Can Seachem Ferts Kill Fish

Started using full array of Seachem fertilizers about 3/4 dose and my cardinal tetras started dying. They are wild caught. I don't think it was a coincidence. I keep a log and know when I started dosing and when the fish started dying. Has this happened to anyone else. My water parameters are 0,0,20,7.2ph. Has anyone had this problem with Thrive. Should I switch. What water percentage and time interval for water changes do each recommend. I do a 35 -40 % water change each week.

 

I used the entire seachem line with no adverse effects. Thrive was fine for me as well... biggest difference between the two is the convenience of dosing (thrive is 1 pump per ten gallons, 1-3 times a week) vs. working off the seachem chart and using multiple bottles.

As for the cardinals... cardinals overall are pretty sensitive, plus wild caught fish have a harder time adapting to tank life... between the tank size (confinement), water differences, diet is also a factor...what have you been feeding them? Realize there are no flakes/pellets in nature... have they been eating well? Do they look sick? Any thinness? How long have you had them?

 

Had them about a month. Been feeding them flakes, shrimp pellets and fresh dried worms. I don't know if they are eating. Look thin or should I say not fat. What should I be feeding them. I got them off a friend who had them for a while. No other fish seem to be affected.

 

I have freeze dries bloodworms but the gouramis eat them before the cardinals can even see them. They do not come to the top to eat. I also have freeze dried Tubifex worms. They sink at least. Should I try them.

 

I'd try frozen foods at the very least... live foods being better

 

If your friend had them for some time before you got them and you've had them a month it would be unlikely food issues, but not entirely impossible.. how long did your friend have them? Why did they get rid of them? Can you check what they were eating before?

As for feedings, agree with the frozen over dried... thaw a cube of bloodworms or daphnia... likely you would have to chop the bloodworms..
as for getting food to the bottom, try sprinkling some directly into the output of your hob, will push it down quickly.alternately you can pop your hand in there and release the food half way down, assuming your hand doesn't freak them out

 

He is in the military and was leaving quickly. Doesn't talk about what he does and where he goes but this was not short term. I can't get in touch with him until he gets back. He gave away all his fish and I took his cardinals. Started with 10 and they only started dying since I started fertizing and have 5 left. I stopped fertilizing and none have died since. It's been 3 days.

 

Any fert could bump the nitrates up but you verified that isn't the case so I doubt ferts had anything to do with it.

 

What exact ferts are you using? Just so we know. And are you for sure dosing correctly?

I use the full line of Seachem ferts and haven’t had any issues.

 

I use the full line also. I under fertilize. I have a 36 bow and fertilize as if it was a 20. I follow the guidelines on the Seachem website. I have googled and others have reported the same thing. Not many but a couple of instances. Not saying it's the ferts but looking at it real hard. Don't think it's a coincidence. But no other fish have died. Can it be that they are that sensitive.

 

Another day without ferts and no dead fish. I will keep you updated. Will probably get 5 more once Thanksgiving passes. See how that works out.

Seems they are not that interested in food. They don't even put it in their mouth and spit it out.

 

I've used both Seachem and Thrive. I never had any problems with Seachem products. Within days of switching to Thrive (trying to save myself some hassle with an all-in-one) my snail got sick and died . At first I thought I'd killed it. But after scouring the internet for information I'm now almost 100% certain it was coincidence. We have to remember that correlation isn't always causation.

The only way I could see a fertilizer hurting your fish is if you misplaced a decimal calculating dosage.

 

Fertilize - fish die. Stop fertilizing - fish stop dying. Again start fertilizing - fish die. Again stop fertilizing - fish stop dying. I dose as if my tank was a 20 gallon and it is a 36 gallon. A cap full is a cap full. A 1/2 a cap is a half a cap. Even if I dosed a full cap it would not be that much of an overdose as I dose at just over 50% what I should. It has nothing to do with overdosing.

 

I started using Excel, Flourish, and Root tabs this week, had 2 sudden deaths this week too. My nitrates skyrocketed (dark red on API kit, usually light orange after 2 weeks) this week so my best guess is that.

 

Fertilize - fish die. Stop fertilizing - fish stop dying. Again start fertilizing - fish die. Again stop fertilizing - fish stop dying. I dose as if my tank was a 20 gallon and it is a 36 gallon. A cap full is a cap full. A 1/2 a cap is a half a cap. Even if I dosed a full cap it would not be that much of an overdose as I dose at just over 50% what I should. It has nothing to do with overdosing.

That is really odd, and I'd probably stop using it if I had that experience. Maybe shoot Seachem a message, either on their forum or their product Q&A web page. It's possible that Cardinals are exceptionally sensitive to something.

 

Yep, I dug out my root tab and stopped dosing, very weird.

 

I have been using flourish liquid with no issues for about a year. I just started using root tabs, and for some reason they make me nervous. I'm wondering if you should try half the dose you tried? Maybe they need to get used to it over time? I will be looking for any parameter changes and report back.

 

They are quick to reply California L33

 

My nitrates are around 20ppm. I did a water test after the death. It's the first thing I thought of. Has to be a correlation. Going to order 7 more cardinals after Thanksgiving. Will start fertilizing at 1/2 dose and see if any deaths. If no deaths until Thanksgiving and deaths after I know it's the fertilizer. If all are alive after my 50% dosing I am back at square 1 but happy. My plants are happy with the ferts.

 

Are you dosing Flourish Excel? As far as I know, it's the only Seachem product containing glutaraldehyde. The other fertilizers should be pretty safe.

Glutaraldehyde - Wikipedia

As a strong sterilant, glutaraldehyde is toxic and a strong irritant.

From EVALUATION OF BIOCIDES FOR POTENTIAL TREATMENT OF BALLAST WATER:




Glutaraldehyde is listed as a fair candidate for eliminating fish from ship ballasts. And fair-good for invertebrates.

 

Yes. I use the full line of fertilizers. Excel is one of them. Interesting that Day 1 is two capfuls and the rest are a 1/2 cap. Will check my log to see if there is any correlation.

 

People have already noticed the correlation between Excel and fish deaths:

Seachem Excel - some known side effects/considerations

"Excel is gluteraldehyde or a form of it. It is a hospital disinfectant among other things. I used it when I first started my tank but I had mysterious deaths of cardinal tetras. I indirectly attribute the deaths to excel. I quit using it and the deaths stopped. Personally I would never use the stuff but plants do like it. A quick google for fish stress and death with excel will bring up plenty of reading. BTW I did not double dose fwiw. It was used as recommended only."

Flourish Excel and sensitive fish like cardinals

"I was dosing excel the first 6 months I had my tank and my cardinals kept dying one by one. It took me a while to put 2 and 2 together but when I quit using the excel the mysterious deaths stopped. I still believe the deaths were a result of using it though only a handful of people seem to have the same idea. In the end whether it actually was or was not the excel that caused the deaths, excel is Glutaraldehyde, which is a disinfectant used in hospitals. It just didnt seem natural to me to use it. I feel better even if the fish didnt care...lol
I still keep it on hand to kill algae that pop up on rocks ( I remove them from the tank before using it)

EDIT- after dropping excel, I began using DIY CO2 which I used for awhile and had decent success with. I now use pressurized Co2 and absolutely love it."



"I should have researched this much more before putting it into my tank, but I've been losing fish when I put Flourish Excel in my tank. All my other numbers are great (ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, ph is good), and my tank was nice and healthy. Then I put Flourish (comp) in my tank, and all was good. A few days later, I started adding Flourish Excel (slightly under the recommended dose). Overnight, I lost 2 shrimp and 2 neon tetras. I immediately tested my water to see if anything else was up, and all numbers were great. I thought maybe I'd gotten some sick fish, since the tetras were only in my tank for about a week before adding anything, and since most of what I'd read online said Excel was safe for fish as long as you're within the recommended dosage, I figured it had to be something else. The next day, I put in about 3/4 of a single dose of excel. Lost another fish that night.
So I stopped putting Excel in my tank for about 4 days, and all my fish were fine. I put in 1/2 of a dose the next day (1/2 capful, 60gal tank), and sure enough I lost another shrimp and 2 more neon tetras. Skipped the dose yesterday and today, and no lives lost.
I won't be putting Excel in my tank again, unless the rest of my fish die. I mean, if it's going to kill off any animals in my tank, might as well go for the gold if it's empty, right?"

"I keep a detailed tank journal for my 29 gallon planted tank and have had it running for three years. I have tried Seachem Excel on four different occasions over the last six months in an amount less than the recommended dose for my tank size. Without exception, every time I use this product I end up find dead or dying neon tetras in my tank within a week or two of starting the dosage. I have concluded that there could be nothing else causing their deaths. I'm giving this two stars because my plants did respond well to it but what's the point if you kill fish while trying to find the correct dosage. I stopped using this and went to DIY CO2 and fish are healthy and plants are growing like weeds. BE CAREFUL when using this product with neon tetras."

Red Gills But Not Ammonia Burns

"So I stopped excel and their gills looked better and better, to the point where I could not decide if they were still a little red, or if it was natural coloration. So I decided to restart excel at half a dose; I added it last night, and this morning my fish has red gills again! So for sure it was excel...are swordtails more sensitive to it? In any event, I ordered co2 system and will not be using excel any more"

 

Ok. Thanks for info. Thought I was going crazy. Well maybe I am anyway. But seriously can I dose everything but excel with cardinals. If I use Thrive will I have the same problem.

Always wondered what a CO2 system is. And if it was needed.

 

GoldFiska this is the thread. Hope it helps.