Chytrid? Idk what this is and im worried

Kjelli

Member
So I got off work and looked into my tank at my adfs and see white stuff on them im not sure what it is. If anyone knows or have any advice it would be greatly appreciated. Each picture is a different frog.
 
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Kjelli

Member
Okay im going to buy a api t test kit now so when I get home ill fill it out
 
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Kjelli

Member
Tank
What is the water volume of the tank? 10 gallons
How long has the tank been running? 2 or 3 months
Does it have a filter? Yes
Does it have a heater? Yes
What is the water temperature? 76
What is the entire stocking of this tank? (Please list all fish and inverts.) 1 betta, 3 bronze corydoras, 4 adfs

Maintenance
How often do you change the water? Once a week
How much of the water do you change? 25 percent
What do you use to treat your water? Prime by seachem
Do you vacuum the substrate or just the water? Vacuum the substrate

*Parameters - Very Important
Did you cycle your tank before adding fish? No
What do you use to test the water? Api master kit
What are your parameters? We need to know the exact numbers, not just “fine” or “safe”.
Ammonia: 8.0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
pH: 8.2

Feeding
How often do you feed your fish? Twice a day for the betta and once a day for the corydoras and then once a day for the adfs
How much do you feed your fish? I give the adfs a small block of the Hikari mysis shrimp, the corydoras 2 wafers of the corywafers by tetra pro and the betta gets a light tap of fluval bug bites betta formula
What brand of food do you feed your fish? Hikari, tetra pro, fluval
Do you feed frozen or freeze-dried foods? Frozen for the adfs

Illness & Symptoms
How long have you had this fish? I've had the betta since before I had the tank and I got the adfs and corydoras after I got the tank like right after.
How long ago did you first notice these symptoms? Yesterday
In a few words, can you explain the symptoms? White spots on the adfs
Have you started any treatment for the illness? No because I dont know what it is
Was your fish physically ill or injured upon purchase? No not that I know of
How has its behavior and appearance changed, if at all? The white spots on the back as shown in the pictures

Explain your emergency situation in detail. (Please give a clear explanation of what is going on, include details from the beginning of the illness leading up to now)
so yesterday I noticed the white spots on all their backs and got worried and posted here. I didnt know about cycling tanks till after I bought the tank and researched through you guys on what to do and then I learned about cycling the tank and felt like a bad fish mom because I had no clue before I bought the tank. So I've been doing water changes weekly at 25% and I had bought the tetra master kit dip sticks and it would say the ammonia was between safe and stress or .5 and 1.0 and so I would do a water change. But I was questioning and unsure about the accuracy of the tests so instead I went and bought the api liquid tests last night to make sure everything was correct and within correct parameters. And thats when I found out that the ammonia is skyrocketed so I just did a massive waterchange of 75 % at least. And idk if I should do another ammonia check now or wait
Im also currently cycling a 29 gallon i bought so I can move all the fish and leave the adfs species only and after I get that done and buy another 10 gallon or 5 gallon for a quarantine tank. Im also questioning if I should move the adfs when I move the rest to do a full cycle on the 10 gallon they are currently in. Unfortunately I got all the corydoras and adfs from martins pawmart and they didn't tell me about any of this. They actually told me I didn't even have to have a filter or heater for them so I was so confused when I realized that all this was wrong. And now I'm just trying to fix all my mistakes and make this right. Im also working on getting more filter media to get all the stages for the 29 gallon and get that same type of filter for the ten gallon tank
I actually think that the 10 gallon tank i got on the 19th of January but im not 100% sure. Im just trying to think back
So I just checked the ammonia again and the color is not quite dark enough for 2 but not quite light enough for 1 do I need to do another water change
 

Alejandro

Member
Chytrid doesn't appear as spots or aggregate in clusters. Usually you can't see anything other than excess shedding of skin that might have a slight tea stained colour as opposed to the usual clear-whitish of shed frog skin.

It's very unlikely to be chytrid or if it is, it's not alone and there are multiple processes at work.

I'd get your ammonia under control quickly as it's clearly an issue in your list above.
 
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Kjelli

Member
I've been doing water changes a lot more frequently now and thank you. Their sheds haven't looked tea colored at all so that's a blessing
 

Alejandro

Member
Kjelli said:
I've been doing water changes a lot more frequently now and thank you. Their sheds haven't looked tea colored at all so that's a blessing
Ok great if you've seen improvemts with lots of water changes and reduced ammonia they may have been experiencing ammonia toxicity. If they are well they will hopefully recover fully.
 

Fisch

Member
To bring your Ammonia under control you and go through the fish in cycle, you may want to do daily water changes at this time.
This will keep your fish stress free until your bb is able to convert your Ammonia and Nitrite.
 
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Kjelli

Member
Thank you guys. Another question I have now is one of my frogs has got a huge belly that just happened in the past day or two. Idk whats going on is it dropsy? Is she pregnant? Btw they just ate but I can show my other frogs in comparison
 
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Lucy

Moderator
Member
How is your frog looking today? There could be a few reasons for a big belly.
It's not unusual for a frog's belly to bulge a bit after they eat. It could be a reaction to poor water conditions (even after it's corrected).
Could be female. Fems tend to be a bit chunkier than males.
 
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Kjelli

Member
How do you sex the frogs? And it looks like the frog is back to normal now aside from the white spots
 

Alejandro

Member
I just noticed you have fish with your frogs

I'm not sure how many others are in the tank but be aware fish can pick at frogs when they are not active and even small injuries can lead to infections.

I'm not saying frogs are weak - they have very good immune systems and specially evolved repair capabilities but if they are stressed like us their Immune functions can be operating at reduced levels - increased damage from overstocked fish can become a problem.

By overstocked im not talking tank capacity as discussed here - but consider wild density of fish and frogs and what bumps, nips and other stress factors are increased in a tank. By this consideration almost all tanks are overstocked relative to the wild that why we use filters and other techniques to change the effective biological size of the tank rather than the actual tank size.

Some work I did with tadpoles long ago showed they grew quicker when left alone. I tapped on certain tanks each time I walked past to see they were ok if they were good they'd skittle everywhere (escape response). I found my tapping tanks grew slower and follow up study showed the more time spent escaping the less time feeding as each occasion caused them to stop feeding, waste a bunch of energy racing around, then wait a while to be sure danger was gone then slowly and carefully go back to nervous feeding so for each disturbance they wasted some energy on flight response then missed time feeding. The undisturbed ones didn't waste energy fleeing and just kept feedimg

While frogs and fish don't spend as much time eating as tadpoles as they are often finished growing and the have higher quality food the principle of stress from disturbance is the same.
 
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Kjelli

Member
Im working on cycling a 29 gallon to move my other fish to and im cycling this tank as well in the process. So that I can get the frogs to be a species only
 

Alejandro

Member
Kjelli said:
Im working on cycling a 29 gallon to move my other fish to and im cycling this tank as well in the process. So that I can get the frogs to be a species only
That's great for the frogs but I wasn't trying to stop you having mixed species I just wanted everyone to think about some of the issues I've seen when they decide to have either mixed species or even one species at increased density

There are advantages too - but I think they are well discussed in this forum so I didn't focus on them
 
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Lucy

Moderator
Member
Kjelli said:
How do you sex the frogs? And it looks like the frog is back to normal now aside from the white spots
Mature males will have a whitish bump under the arms. The females will be broader and plumper looking. They often (not alway) has a tiny bit of what would have been their tail

488-jpg.jpg

(Please excuse the blue gravel and fake plant. haha, This picture was taken a long time ago.)
 
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Kjelli

Member
I believe I have both genders but I will try to sex them tomorrow. And honestly the corydoras keep to themselves and the betta kinda watches over all from the top of the tank occasionally checking everyone out here and there but doesn't try to nip anymore
 

Bking21

Member
Kjelli said:
So I got off work and looked into my tank at my adfs and see white stuff on them im not sure what it is. If anyone knows or have any advice it would be greatly appreciated. Each picture is a different frog.
I’m currently having this same problem. Both of my ADF’s have those white bumps. Did you ever figure out what caused it and what I can do to help?
4F5F0567-2CA8-4A64-B6EE-F98871B902C7.jpeg

DDC9F4FB-CEEA-433F-9101-BA75DAA1262E.jpeg
 
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Kjelli

Member
I have no clue what has caused it im wondering if it's like an ammonia burn. What are your levels?
Bking21
 

Alejandro

Member
I.havent worked directly with pipids but I've seen lots in the wild, zoos and labs.

Many aquatic frogs can cause their skin to become rough to increase surface area for oxygen uptake in low oxygen water. I can't see from the images but this doesn't immediately look like a pathologic process. It superficially looks like natural skin granulation that frogs commonly change with circumstances

Can you get closer images

Otherwise unless there are other factors you are concerned about it may not be an issue needing treatment.
 
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Kjelli

Member
These were my pictures at the beginning of my thread
Sorry I tried to quote and it didn't work
 

Alejandro

Member
Kjelli said:
These were my pictures at the beginning of my thread
Sorry I tried to quote and it didn't work
It's still hard to see enough detail but that doesn't look like abnormal skin - many species have that granular skin and can alternate between that and smooth

While I'm just a frog biologist not a pipid expert - if there are no other concerning symptoms or factors I wouldn't worry about those spots.
 
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Kjelli

Member
Okay thank you. The one that was bloated up did pass away a few days ago and I was really sad to see it go but I got all my frogs and fish over to my newly cycled 29 gallon and they all seem a lot happier and im now getting the full cycle going on what will be the frogs permanent home
 
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Kjelli

Member
So im pretty sure this incident is chytrid. I fed my frogs and noticed I was missing one and moved their hide and found this one. I instantly moved him to the quarantine tank so maybe the other frogs don't get it but maybe they already did... he's hanging out at the top too
 

Alejandro

Member
More or better photos would help

While that looks like a fungus it doesn't look like chytrid. Chytrid doesn't grow hyphae extending out from the skin like that.

If you have any fungal treatments you could try - most frogs are ok with most aquarium antifungal drugs. Just check what you have and search online if it's ok for frogs.

Also this has been going on for a while and the symptoms are varied and may not be the same for each frog.. again unlikely to be chytrid as if you had chytrid in a tank of susceptible frogs they would all get sick and die very quickly.
 
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Lucy

Moderator
Member
Poor thing, I agree, not chytrid. Chytrid doesn't show like a fuzzy fungus.
Has it taken over his arm? Maroxy is adf safe but I don't know if it's available any longer. Maracyn Oxy is another choice but sadly from experience once things have progressed that point it's hard to bring them back.
 
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Kjelli

Member
He ended up passing away that night. I had moved him to another tank and then he passed. What can I do for all the other frogs to verify that they don't have anything as a preventative measure
 

Alejandro

Member
How many frogs are left - do any have any unusual symptoms or behaviour?

Do you have capacity to isolate and treat them - are they by themselves?
 
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Lucy

Moderator
Member
I'm so sorry kjelli

Alejandro could this have been a bacterial infection with the fungal infection as a secondary issue?
Otherwise a fungal infection like that could have been from an open wound which kjelli didn't mention.
 

Alejandro

Member
Lucy said:
I'm so sorry kjelli

Alejandro could this have been a bacterial infection with the fungal infection as a secondary issue?
Otherwise a fungal infection like that could have been from an open wound which kjelli didn't mention.
Yes - sick frogs (or any animals) rarely die from one thing. Usually they have a problem and lots of otherwise harmless microbes that would normally be fought off by the immune system jump on board. That just makes the job harder for the frog.

I've only ever seen one fruiting fungi like that that killed a frog and it was a terrestrial frog with the hyphae right through it's system then the fruit came out it's back.

Yes also an injury - even minor and other stress that may suppress the frogs immune function would get infected.

There seems to be multiple things going on here - frogs had different symptoms and died some time apart. My best guess is there is a problem underneath it all and what we are seeing is symptoms of opportunistic pathogens that may be different for each frog.

Attention to all water issues first (ammonia especially - maybe copper ) - temperature and other stressors like fish could contribute.
 
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Kjelli

Member
So the frogs are all in their own tank now. The one that got sick had gotten that way after I moved them all from the 29 gal community into the 10 gal just for them and 2 snails. There are 5 frogs left. And give me a bit to give you readings on the copper and ammonia and all other parameters
 

Alejandro

Member
I think the important thing is to be looking out for anything that might be causing an issue - problems with tap water, use of chemicals in the house, materials used that may be toxic - we are likely looking for some stress that lowers their immune system .

Leave lights off or low - maybe even part cover the sides to give them darker conditions they will feel more secure.
 
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Kjelli

Member
So I have the lights on a 9.5 hour window with the white and rbg for the plants (wisteria) Then blue lights for an hour or 2 after that to signal normally feeding time and moonlight. The only other thing I could think of that stressed them out would be moving tanks. But they all seem pretty happy now. They sing for me every night now
 

Alejandro

Member
Ok that's great if they are behaving well.

Maybe you will never know why you had the problem - if it doesn't return it's not really an issue that you didn't find the cause.

Good luck - glad they are calling and appear well.
 
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Kjelli

Member
So I just looked into my tank today its water change day. And im going to pick up an extra bucket or 2 to make life easier but I noticed this on one of the frogs. And I'm assuming he got bit in the face when they ate last night idk but should I treat with the maracyn oxy or something else?
And is this the maracyn oxy you were talking about
 
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Lucy

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Member
Yes, that's the stuff.
It's supposed to be good for bacterial and fungal infections.
I see the red spot you're talking about under the eye but is that fungus on the top of it's head?
 
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Kjelli

Member
It seemed to grow overnight and yea I just moved him to the hospital tank and am treating him with the maracyn oxy
 
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Lucy

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Member
Poor little guy. Good luck and keep us posted.
It's hard when they get sick
 
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Kjelli

Member
It really is. I'm just so confused on what I'm doing wrong
 

Kjirsti

Member
Kjelli said:
So I got off work and looked into my tank at my adfs and see white stuff on them im not sure what it is. If anyone knows or have any advice it would be greatly appreciated. Each picture is a different frog.
This does not look like a fungal infection. My frog died from one a few months back and it looked more like he was growing a white mold or like he had a qtip cotton on him. These are just bumps that I think all frogs have and they can be more or less visible in certain lights and situations. Good for you for being attentive though!
 

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