank/filter can cause these kinds of issues? I'm just thinking that because this 5.5 gallon has always been a death trap for fish it seems. Years ago when I was running this tank, all of my tetras that I ever had in it died off. The only thing that seems to live in it for any length of time are Goldfish and the two Swordtails I had way back. Can there be some kind of link, or am I just not doing something right here.
 

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You know, I'm starting to wonder this myself. I've talked about my previous Betta in previous posts who I housed in a 1 gallon vase (and after the marbles it was probably only a 1/2 gallon). It never had a heater or filter and I changed the vase water once a week, but sometimes went much longer, and he was never ever sick. When I was treating Spartacus in that same vase he healed fast and was perfect, until I put him back in the 5 gallon.

I'm starting to wonder if heaters and filtration are actually bad for Bettas? It sure seems like it.
 
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Asinity

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Hmm... What might be the problem is that betta's kept in those cups are ultimately stuck in that phase, and are used to a smaller space without any current nor heat. If this has something to do with it, I don't know but it's something I'm considering now.

Christen is in a 2 gallon tank, without all of the extras and has always been a happy fish without all the extras. I am tempted to buy Kyler a 2 gallon of his own, and let him live like Christen does and see how it goes. I read your other post Eskielvr, and I find it funny that both of us have the same situation where the fish kept in the smaller tank without all the extras lives without problems. My Mom's Blue Boy, and all of my past Betta's lived in bowls for years, and Christen seems to be following their trend, where Kyler seems doomed to the same fate as Atlantis if this keeps up.

By no means am I saying that bettas are absolutely better off living in unfiltered, unheated water (and I hope that I'm not stepping on anyone's toes here), but there definitely seems to be exceptions. I would rather have a betta that is living disease free in a smaller tank without the extras, than have a guy getting all this extra stuff and is not getting any noticeable benefits from them - and is constantly being the subject of medicines.
 

COBettaCouple

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There is a connection between the breeding practices (inbreeding, etc.) and the time spent at the petstore being fed as they are. I think most of the time when you bring a fish home, you bring home a fish with an illness or problem and possibly genetic weaknesses. I think what Bettas need most is consistent conditions and low-stress. Finding the right balance between ignoring the fish and breathing for it is what to shoot for. Sometimes a betta will live years in the same conditions that kill another inside of a week.

How often do you change the water? and is the filter flow low enough to do the job, but not too heavy for the betta? look for things outside of their aquatic environment that could cause them stress as well.
 
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Asinity

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The filter is set to a good flow that Kyler can handle easily, on my AquaClear it is set to about 50%, so that shouldn't be an issue.

That is definitely a big problem, the inconsistencies in breeding and handling, and that there is no set guideline for people to follow, which in turn leads to these kinds of problems. Where one Betta will thrive when given a nice big, clean, warm tank when the next guy will lead a happier life in one gallon of standing water with. Tthese problems inevitably cause problems for us, because when a problem arises, there are so many different ways to go with advice given from store clerks, to fellow enthusiasts - be that advice good or bad, we subject our fish to all sorts of different stresses in search for curing one problem, which can cause other problems in the process. This leads to a vicious cycle which will either kill our friends, or leave them suffering while we jumble the massive amount of information trying to figure out which will suit our unique betta.

We always say that our Betta's are unique, what we seem to often miss is that the problems they can have are just as unique as they are - which is truly sad because that often leaves them in situations like this where they are almost in limbo waiting for us to help them and us not knowing where exactly to begin.
 

antisen

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How do you perform your water changes? Since you do them so often, perhaps that is somehow stressful to him.
 
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