Clown Loaches - ich infested

froglover1982

We recently decided to move our evil Gourami into a tank in the hall becasue we can't add anything in with her. I decided to go with Clown Loaches and for the first time ever have found out what "ich" is. The question I have is more about the snails in the tank. We have raised the temperature, currently at 82 degrees and slowly added aquarium salt to aid in the recovery of the clowns. I read that the salt would kill the sails so I put them in the quarantine tank, how should I treat them? I wasn't sure if they could get "ich" and don't want to reintroduce them to the bigger tank if they have it.
 

AlyeskaGirl

You can raise the temp to 84 for two weeks. Just a reminder that loaches are scaless fish so be careful using salt. Do water changes with good gravel vacs to pickup any spores.

As for the snails I have no clue, hopefully someone will be along to answer that question.
 

Amanda

The snails don't carry ich themselves, but the water they have on them can carry the spores.
 

Butterfly

Hope you don't mind I moved your thread from the saltwater section to the Clown Loach section in freshwater. You will get more appropriate answers here.
Clown Loaches are notorious for getting ICH. The slightest chill, over stressed, less than pristine water quality. Loaches don't appreciate salt or most other ICH meds . The easiest way to treat loaches of any kind for ICH is to raise the water temp to 82F(good job) leave it for 14 days, do frequent large water changes(warm water has less oxygen so need more water changes) and substrate vacuums(to clean up dead ICH). This will see your loaches in good shape.
On another note, clown Loaches get really large and seven in a 75 gallon will get too crowded soon. Clown Loaches are wonderful and interesting fish. Here is some good information and some cute pictures too

Carol
 

froglover1982

Thank you all for the posts, I have been watching my clown all day and appear to be acting normal, I have been doing water changes along with subtrate vacuuming, keeping my fingers crossed. The salt I have added thus far hasn't appeared to cause any stress on them. It's like the more I research the more different answers I get. The salt was actually recommended by someone with clown and said the medications are more harmfull to them than the salt. I'll continue the water changes and vacumming along with the higher temp, hope this does the trick. Thanks again!
Thanks Carol for moving my thread, I'll get the hang of this someday .
 

Iron waffle

Most medications are not loach friendly as they are scaleless, thus exposing them to the chemicals rather than just he ich being exposed. same for the salt. I believe the best way to get rid of ich is to raise the temp to no more than 84* for a few weeks and water changes until the ich is gone, it works every time
 

Butterfly

Thanks Carol for moving my thread, I'll get the hang of this someday .
No problem
Beautiful clowns by the way salt tends to be an irritant but if you haven't added much it may not affect them although I personally wouldn't add any more. Keep us posted on how they do.
carol
 

froglover1982

My babies appear to be doing good this morning. Maggie and Nemo, the biggest one and the smallest one are doing their usual swim around together. I plan to do another subtrate vacuum and water change in a few. At this time my question is the temperature. I read not to leave it up for more than 10 days, most of the people on the forum say 2 weeks. Will the added 4 days make that big of a difference?
 

Butterfly

It won't hurt a bit to leave it up. It takes 14 days for ICH to go through all it's stages and die. The extra four days are needed, if you still see any remaining spots after the 14 days the temps need to stay up a couple more days. As long as the water is being oxygenated they will be fine. In fact the link I gave you on Clown Loaches says their preferred temps are 78-83F . Six of the people on the site collaborated on a book about Loaches . These people really know their loaches.
Carol
 

froglover1982

Thanks again. I went to the link and it appears that most of the books have a link to order however the one created by people in the forum does not. Where can I buy it?

To add, before raising the temp I added two bubble stones to assist in oxygen, which I heard they needed due to the raise in temp. Every now and then you see them diving into the bubbles, likes it's a carnival ride .
 

Butterfly

Thanks again. I went to the link and it appears that most of the books have a link to order however the one created by people in the forum does not. Where can I buy it?
You can get it from Amazon.com or your local book store will order it for you.
Carol
 

froglover1982

I found it on amazon. It's amaizing how much I've learned after getting these guys. I researched for about a month before, guess I should have come here first . Thanks again!
 

Butterfly

I found it on amazon. It's amaizing how much I've learned after getting these guys. I researched for about a month before, guess I should have come here first . Thanks again!
There is so much conflicting information out there that it's hard to know what to do I trust this site implicitly in their advice on Loaches of any kind, have for years and never gone wrong.
Clowns are wonderful, We had our for four years when we moved and lost them. They were 7 & 8 inches, my husband called them puppies because they would always come to the top and wiggle for food whenever they saw me
Carol
 

froglover1982

Sad to say I've lost 3 of my loaches, 4 left. It looks like 3 of the 4 have ich. The temp has been up for about 4 days now. Is there anything else I can do? My dragon goby and angles all appear to be ok, but my clown are loosing their battle . The temp is at 84 degrees. Should I go with medication?
 

Butterfly

Sad to say I've lost 3 of my loaches, 4 left. It looks like 3 of the 4 have ich. The temp has been up for about 4 days now. Is there anything else I can do? My dragon goby and angles all appear to be ok, but my clown are loosing their battle . The temp is at 84 degrees. Should I go with medication?
Sorry you lost the clowns. I personally wouldn't add the meds but you have to do what you think is best. Are you still doing daily/frequent water changes? The oxygen content needs to stay up.ICH is one of those thing clowns are so suseptible to and it can be really rough on them. Keep us posted.
Carol
 

froglover1982

I've been doing daily water changes, and subtrate vacuuming. I have two stones, one at each end of the tank, with a 4' tank, should I add more? I also lowered the water level to add more splash from the filteration system, supposed to add more oxygen as well. I also turned my sweeper upward, another added help,so I read. I also ordered the book,mention above, but not sure it will get here in time. I guess I'm at the mursy of those pesty little parasites, for now.
 

Amanda

Aw, sorry to hear about your loaches.
Unfortunatly, ICH is a hard disease to rid of. I had a pretty bad case of it in 2 tanks of mine.
Good luck!
 

Butterfly

Sounds like your doing all you can do.
Carol
 

eiginh

HI All,

My dad's Oscar past away a after years of taking care of him . He was a mean guy but a fish is always a good companion. Anyways to keep my dad occupied he bought 3 red fin tin foil barbs and I decided to add more and bought 3 clown loach, 3 bala sharks and 2 common plecos in a 50 gallon tank. I just started noticing that 2 of the loaches have ich and I'm scared the other fish might get it too (one severely covered and the other half as bad). The tank has a really old 100 watt water heater but I do not know the temp. it is giving, so I will replace it with a 200 Visi-Therm stealth heater today. I told my dad to vacuum the tank everyday and do a %20 water change since he only vacuums once every week or two. I am thinking about buying aquarium salt or pickling salt today to help the Ich outbreak but I am not sure if it is safe with the other fish and I read so many articles debating to use salt as it might not be great with scaleless fish. I'm also avoiding meds, I'm trying to fight it off naturally. Idk the water parameters but I will be ordering a test kit soon. If you have better advices please post. Any help is greatly appreciated.
 

Amanda

Welcome!
Loaches don't do well with salt.
Raise the temp to 82 - 84* for 2 weeks, doing daily vacuuming.
Also, once this is under control, I would think about returning most of the fish, they all get too large for a 50 gal. tank.
 

midnightwolf

first of all your tank is way over stocked but you can take care of that later. the best thing to do is to first separate the fish with ich from the healthy ones and if you want to treat it naturally I would bring up the temp to about 85*F and make 25% WC every couple of days. good luck with your fish and welcome to fishlore. ;D oh yea try to get the API freshwater master test kit.
 

eiginh

Thank you!

I was thinking it was a bit over stocked for a small tank...though they are about 1-1.5" each except the common plecos they're a bit larger. Is it still possible to keep them for awhile until they outgrow the tank? I would hate to give away any of them except the common plecos b/c they don't really do anything except eat leftovers and wander about during night...
 

midnightwolf

you don't have to get rid of them just get another tank or a larger one to replace it.
 

Amanda

Keeping them in a small tank will stunt their growth & is painful for the fish.
IS it possible to get a larger tank?
 

eiginh

No, we don't have enough space in our apt. otherwise I would. I guess I'll give back the bala sharks and the plecos. Would the tank be big enough for the 3 clowns and the 3 tinfoil barbs until they outgrow their tank?
 

midnightwolf

it might be but I'm not sure...
 

Butterfly

tinfoil Barbs get to 14 inches
clown Loaches can get to 14 inches or larger
bals sharks can get to15 inches
Common Plecos get 10-14 inches
everything in that tank will out grow it in a very short time.
Carol
 

mr. Clown Loach

correction butterfly but clown loaches only get an average of about8-9in because the largest clown loach in captivity is Marge and she's 11.5in and the easiest way to get rid of ich is to just turn the temperature up I didn't even changed the water I just cranked it up and waited.
 

Butterfly

correction butterfly but clown loaches only get an average of about8-9in because the largest clown loach in captivity is Marge and she's 11.5in
I respectfully disagree with you. Loaches get very large given optimum water parameters and space to grow. Marge was 11.5 inches when that picture was taken in 2005. isn't she beautiful?
Here is a profile with tank requirements written by people who have kept these huge fish and know what their talking about. clown loach click on the pics at the bottom and see the other large Clowns
the easiest way to get rid of ich is to just turn the temperature up I didn't even changed the water I just cranked it up and waited.
Clown Loaches are ICH magnets. The least chill and they come down with ICH. You are correct raising the temps up is the easiest way to get rid of ICH. Leaving it up is the easiest way to keep them from getting it again.
I'm glad not changing the water while treating ICH worked for you but it usually doesn't because more frequent water changes helps keep the oxygen level up since warmer water contains less oxygen. More frequent substrate vacuums during the time of raised temps will help get rid of the ICH in the tank.
Carol
 

mr. Clown Loach

I thought marge died like last year.
 

Butterfly

thanks for letting me Hijack for a minute
I thought marge died like last year.
It's possible but I couldn't find anything at Loaches
I'll keep my eyes/ears open
Couldn't find anything so I asked Here is the reply

Carol
 

eiginh

tinfoil Barbs get to 14 inches
clown Loaches can get to 14 inches or larger
bals sharks can get to15 inches
Common Plecos get 10-14 inches
everything in that tank will out grow it in a very short time.
Carol

I read bala sharks and red fin tin foil barbs grow quick but clown loaches may take awhile...The clown loaches are pretty entertaining to look at. I would like to keep them as long as possible. The plecos I will post on craigslist for whomever wants it for free. I seriously thought they would be cool fish. I don't know why my Dad bought the tin foil barbs, b/c he told me he didn't want anymore carnivores after the oscar we had...

I feel really bad for one of the clown loaches, he hasn't come out for awhile and there's Ich all over him but I bought a new heater and set it at 80* Ill turn the dial to 82 tomorrow. Oh and I almost thought it died when it was sleeping upside down the other day, that frightened me. Haha I forgot how silly these fish can be sometimes...Ill turn the dial to 82 tomorrow. I also bought a new filter system Tetra Whisper ex70, I haven't done research on it but it's filtration system looked awesome.

Thanks for the help from all of you, My dad and I really appreciate it.
 

eiginh

HELP!!! I'm really worried the loach with the really bad ich looks like he is getting worse. He is active but his gills look bad, it's not red but looks very uncolored. I read warming the tank may take up to a week or two to kill it but when will I start seeing health improvements? I also set the heater to 84* today.
 

platy ben

The clown loach may have ich so bad that nothing can saveI t now, just keep your temperature up .
I read bala sharks and red fin tin foil barbs grow quick but clown loaches may take awhile...The clown loaches are pretty entertaining to look at. I would like to keep them as long as possible. The plecos I will post on craigslist for whomever wants it for free. I seriously thought they would be cool fish. I don't know why my Dad bought the tin foil barbs, b/c he told me he didn't want anymore carnivores after the oscar we had...
The clown loaches do grow very slowly but as they grow their internal organs will still become cramped.
Il be honest, if it were me I would re-home everything and start again.
 

eiginh

Yeah, sounds like a great plan. I bought most of the fish for my dad as a birthday gift but he may want to keep the tinfoil barbs. I will try to convince him to rehome all of them since the tank is too small. Now I need to research what are good fish for a 50 gallon.

Poor fish...

Thanks for all the help everyone.
 

midnightwolf

I'm sorry but it really is the only way, you could get some cories or a few weather loaches. if you have questions about stocking just let us know.
 

eiginh

Rip

the clown has past away...

I also got my test lab today, the readings are in my profile.
 

pepetj

So sorry... 've been following this thread since you post it.

Your nitrites readings suggest you have a mini-cycle. A well established tank reads nitrites (and ammonia) as zero, regardless when you measure. Hope you can post results for the other parameters as well.

You can take care of that by performing partial daily water changes. I hope you enjoy maintenance (I do enjoy it, no hostility implied in this comment) and solve the problems you might have down the line.

Pepe
Santo Domingo
 

bettafish2816

i'm sorry you lost your loach
 

midnightwolf

I'm so sorry, its easy to fall attached to them...
 

mr. Clown Loach

you just lost the best fish in the world
 

eiginh

So sorry... 've been following this thread since you post it.

Your nitrites readings suggest you have a mini-cycle. A well established tank reads nitrites (and ammonia) as zero, regardless when you measure. Hope you can post results for the other parameters as well.

You can take care of that by performing partial daily water changes. I hope you enjoy maintenance (I do enjoy it, no hostility implied in this comment) and solve the problems you might have down the line.

Pepe
Santo Domingo

I remeasured the tank and it is 40 gallons not 50, please excuse my mistake.

I tested the ammonia level last night and it read to zero, I will test it again tomorrow in case if it's different.

My dad does the water changes every Saturday morning or two, he also hasn't bought a new filter media for ages but he just rinses it in tap water...I am waiting for my emperor 400 to be delivered and hopefully that will make the water conditions better. When I do change the filter, I can just take out the old and put in the new right? (dumb question, but I'm not sure )

Off topic, I am planning on keeping the tinfoil barbs and the clown loachs, I will probably give a pleco away and try to exchange my 3 bala sharks for a couple of clown loachs. I also want to add plants to the tank, what do you guys recommend?

I will try to take some photos this weekend to get a clear definition of what my tank looks.

Thank you guys, all the posts are highly appreciated.
 

mr. Clown Loach

if you add plants put alrge stones around them as they do like to dig alot, and if you buy a new filter leave the other one on with it and maybe after a while then take it off so it could cycle
 

eiginh

Here are pics of our fish and a somewhat set up tank. Planning on to add some plants soon.
 

midnightwolf

that's a nice tank and I can see why you would thuink its not over stocked but those fish are gonna get big. congrats on finding them new homes
 

zowie717

I do not see a question here but if you have ich I have done several things and I recommend raising the tempurature, and treating with aquarium salt. that worked the best for me. you also need to understand how ich grows. when you can see it, it is already has been in your tank. by rasing the tempurature you can help kill of the ich that is in your tank and also the salt helps in treating too. there is a great article on here for treating ich with this method. I will see if I can find it. I tried all the other methods of using lfs medication and it ended up killing most of my fish. you can also remove your fish to a quaritine tank and they raise your tempurate for a week to a higher level to treat the tank and kill off any remaining ich in your tank and you can watch your fish before you put them back in your main tank. also I believe that clown loaches are suspectible to ich. any recent stress or new additions to the tank?
 

Aquarist

Good morning Zowie. You've just about hit the nail on the head so to speak. If 1 fish in your tank has ICH then you need to treat the entire tank. It's too late for quarantine at this point for this disease. Raise the temperature to 85 degrees and leave it there for a period of two weeks. Vacuum the substrate to remove spores that have fallen from the fish and into the gravel. Some people use salt and some do not. I would wait at least 1 week after treatment, with the fish being asymptomatic before adding any additional fish. Add additional air supply because warmer water needs more oxygen.
Have a GREAT JULY 4th! Stay safe.
 

Lucy

Looks like his post got messed up in the forum glitch last night.
I think I remember the post and had replied to it.

If I remember correctly, the OP was going to treat the ich with raised temps.
84F for at least 2 weeks, increasing aeration, frequent water changes and thorough gravel vac.

He was wanting confirmation on this type of treatment for ich
 

Saxobone

thanks guys I'm crossin my fingers
 

Butterfly

thanks guys I'm crossin my fingers
Let us know how they are doing
Carol
 

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