Bichir/oscar/bgk problems!help!

Croix
  • #1
I have an oscar (around 6in) in a 40 gal tank. I recently re did the aqua scape from gravel to sand and plastic hide to wood. I also picked up a bichir (around 6") they lived together not so good at first but don't care about each other anymore. I added a BGK aswell. I know I have iver crowding problems but that's beside the point. My oscar and bichir for the first time yesterday at 1130pm on nov 6th started to attempt a tank escape and charged are the hlass and anything else. I did an immediate water change and all seemed good. Today I had reduced eating. They ate half their usual portions. And the oscar seems to be laying on his side now and the bichir still swimming erativly. My mom noticed a small white worm she said looked like the blood worms I feed the the BGK but I never saw anything. Based on a quick google search it might be possible for a parasite but I'm not sure. I poked the oscar and he is swimming now as of 1015pm on nov 7th. Any advice or idea for me would be greatly appreciated. This tank has been running no problem for about 7 months now. Thx.
 

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CrazedHoosier
  • #2
I have an oscar (around 6in) in a 40 gal tank. I recently re did the aqua scape from gravel to sand and plastic hide to wood. I also picked up a bichir (around 6") they lived together not so good at first but don't care about each other anymore. I added a BGK aswell. I know I have iver crowding problems but that's beside the point. My oscar and bichir for the first time yesterday at 1130pm on nov 6th started to attempt a tank escape and charged are the hlass and anything else. I did an immediate water change and all seemed good. Today I had reduced eating. They ate half their usual portions. And the oscar seems to be laying on his side now and the bichir still swimming erativly. My mom noticed a small white worm she said looked like the blood worms I feed the the BGK but I never saw anything. Based on a quick google search it might be possible for a parasite but I'm not sure. I poked the oscar and he is swimming now as of 1015pm on nov 7th. Any advice or idea for me would be greatly appreciated. This tank has been running no problem for about 7 months now. Thx.
Is your tank cycled? What are your ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels? Tank temp? What's the watering schedule and amount of water changed based on that schedule? Yeah, these are both fish far too large for your tank. You'll eventually need to upgrade to at least a 75 gallon with these two.

Could we get a picture of the parasite and the fish we're worried about?
 

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kallililly1973
  • #3
Your going to need at least a 200 gallon tank for these 3 fish if not bigger. They are severly over crouded in a 40 gallon tank.
 
CrazedHoosier
  • #4
For some reason I skimmed over the BGK part. I guess the bichir and oscar combo already had me shook.

Yeah, you’re gonna need a bigger boat(tank).
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #5
I know about the tank being too small. I'm in the processes of getting my parents to get a bigger one. I'm not sure about parasites don't see any visual evidence of any. As of tonight tho the bichirs left eye has began to turn foggy and has 2 white strands coming of it. I will attach a photo does anyone knoe what this is and how to fix it. I cannot list all the levels of the tank because I don't have the liquid ammonia check.
Parameters are as follows:
Temp 77
Ph 7.2-7.6
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 0-5ppm

Ill try to get an ammonia sample asap but the nitrate and nitrite levels seem off. I usally do water changes once a week and do 25% changes and I recently like within 2 weeks did a 40%. I feed blood worms, bug bites, and small peices of tilapia fillets. The bichirs eye is recent and was not like this at 230pm nov 8th. I will attach a photo of his eye please help me and him.
15732719483056004699368516874705.jpg

I know cloudy eye can be from poor water quality so I'm carrying out a 50% right now.
 

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CaptainAquatics
  • #6
Your going to need at least a 200 gallon tank for these 3 fish if not bigger. They are severly over crouded in a 40 gallon tank.

Now, a 200 gallon might be pushing it. I honestly think a 75 gallon would be fine, 100 gallon would be better but come on, 200 gallons? That’s seems a little over the top for me IMO. If he wants to add a lot more go for the 200 gallon but with just these three, I think 75-100 would be fine. I have a 130 with a 40 gallon sumo with two Oscars (both 7-8”), a blood parrot (8”), a leopard pleco (6”), and 4 synodontis eupetus catfish (3 pushing 8-9”, one only like 5”).
I also have two firemouth cichlids in that tank but I plan to move them to a different tank or rehome in the next month or two because the Oscars, parrot cichlid, synos, and pleco are already a little overstocked. However they are all fine and healthy. They are active eat great and have awesome personality’s. Sorry this reply was kinda off topic to the thread and you are entitled to your own opinion I just thought 200 gallons was pushing it a bit to the extreme. BTW the point of this post wasn’t to be rude to your or say you are wrong because in fairness if you could get a 200 gallon that would be awesome for them but OP might simply not have the budget or space for that large of a tank whereas 75 gallons is a bit easier to manage. Again was trying to be rude or bellitling, just sharing my opinion. Also OP I hope your fish get better! I have had exerince with worms and I can tell you they are a pain to deal with and get rid of. Good luck
 

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vyrille
  • #7
I know about the tank being too small. I'm in the processes of getting my parents to get a bigger one. I'm not sure about parasites don't see any visual evidence of any. As of tonight tho the bichirs left eye has began to turn foggy and has 2 white strands coming of it. I will attach a photo does anyone knoe what this is and how to fix it. I cannot list all the levels of the tank because I don't have the liquid ammonia check.
Parameters are as follows:
Temp 77
Ph 7.2-7.6
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 0-5ppm

Ill try to get an ammonia sample asap but the nitrate and nitrite levels seem off. I usally do water changes once a week and do 25% changes and I recently like within 2 weeks did a 40%. I feed blood worms, bug bites, and small peices of tilapia fillets. The bichirs eye is recent and was not like this at 230pm nov 8th. I will attach a photo of his eye please help me and him.View attachment 634329
Those oddly look like anchor worms to me (Lernaea). Did you get all three fish from the same source? Do you see these 'strands' on the other fish?
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #8
I'm being offered at 90gal currently so if u think 75 gal is good then 90 is good too. But the fish came from different places. The oscar was rescue from an abusive fish store (corbets pets) The BGK from petsmart and the bichir from a kijijI guy. The white things are only on the bichir but the oscar has like little hols in his lower face like a chin area. Not sure if it normal but they are there.

I didnt do a 50% could only do a a 25-30% I will change more either tonight or tomorrow morning.
 
vyrille
  • #9
I'm being offered at 90gal currently so if u think 75 gal is good then 90 is good too. But the fish came from different places. The oscar was rescue from an abusive fish store (corbets pets) The BGK from petsmart and the bichir from a kijijI guy. The white things are only on the bichir but the oscar has like little hols in his lower face like a chin area. Not sure if it normal but they are there.

I didnt do a 50% could only do a a 25-30% I will change more either tonight or tomorrow morning.
If you mean tank size personally 90gal would be fine for at least a year or so, as the black ghost grows rather slowly once it reaches a certain length (8-12in I think). BGK aren't very prolific swimmers anyway, just make sure the tank will allow the bgk to comfortably turn as they can't bend their tails as much as most fish can. As for the oscar, can we have a picture of the erosions you mentioned?
 
kallililly1973
  • #10
Now, a 200 gallon might be pushing it. I honestly think a 75 gallon would be fine, 100 gallon would be better but come on, 200 gallons? That’s seems a little over the top for me IMO. If he wants to add a lot more go for the 200 gallon but with just these three, I think 75-100 would be fine. I have a 130 with a 40 gallon sumo with two Oscars (both 7-8”), a blood parrot (8”), a leopard pleco (6”), and 4 synodontis eupetus catfish (3 pushing 8-9”, one only like 5”).
I also have two firemouth cichlids in that tank but I plan to move them to a different tank or rehome in the next month or two because the Oscars, parrot cichlid, synos, and pleco are already a little overstocked. However they are all fine and healthy. They are active eat great and have awesome personality’s. Sorry this reply was kinda off topic to the thread and you are entitled to your own opinion I just thought 200 gallons was pushing it a bit to the extreme. BTW the point of this post wasn’t to be rude to your or say you are wrong because in fairness if you could get a 200 gallon that would be awesome for them but OP might simply not have the budget or space for that large of a tank whereas 75 gallons is a bit easier to manage. Again was trying to be rude or bellitling, just sharing my opinion. Also OP I hope your fish get better! I have had exerince with worms and I can tell you they are a pain to deal with and get rid of. Good luck
Just giving my opinion... everyone is entitled to them
 

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Feohw
  • #11
I would not keep a BGK is a 75 or 90g long term. They would be fine for a while, but not indefinitely. Oscars are very messy too. If I had to do one in a 75g, I'd do it alone personally.
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #12
Here is a bichir update and the oscar face. The oscar is difficult camera shy but u can see the little white holes under his eye and over his fore head. They are faint but there.

The bichirs white things aren't there or I just can't see them anymore. What should I do with him? Continue water changes or medicate him.
 

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saltwater60
  • #13
I think you upset your tanks cycle and bacteria colony when changing everything over. You also added new fish so I’m going to guess your water quality is severely degraded. Get an ammonia test kit ASAP. I’m guessing your ammonia is high. I’d do a very large water change again then treat for parasites with antibiotics. A bigger tank will surely help. Oscars are dirty fish. I agree those looked like anchor worms.
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #14
What antibiotics would you guys reccomend
 

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saltwater60
  • #15
Any broad spectrum is good. I had some left over from my son and they worked great.
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #16
Wait are these like antibiotics from a fish store like petsmart or like human stuff. If its like drug store stuff could anyone give me a name on what worked.
 
saltwater60
  • #17
Wait are these like antibiotics from a fish store like petsmart or like human stuff. If its like drug store stuff could anyone give me a name on what worked.
You will have to buy fish store antibiotics. You can’t walk into a drug store at least in the USA and walk out with human antibiotics unless you have a doctors prescription. I think I used erythromycin. Can’t remember though.
Although the human and fish antibiotics are the exact same.
 
vyrille
  • #18
Here is a bichir update and the oscar face. The oscar is difficult camera shy but u can see the little white holes under his eye and over his fore head. They are faint but there.

The bichirs white things aren't there or I just can't see them anymore. What should I do with him? Continue water changes or medicate him.
To me the little holes on the oscar's head look like sensory pits.

As for anchor worm treatment, I would not do antibiotics, the worms will not respond to this. Instead, look for products that contain trichlorfon (fluke-tabs come to mind), or dimilin. Trichlorfon works on the adult stage of the parasite, whereas dimilin mostly works on the larval form. For this reason you will need to dose the tank with either for 30 days (follow manufacturer's instructions) to eradicate the parasite. Either treatment shouldn't disturb your beneficial bacteria, but it will kill most inverts (shrimp, snails, etc), if you have any. You will also want to dose methylene blue concurrently so the wounds the worms leave when they fall off will not be infected.
 

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Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #19
Do you know of any petsmart products that have trichlorfon in them? I found this but I'm not sure if it the right product Seachem Metroplex. It says its meant fir parasites.

I was only able to find it on Ebay too. So shipping is 2 weeks
 
vyrille
  • #20
Do you know of any petsmart products that have trichlorfon in them? I found this but I'm not sure if it the right product Seachem Metroplex. It says its meant fir parasites.
I'm not sure about petsmart, as I don't live in the US. If you don't have access to either of those, you can try potassium permanganate. This is available as either powder or solution, both will work. Do not mix this with methylene blue, do that as dip while dosing the tank with PP. If still not available, you can try malachite green. This is readily available in products such as ich-x or paraguard, although I've personally never tried it against anchor worms. And no, metroplex is metronidazole, it has no role in dealing with anchor worms.
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #21
I don't live in the states either I'm canadian but ill look for these new things
 
A201
  • #22
I think it likely that the Oscar is showing early symptoms of HITH disease. The sensory pits are becoming inflamed. Soon white worm looking secretions will ooze out of the pits unless things are reversed.
Metronidazole / Metroplex, mixed with food is the usual treatment for advanced HITH. If you catch HITH early on, improvement of water parameters & nutrition will clear it up.
The Bichir looks to be suffering from a bacterial infection. IMO, the success rate of aquarium specific antibiotics are marginal at best. One thing you can bet on is that dosing antibiotics will wreck havoc on your aquarium environment. Even if the Bichir survives, he will likely be blind in the one eye.
IMO, your best course of action, in the short term, is to make 2x weekly 50% WC's and feed sparingly. You might have to keep this up for a month. This will at least improve the water parameters, a probably re-establish the cycle in your tank.
There is no guaranteeing that my suggestion is going to cure everything, but blindly medicating your tank will surely guarantee a chemical cauldron of disaster.
As for appropriate tank size; bigger is always better. For Oscar advice, IMO, Dawn Michele is this forum's Oscar Guru.
 
Croix
  • Thread Starter
  • #23

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