Can Snowball/Blue Pearl be with Cherry Shrimp?

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
When looking at the cherry shrimp color charts it shows that snowball and blue pearls come from Neo. palmata and not Neo. davidii. Is it safe to assume that keeping red cherries with snowball or blue pearls will not produce brown shrimp down the line? I ask because I'm curious about adding another species to the 36gal bowfront invert tank. I already have red cherries (Neo. davidii) with blackberry shrimp (Cardina babaulti). I hear palmata have similar parameter needs to cherries and I think it would be nice to have a tank full of black, red, and possibly snowball or blue pearl shrimp without the worry of browns popping up.
 

Feohw

Fishlore VIP
It looks like mixing them will result in browns eventually. As they are both neocaridina species they will interbreed. This site says this:

"Please be aware that because it is a Neocaridina species, it can interbreed readily with the other Neocaridina species. Interbreeding can result in brown or wildtype baby shrimp in the 2nd generation and beyond. The color will be lost and you will not be able to restore it by yourself."

Everything else I've read says the same.
 

e_watson09

Fishlore VIP
Usually mixing isn't recommended because they're going to cross breed and give you brown shrimp
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Upon further reading I’m seeing mixed opinions. I am not seeing any photo evidence of hybrids either. For science’s sake, I think I’m going to do some experimenting.

I’ve been wanting another color for a planted 10gal anyways. Might separate out a couple females and put a male red cherry in just to see what happens. If I get boring brown shrimp I can just toss them in the betta tank (aka cull tank).
 

jake37

Fishlore VIP
Poor betta; only gets the rejects

Upon further reading I’m seeing mixed opinions. I am not seeing any photo evidence of hybrids either. For science’s sake, I think I’m going to do some experimenting.

I’ve been wanting another color for a planted 10gal anyways. Might separate out a couple females and put a male red cherry in just to see what happens. If I get boring brown shrimp I can just toss them in the betta tank (aka cull tank).
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Alright, so I just placed an order for 10 snowballs and 10 blue pearls. 2 experiments will be going on now, one about mixing this species with cherries and the other to see if the pearls and snowballs will create wild type offspring. This may be a long experiment but colors are always fun to work with in selective breeding
 

-Mak-

Fishlore VIP
Curious, where did you order from? I've been on the lookout for snowballs for a long time!
Let us know how your experiment goes
If you have the right parameters and are confident in your shrimp keeping ability, look into Caridina dennerli aka Sulawesi shrimp. They won't interbreed with anything, but may be hard to find/expensive.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Curious, where did you order from? I've been on the lookout for snowballs for a long time!
Let us know how your experiment goes
If you have the right parameters and are confident in your shrimp keeping ability, look into Caridina dennerli aka Sulawesi shrimp. They won't interbreed with anything, but may be hard to find/expensive.

I got them off aquabid from this seller. They let me get 10 of the snowballs and 10 of the blue pearls for the price of 20 of one kind.
https://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?disp&viewseller&Dhu32

I have looked into Sulawesi shrimp a bit, I’ll look into them a little more extensively though!
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Shrimp arrived yesterday and seem to be doing well after drip acclimating for a few hours. They have a well established planted 10gal all to themselves. They look to be mainly juveniles but one snowball was berried on arrival.

It’s hard to tell the two colors apart right now. Those a blue tint are the blue pearls.

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OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Not much to update on. The snowball that came berried hatched her eggs and I’ve seen a few around. I’m also seeing lots of growing saddles. Their colors aren’t particularly vibrant.

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I threw in 2 saddled red cherries and now we’ll see what happens. I’m hoping they won’t hybridize but if they do I’ll be able to have solid photo evidence of it.
 

barbiespoodle

Well Known
Both your shrimp and your tank are lovely.

Of course it's your tank to do with what you want. In my opinion, you have done the most important thing of all, you gave them a wonderful environment to live in and took a lot of care to make sure you did, it really is a beautiful tank.

But now to my take on mixing colors.

First let me state that I am not an expert, but am experienced. I am in the keep the colors separate camp. I do find the browns have a beauty all their own, but if I buy a color, I want to keep that color. So I have my well established red tank and have just started a blue tank and they will be kept separate.

Again, that's me. If you are enjoying your shrimp as you have them, then that's what's most important in the long run.
 

Debbie1986

Well Known
Lovely pictures!

I just had blue velvet shrimp babies & 3 are red, not blue.

I am going to toss them into my snail only tank which is heavily planted & may give them to a co-worker eventually. I'm waiting about a week or 2 more so they're more mature before move.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Both your shrimp and your tank are lovely.

Of course it's your tank to do with what you want. In my opinion, you have done the most important thing of all, you gave them a wonderful environment to live in and took a lot of care to make sure you did, it really is a beautiful tank.

But now to my take on mixing colors.

First let me state that I am not an expert, but am experienced. I am in the keep the colors separate camp. I do find the browns have a beauty all their own, but if I buy a color, I want to keep that color. So I have my well established red tank and have just started a blue tank and they will be kept separate.

Again, that's me. If you are enjoying your shrimp as you have them, then that's what's most important in the long run.

I am also for keeping colors separate, the idea is they are different species and to see if they will hybridize. So far I have my red cherries, a small group of blacks that are apparently producing a couple blues, and a handful of young yellows I'm trying to establish a breeding group from. Then there's the cull browns in with my bettas and the blue pearls with the snowballs.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
And here is the answer! Now I wonder if the young will be fertile?

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I think I’ll set up the spare 1.5gal and let then do their own thing in there as a walstad setup.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
I set up my berried female in a big pickle jar with live plants, a piece of wood from the 10gal, a couple oak leaves, and seasoned sand from another tank. Not pretty but functional. She’s already calmed down and foraging.

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Side note, there are several berried pearls/snowballs now so I’m looking forward to the population explosion!
 

Debbie1986

Well Known
That set up looks so cool and efficent for size/needs
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Little hybrids have hatched a while ago and are growing fast.

When I noticed them, some had a blue tint.

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Today, most are drab of course. Mom is still with them, I should move her back to the cherry colony so she can breed again.

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jake37

Fishlore VIP
I thought you were concern they would be brown? Sounds like that is not the case ?
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
I thought you were concern they would be brown? Sounds like that is not the case ?

It was an experiment to see if they would hybridize, I didn't want to toss all the palmata into my cherry tank and end up with loads of brown babies. Just means the palmatas get to stay separate and the hybrids will likely stay in their pickle jar. I'm not really opposed to brown shrimp, I just don't want them getting mixed in with my cherries.
 

ElysiumPlants

Active Member
It was an experiment to see if they would hybridize, I didn't want to toss all the palmata into my cherry tank and end up with loads of brown babies. Just means the palmatas get to stay separate and the hybrids will likely stay in their pickle jar. I'm not really opposed to brown shrimp, I just don't want them getting mixed in with my cherries.

A hands-on experiment to provide a definitive answer to the community? I think it’s really cool that you’re doing this.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Babies are grown up and having more babies. I pulled these little ones out of the water change bucket. Note that some look red.

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Here’s some of the adults plus momma red behind some snails. Mom had another batch of babies with one of her sons.
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OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Teeny tiny shrimplets, nothing but shrimp and snails in the pickle jar! They should probably get thinned out, there are about 20(?) adults along with babies from 3-5 females. I think the jar is only a gallon so a bit over stocked I think.
 

Debbie1986

Well Known
Note that some look red.
I have a chart for my blue velvet shrimps that I saw a while back. it's a natural variation , but I did not cull my 2 red shrimp. I'm okay with how they look.

If I need more blue velvet color dominant traits, I figured I'd buy more in a year or so because I want diverse genetics anyway. I think i've had 4 cycles/batches of babies since Feb. They keep being born. Last count was around 50 shrimp in my 6 gallon. I plan on moving my shrimp into a 20 gallon next year.
 

RelaxingBettas

Active Member
I wish I had seen this before posting my snowball hybridization thread yesterday (and can't find now lol), I was about to put my two lone snowball female survivors in with my blues to get their eggs fertilized, but today I found a little male, so whoop whoop, and I don't have to try to cross the zhang-whatsits (I think that might be more recent nomenclature than palmata or whatever) and the cherries to see what happens.
 
OP
Demeter

Demeter

Fishlore VIP
Found what appears to be a “snowball” shrimp in a tank I tossed extra hybrids into (the jar was too full). It’s a developing female that I’m going to try finding again and placing with other light colored hybrids. Unlike actual snowballs, this one looks to have a racing stripe which is hard to distinguish in the picture. She should look pretty cool when she’s a big mature female. Ignore the nasty water marks.

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