Big Red - my beautiful betta!

I'd like to introduce Big Red, a big beautiful betta I got in late September.

He wasn't my first betta -- my daughter gave Boris to me for Christmas three years ago. He survived for about six months in a large vase with a green plant on top and marbles. Sorry, I didn't know any better or I would have taken him out and given him a proper home.

I read the Betta care guide last night. Until then, I thought Big Red was happy in his heated 2.5 gal. tank (with two small ivory snails for company) which sits on my kitchen counter. Well -- since I'm about to set up two new 12 gal. tanks -- I think Big Red should make one of them his new home.

I probably will set the tanks up tomorrow (I think I'm going to try bio-spira since I've read on the forum that others have had success with it). I'm also setting up another 25 gal. tank.

When using the bio-spira, how long should the tank run before adding any fish? Just curious.

I will probably get either otos or cories, as mentioned in one of the posts I just read, and put them in before introducing Big Red to his new digs! How many would be appropriate? Could I get a couple of each?

After all seems OK, I plan to get him a female companion. Don't know if I'll have trouble finding one for him, but I'm pretty sure my LFS can get one for me.

Also should I put Big Red and his new companion in the new tank at the same time, or should I put him in the tank first and then introduce her?

Any suggestions/comments on my plan will be most appreciated.

 

You do know Bettas are also called Siamese Fighting Fish right?
A male and a female will usually fight unless it is breeding time.
Try getting a divider first.

 

Thanks for the info Peter.

I did not know that males and females fought. I thought that only the males could not be put in a tank together. I guess I will either try to find a divider or Big Red will have to be content as an only Betta!

 

You do know Bettas are also called Siamese Fighting Fish right?
A male and a female will usually fight unless it is breeding time.
Try getting a divider first.

I may be wrong though check with another member.

 

I wouldn't recommend a divider unless you are positive that the bettas can't see through it. Just looking at another betta throughout the day can be very stressfull.

 

on the cory otto thing. Both of them are group fish so it would be preferable if you could get 3-4 of either corys or ottos.

(I personally reccomend corys, they are very entertaining fish)

 

You are correct. Males and females could very well fight.  Although, they don't fight as much  as 2 males would fight. I would still get a divider or put them in separate tanks. Natalie

 

Thanks all. It looks like Big Red will have the tank to himself -- with probably several corries. One of my favorite little fish.

 

Male and Female bettas can only be put together for a very short time (just long enough to spawn) and then must be watched very closely or one or both will probably end up injured or possibly even dead.  Females can and should be kept in groups but only if they can be bought out of the SAME TANK.  It is not advisable to buy bettas of any kind, male or female who are not from the same tank and try to raise them together.  (from someone who has tried)  Even the females will kill each other, not by fighting but by refusing to allow the smallest or weakest to eat.  One by one they will die until there is only one left.  If they are sisters and have never been seperated into the little cups or separate tanks they have a much better chance of becoming a school of females with a dominant female at the lead the way it should be. 

No it is not advisable to use a divider at any time.  It will stress the male at least.  He will flare until he is overstressed and can do heart and nervous system damage.  They should never be shown mirrors or allowed to flare longer than 10 minutes at a time without a break.
You may have a little flaring or even a lot when he sees himself in the walls of the tank, but some of that is fixed by not having the tank lights on when the room lights are off.  If you want to see after dark invest in a lunar light.  He cannot see it and you can watch him.

If you are going to get cories, put the cories in the tank first so they can get established or the betta will not accept them in the tank.  Cories are nervous little fish and do not do well being chased by Bettas.  I have heard and seen them die of fright.  Otos on the other hand have a tendency to allow the bettas to chase them all over the place and then just hide.  You may not see them for weeks as they almost always come out at night.  They are also difficult to get started sometimes.  You need to look for certain things when you go to buy Otos and you should never buy them without visiting their website.  They are the sweetest of fish however and I have both Otos and a Cory (my other two were frightened to death by my female betta ~ she chased them unmercifully)  I love them all.

Oto website:

otocinclus

I hope this has been helpful a little.  Sorry it is so long.  Once you know me, you will know I do not know how to be quiet.

Please be welcome to the Betta Board and Fishlore.com. I am so happy to welcome you and Big Red to our forum. All my little ones are waving fins for Big Red's welcome to the community. Alexander and Emma say hello. Marty is under the weather but he waves a fin.

Rose

 

Rose,

Thank you so much for the response. I hope your Marty is getting better. I lost one of my baby loaches (the smallest) last night and really feel bad about it.

After reading some of the other responses to my post, I have decided to allow Big Red to have a 12 gal. tank by himself. I was not interested in having babies; I just didn't want him to be lonesome! I had already decided that a divider was not an option.

I will decide on either the cories or the otos for the tank (there will be plenty of places to hide). If the pairing doesn't work out the otos or cories can be moved to another tank.

Big Red is waving hello to all his new friends.

 

If you decide on Otos I would get 4-5. Some considerations about Otos:
They need very low nitrates (preferably well under 20)...so you may need to do bigger water changes
Live plants are not absolutely essential but pretty much for their well being
Due to bad capture method and poor feeding at stores, Otos often die within a few weeks of being purchased. This means it may take you more several rounds to get 4 Otos, which would delay getting the Betta because you dont' want to add fish after the Betta.
I don't know what you prefer but Otos do tend to hide a lot, so you may not see them much during the day.
However...if all this seems ok to you then Otos are great fish, keep your algae down and are just adorable.

Cories are also adorable little fish, a bit more up and about than Otos but they don't eat algae of course. You could get 4-5 2in Cories, or 3 3in Cories. Cories are initially at least much hardier than Otos. Although perhaps a bit less tolerant of being chased by Mr Betta?? They are really cute little guys, will swim aroung in a shoal and clean up any dropped food. Also there are tons of different varieties.

I don't know how you could choose between the two (I solved the problem by getting both ;D) but let us know what you decide on. Also let us know if you have any questions about the catfish.

 

Thanks Omorrakh,

I read the info on the link Rose provided. The otos seem like a great little fish. The website also states that their survival rate is not good. That is so sad. But I would like to give them a try.

I will probably start with 5-6 in the hopes that a couple will survive (I don't know when I can add fish using bio-sprira but I'm sure my LFS can help me there or even if I can start with 5 or 6). I can always add a few more later on before Big Red relocates.

I will probably also get several cories. Big Red will remain in his 2.5 gal tank until his new tank is ready for him. If, when he is introduced, there is a problem he can go back to his old home temporarily or go into one of the other two tanks I'm working on.

Thanks again,

gloria

 

Oh lucky you! When you use Bio-spira it goes like this... You SHAKE up the bag of Bio-spira (DON"T forget) and dump it into the tank... then you put in the fish. Takes more time to read the sentence. In fact the Bio-spira needs to have the fish added right away to provide the ammonia that it needs to keep it going. It is after all live bacteria that need to be fed by the fish's waste. I love it.

Now, one caution, don't give the tank a full load right away. It needs about a week to settle in fully but does need some fish. I put about a third of a load in if I am getting more than one. Don't be too upset if it looks like you have ammonia in a couple of days, it is just the bacteria getting settled and does not get high enough to hurt your fish. In about a week you can add another third of the fish and follow it up with the rest in another week.

Since you have a 12 gallon tank, you could easily put 3 cories, and the betta and still have room to tuck in a couple of Otos if you want for algae removal. I know that may be over the 1" rule a bit but I have a betta and 2 otos in my 5 gallon and 7 more gallons would support 3 cories easy. You just have to do at least a 50% water change a week and make sure to vacuum the gravel a bit more often. I also use Liquid Gravel Vac that cuts down on the sludge build up once every 2 weeks. It is the only chemical I put in my tanks other than the dechlorinator and vitamins I give on a daily basis.

Oh, yes I bought 8 Otos total to end up with the 5 I now own. I would buy them in 3's and keep them quarantined for 2 weeks at least in case they are carrying a disease. Once you get some healthy ones you don't want to put them at risk by adding new ones. When you go to look...you need little rounded tummies (not bloated just plump) not flat, white tummies with no red streaks (indicates infection), active and ask the guy how long they have been there. It is best not to get them when they have just gotten there. The fins should be whole and not bent or twisted. They should have an obvious stripe down their side. Muddy looking otos can be not well. If they are not looking well fed, please do not feel sorry for them and buy them. They have a bacteria in their stomachs that help them to digest their food. If they have been starved or are thin, the bacteria is probably dead and you can feed them a whole package of food and the food will do them no good as they cannot use it. They are going to die anyway.

Hope this helps a little.

Rose

 

Rose,

Thanks for all the useful info. I'm sure my LFS carries the liquid vac (very pricy place, but with the "cleanest tanks in town"). They also have a staff that is very knowledgeable and an amazing selection of fish -- and fantastic saltwater setups.

I plan to set the tanks up and let them run for 24 hours before getting the bio-spira. I have everything -- it's just a matter of finding the time to wash all that gravel. Then the fun will begin. I can't believe it's going to be so easy! I just wish I had known about the bio-spira before setting up my other four tanks.

 

I pretty sure you know Bettas are freshwater but you mentioned saltwater and just in case BETTAS AREN'T SALTWATER.
Sorry if I got it wrong.(Which I probely did)

 

Just an explanation in case you misunderstood. Don't add the Liquid Gravel Vac until the tank is at least a month or two old. The bacteria needs to grow and establish first. Just dechlorinator and Bio-spira for the first while. Change water after the Bio-spira only after the first 7 days. You will have an ammonia spike of sorts but don't get worried, it is the bacteria establishing itself. I am using it in Emma's tank now and she just now went back to normal. (Took a week) Just be patient. Everything will be okay. This is the only time I will tell you not to get too concerned about test results.

Rose

 

Rose,

Thanks again. Just thought I'd pick up the liquid vac when I get the bio spira -- just to have it on hand. I have a Eheim (sp?) vac which I've used on one of my tanks -- mainly to suck up snail shells (awful creatures hitchhiked in on some live plants). It works very well but disturbs my landscaping.

 

I also use the EHEIM sludge remover (battery operated) when I vacuum and it does disturb things a bit. When you get to using the Liquid Gravel Vac you will not need to do deep vacuuming but 4 or 5 times a year otherwise just go over the surface. Just watch and when the edge of the gravel looks a little dirty do the deep vacuuming. I do mine deeply about every 3 months. Otherwise it is dissolved and removed with the big water changes. Small water changes won't do with it though as it dissolves the waste and the fish need more water changed.

Rose

 

Rose,

I'm not sure of the proper format for this question.

How often should I use the liquid gravel vac? Instructions are not clear on the product (at least to me). I was just able to get it two weeks ago and used it in two of my tanks.

Big Red seems very happy in his new home (with three corrie roomates).

 

I would say every two weeks but I do it a little different. Since I do LARGE water changes I add a little bit with every water change. My water changes are 50%-75% a week so I feel that they need a small dosage with every change. I use just about 1/8 teaspoon with each water change and so with the stuff already in the tank it does not overdose the tank. (for 5 gallons)

Now I do still vacuum the tank like I said with the EHEIM sludge remover lightly to remove the worst of the debris from the surface. No deep vacuuming, just wave it over the top of the surface to the best of my ability and go from there. It picks up the loose stuff and leaves the plants and decorations alone but does get the stuff out of the tank. The Liquid Gravel Vac is the stuff that keeps me from having to do DEEP vacuuming more than 5 times a year or so. (Where we really clean house and move everything a bit)

I am so glad that he loves his new home and surroundings and roommates .


Rose