Child Proof Fish

WinterSoldier.

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bryangar said:
You must have read it on a parody page or something. Not that i’ve eaten an orange in the bathtub, that’s just the most random thing i’ve heard.
Its called a blue law. In kentucky you can't carry an ice cream cone in your back pocket because it was a horse thieves trick. And kentucky has tons of horses
 

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Francine said:
I once read that in some state (I think it was California) that it’s illegal to eat an orange in a bathtub lol you wonder where they come up with some of this stuff but the goldfish this I get... should I be illegal I don’t think so but my point was just to prove that they shouldn’t live singly lol
I’m guessing someone choked on an orange while enjoying a bath. People overreacted and now—illegal. I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s how it started.

WinterSoldier. said:
I know this is going to sound terrible. But please don't get him a tank. I work with mental disabled people and I wouldn't give fish to them. Fish are delicate, and I wouldn't intentionally put them in a 'child proof' situation. Please think of the poor fish.
I think he can do whatever he wants for his son. If the kid wants and enjoys fish, I see no issue given the right precautions. Of course, precautions fail, as the original post has shown. But I don’t think your logic works, regardless. Fish can be in danger from kids, whether they’re mentally disabled or not.
 

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Re: the fake tank idea that was brought up - it made me think of the robot fish I would see advertised as a kid. I looked them up on amazon, they’re still around and seem reasonably priced.
 

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goldengirls said:
Re: the fake tank idea that was brought up - it made me think of the robot fish I would see advertised as a kid. I looked them up on amazon, they’re still around and seem reasonably priced.
Posted those earlier, the HexBug fish.
 

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fastraver said:
Thank size is going to be 5 to 9 gallon. Was thinking along the lines of guppies, Platys, and Danios. Could do Molly's.
If you do live bearers, make sure you only do 1 gender or the other. Unplanned litters will wreck tank water quickly and their deaths would probably be very hard on the children.

If you want to do a molly, you'll only be able to do 1 even in a 9 gallon. Mollies are tough fish but they do best in 1's or 3's and 9 gallons is really too small for even 3 male black mollies due to their waste production and swimming room. Male black mollies grow to about 2.5 to 3 inches so they can be kept singly in 5 to 9 as long as you have really good filtration. If you go with any other gender or type of molly, you'll want to go with a 9 gallon because the female black mollies grow to about 3 inches akd the black mollies are the smallest species. The silver females grow to about 3.5 inches and a dalmation female can grow to at least 4 inches and up to 5 so a dalmation is not a good choice for a small tank even if kept alone. But a silver male or female can be kept in a 9 gallon alone.

Good luck with the new tank
 

WinterSoldier.

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scarface said:
I’m guessing someone choked on an orange while enjoying a bath. People overreacted and now—illegal. I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s how it started.


I think he can do whatever he wants for his son. If the kid wants and enjoys fish, I see no issue given the right precautions. Of course, precautions fail, as the original post has shown. But I don’t think your logic works, regardless. Fish can be in danger from kids, whether they’re mentally disabled or not.
Yes I know he can do what he wants, but mentally disabled people don't understand that fishies don't like cookies, or not to touch something, regular children can grasp that, I just think that its a bad idea
 

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WinterSoldier. said:
Yes I know he can do what he wants, but mentally disabled people don't understand that fishies don't like cookies, or not to touch something, regular children can grasp that, I just think that its a bad idea
I don’t know. I remember doing some pretty stupid things as a kid, “helpful things.” I suppose it depends on the child’s age.

Having a small group of enlders and shrimp can’t be that terrible.
 

Fahn

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scarface said:
I don’t know. I remember doing some pretty stupid things as a kid, “helpful things.” I suppose it depends on the child’s age.

Having a small group of enlders and shrimp can’t be that terrible.
Until your child decides the fish and shrimp would like a cookie
 

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scarface said:
Hey, don’t judge me. I saw you suggest wild discus
Did I say that? Oh, I'm sorry...

I meant SS-grade pure-red-line crystal shrimp.
 
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fastraver

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WinterSoldier. said:
I know this is going to sound terrible. But please don't get him a tank. I work with mental disabled people and I wouldn't give fish to them. Fish are delicate, and I wouldn't intentionally put them in a 'child proof' situation. Please think of the poor fish.
It is not terrible. It is the truth. I have thought it. The reason I was going to try hardy fish. He likes horses, cats,dogs and such. He is pretty good with his service dog.
 

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fastraver said:
Due the movie and a thorn in my side, Finding Nemo. Gold fish are an out. I have a toad in a 20 long and he has no interest in it what so ever. As per wife, lack of water.

Never had a frog before. Might look into that.

I have had Danios, and they did survive as dither fish in my cichlid tank. But the point of the swimming a lot is very true.

I think neon tetras or guppies. That might work.
Neon tetras might be better suited for a 20 in a school. White Cloud Mountain Minnow are tiny fish that you can school in a 10 gallon. As for guppies, they will reproduce a lot for a 10 gallon, and all males will likely fight in a 10 gallon.

In my opinion, a single betta in a 5 gallon, with maybe a snail or some shrimp is the way to go.
 
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fastraver

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If I get live bearers. The off spring goes into my treat farm for my Cichlids. Oh they love the little treats I send them.

But the Hexbug is pretty freaking cool. I think the wife will like that idea more. Due to no heater, filter and if he drops a cookie in there. It is all good.

Also it does not need to be secured.
 

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WinterSoldier. said:
Yes I know he can do what he wants, but mentally disabled people don't understand that fishies don't like cookies, or not to touch something, regular children can grasp that, I just think that its a bad idea
I do think that is an AWFUL comment... I started out as a DSW for years and I now have my doctorate in psychology...

To deprive a mentally disabled child of having a fish or frog when there are NUMEROUS solutions to prevent the fish/frog/whatever from being harmed is awful to say!!

As I mentioned there are so so many ways that’s this can be done safely.... get a betta and a 5 gallon tank... build a shelf up higher for the stand so that he can’t just put stuff in but can still see the fish.... simple... and problem solved....
Most men who are “handy” would be able to rig up a lid that locks or that he can not open..or again even reach but still see.... there is absolutely NO reason in my professional opinion why this child can not have a fish....
 

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Francine said:
I do think that is an AWFUL comment... I started out as a DSW for years and I now have my doctorate in psychology...

To deprive a mentally disabled child of having a fish or frog when there are NUMEROUS solutions to prevent the fish/frog/whatever from being harmed is awful to say!!

As I mentioned there are so so many ways that’s this can be done safely.... get a betta and a 5 gallon tank... build a shelf up higher for the stand so that he can’t just put stuff in but can still see the fish.... simple... and problem solved....
Most men who are “handy” would be able to rig up a lid that locks or that he can not open..or again even reach but still see.... there is absolutely NO reason in my professional opinion why this child can not have a fish....
Think about it this way though...

Start the kid off with the HexBug Fish. They do not need to be fed, need no filter, heater, or weekly water changes. They are impossible to kill. Because there is no learning curve, mistakes can be made without the issue of dead fish and more maintenance.

Use them as a teaching tool to build good habits and practices. Let him understand through mock-behaviors and practice how to feed and care for real fish. Maybe introduce hardware such as a filter eventually to build upon these concepts.

Once good habits are established, introduce a hardy, easy fish as a first real fish, such as guppies or a betta.

This isn't insulting anyone's intelligence. This isn't belittling a child with a disability. It is a real solution to helping a child take steps towards being on equal footing with the rest of the crowd as far as our hobby goes. I would honestly recommend this to any parent wanting to introduce fish-keeping to a very young or disabled child.
 

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Twinkle said:
You aren't supposed to have frogs with a kid under five due to salmonella risks.
They never said their childs age nor did they say he was 5 or under.


Handelma said:
Neon tetras might be better suited for a 20 in a school. White Cloud Mountain Minnow are tiny fish that you can school in a 10 gallon. As for guppies, they will reproduce a lot for a 10 gallon, and all males will likely fight in a 10 gallon.

In my opinion, a single betta in a 5 gallon, with maybe a snail or some shrimp is the way to go.
I wouldn't go woth a betta, they're not as hardy as some of the other fish, and aren't as cheap to replace if something does go wrong.

I was also thinking about a handful of ghost shrimp because others mentioned shrimps.
Mine are really active and swim around like crazy.

They sell minnows and guppies and danios as feeder fish sometimes, you might be able to get your hand on some neon tetras as feeders even.
Otherwise neons will be cheapest next to ghost shrimp.

The hex bug is also a good idea.

He has a doggy?!?! I miss my service dog.

I also want to say, when I was a child I had really bad aspergers autism, I would take things that weren't mine, do all sprts of crazy things.
To recount my past and my pet keeping accidents, here's some things to keep in mind.

I used to try to release then catch neighbors birds/dogs/rabbits, I wasn't allowed these animals so other people owning them meant I was going to do what I want with them.
I used to try to keep fish, turtles, frogs, bird eggs, and other creatures like lizards snakes and bugs.
I used to try to hatch chicken eggs we bought from the store, I would warm them up in my bed under a big stuffed animal.
My neighbor had a goldfish pond that I loved!
One day I stole some of his fishfood and a fish....
I caught his goldfish, put it in a 1 gallon tub and tried to care for it.
What a horrendous sight...
I left the goldfish outside my tree and frontdoor knowing my family wouldn't let me keep it or give it a pond.
Big mistake, it was summer, the smaller the container of water, the higher it heats.
So even though the fish was in water in the shade, the water still got well over 80+ and ended up killing it. So I had a pet goldfish for a week before it died.
I used to catch frogs and try to feed them caught grasshoppers, that didn't work at all.
I used to feed spiders, which did work and I still feed them lol
My friends had mice and so did my borther, my friends used to put their mice out in the pool and let them swim, so I thought my brothers mouse could swim too.
I decided it was dirty and needed a bath....
Soapy water in a bucket, 0 mice later...

Now I'm no longer diagnosed as autistic, but I still have aspergers and social issues, there's a lot of things we have to learn a lot slower than the gen. population.
We have to deal with our tormented heads before we learn right from wrong. There's so much going on inside the mind of thr troubled...
But if you have someone help them, guide them, show them the right thing to do, they learn.
No one showed me how to care for the pets, and since no one let me help, I helped on my own.
When kids and adults like that are asled to help, they get really excited.
No one asks them for any kind of help usually.
It's very important for them to learn, even if they are learning the hard way.

Perhaps you could even reward him.
For each bugfish he keeps alive, he could get a real one.
But only if he feeds them right everyday, and helps you out with something.

While I was working at my store, a boy came in and had a fit... It was so sad. Everyone around him had no idea what to do, the younger workers who have never dealt with anything like him before just followed him... I'm sure it was frightening to be followed while having an outburst.
Luckily I was quick and thought of a distraction. I ran across the store, grabbed a sample cookie and showed it to him.
I kinda waved it and asked if he wanted a cookie.
He went from screaming acrying to whispering cookie so fast.... No one knew what happened, they just knew he became quiet.
He quickly learned, if he sees me and behaves when he does, then he gets a cookie.
If he's screaming and runs past me, no cookie til he stops screaming.

I feel if you teach and reward your son, it could help him a lot with responsibility. Especially if he has no job or chores around the house.
And in my honest opinion, getting fish for him is better than any other small alternative animal that he could take out and play with.
As we've seen by my post, rodents are a good one to stay away from.

I would say lizards and frogs are too since they have the ability of being held in the hand, which may make him want to touch them and grab them.

Fish we watch and feed, that's it.

Let us know what you go with! I hope he learns to care for his new pet well!
I love that you're doing this for him.
 

Bryangar

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Crazycoryfishlady said:
They never said their childs age nor did they say he was 5 or under.




I wouldn't go woth a betta, they're not as hardy as some of the other fish, and aren't as cheap to replace if something does go wrong.

I was also thinking about a handful of ghost shrimp because others mentioned shrimps.
Mine are really active and swim around like crazy.

They sell minnows and guppies and danios as feeder fish sometimes, you might be able to get your hand on some neon tetras as feeders even.
Otherwise neons will be cheapest next to ghost shrimp.

The hex bug is also a good idea.

He has a doggy?!?! I miss my service dog.

I also want to say, when I was a child I had really bad aspergers autism, I would take things that weren't mine, do all sprts of crazy things.
To recount my past and my pet keeping accidents, here's some things to keep in mind.

I used to try to release then catch neighbors birds/dogs/rabbits, I wasn't allowed these animals so other people owning them meant I was going to do what I want with them.
I used to try to keep fish, turtles, frogs, bird eggs, and other creatures like lizards snakes and bugs.
I used to try to hatch chicken eggs we bought from the store, I would warm them up in my bed under a big stuffed animal.
My neighbor had a goldfish pond that I loved!
One day I stole some of his fishfood and a fish....
I caught his goldfish, put it in a 1 gallon tub and tried to care for it.
What a horrendous sight...
I left the goldfish outside my tree and frontdoor knowing my family wouldn't let me keep it or give it a pond.
Big mistake, it was summer, the smaller the container of water, the higher it heats.
So even though the fish was in water in the shade, the water still got well over 80+ and ended up killing it. So I had a pet goldfish for a week before it died.
I used to catch frogs and try to feed them caught grasshoppers, that didn't work at all.
I used to feed spiders, which did work and I still feed them lol
My friends had mice and so did my borther, my friends used to put their mice out in the pool and let them swim, so I thought my brothers mouse could swim too.
I decided it was dirty and needed a bath....
Soapy water in a bucket, 0 mice later...

Now I'm no longer diagnosed as autistic, but I still have aspergers and social issues, there's a lot of things we have to learn a lot slower than the gen. population.
We have to deal with our tormented heads before we learn right from wrong. There's so much going on inside the mind of thr troubled...
But if you have someone help them, guide them, show them the right thing to do, they learn.
No one showed me how to care for the pets, and since no one let me help, I helped on my own.
When kids and adults like that are asled to help, they get really excited.
No one asks them for any kind of help usually.
It's very important for them to learn, even if they are learning the hard way.

Perhaps you could even reward him.
For each bugfish he keeps alive, he could get a real one.
But only if he feeds them right everyday, and helps you out with something.

While I was working at my store, a boy came in and had a fit... It was so sad. Everyone around him had no idea what to do, the younger workers who have never dealt with anything like him before just followed him... I'm sure it was frightening to be followed while having an outburst.
Luckily I was quick and thought of a distraction. I ran across the store, grabbed a sample cookie and showed it to him.
I kinda waved it and asked if he wanted a cookie.
He went from screaming acrying to whispering cookie so fast.... No one knew what happened, they just knew he became quiet.
He quickly learned, if he sees me and behaves when he does, then he gets a cookie.
If he's screaming and runs past me, no cookie til he stops screaming.

I feel if you teach and reward your son, it could help him a lot with responsibility. Especially if he has no job or chores around the house.
And in my honest opinion, getting fish for him is better than any other small alternative animal that he could take out and play with.
As we've seen by my post, rodents are a good one to stay away from.

I would say lizards and frogs are too since they have the ability of being held in the hand, which may make him want to touch them and grab them.

Fish we watch and feed, that's it.

Let us know what you go with! I hope he learns to care for his new pet well!
I love that you're doing this for him.
That’s a longggg reply
 
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fastraver

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Francine said:
I do think that is an AWFUL comment... I started out as a DSW for years and I now have my doctorate in psychology...

To deprive a mentally disabled child of having a fish or frog when there are NUMEROUS solutions to prevent the fish/frog/whatever from being harmed is awful to say!!

As I mentioned there are so so many ways that’s this can be done safely.... get a betta and a 5 gallon tank... build a shelf up higher for the stand so that he can’t just put stuff in but can still see the fish.... simple... and problem solved....
Most men who are “handy” would be able to rig up a lid that locks or that he can not open..or again even reach but still see.... there is absolutely NO reason in my professional opinion why this child can not have a fish....
Winter Soldier is giving a sound opinion. I am not offend. I personally know of of a couple of family's. A pet of any sort is not an option.

I am quite handy. Which allows me to handle this. If I was not handy. I would need to find some one who was or avoid the fish altogether.

I also understand where you are coming from Francine. That each and everyone of us deserve the right to have access to a pet.

You all have made awesome choices.

We just need to find a path that will help my son chose his tank over mine.

I have a 55 gallon with about 30 African Cichlids. But before you all jump the gun. Saying whoa, you are way over stocked.

It is. The number one reason is African Cichlids need to be over stocked to spread out the aggression. I have two 406 canister filters running. 3 heaters. Do two 50% water changes a week. Feed sparingly twice a day.

So if I went with a 9g with two Molly's. It would be taken care of. Molly's for me would be the last resort of type of fish I would get.

The Hexbugs though is making it's way to the top of my list.

My end goal is for me and my son to be able to do something together. Which in it self is a challenge. Due to always being with mom all the time.
 

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