betta with brackish water?

Discussion in 'Brackish Tanks Forum' started by blu3dragon619, Apr 1, 2012.

  1. blu3dragon619Valued MemberMember

    i heard its better for a betta in brackish water but i'm not to sure due to them being a tropical fish and all, some say it helps their gils and skin or something on that line but has anyone found or new ish its true or not?
  2. STLBluesFanValued MemberMember

    i personally, have never heard this
  3. OP

    blu3dragon619Valued MemberMember

    people use almond leafs and it turns the water brackish i have no idea, they say its for heath etc etc and for breeding something like that just though i see if any one knows anything about it

  4. iZaO JnrWell Known MemberMember

    almond leaves create a very very weak brackish environment. More than that they create more of a blackwater environment, which is useful in breeding fish.

    Betta's thrive in all our water, so there is no need to consider it for a brackish environment.
  5. soltarianknight

    soltarianknightFishlore VIPMember

    They thrive fine in regular water. Thats not saying they dont mind some salinity. Many Betta breeders and keepers will use salt(including myself) regularly with their fish. It does help with prevention of various diseases that bettas are prone to. The subject of whether splendens themselves are from brackish can be debated. While many species of bettas are found brackish, betta splenden are found in rice patty field which, surprisingly enough are fresher then the water around them. The fields are closed of areas from local water, which is brackish and are fresher which allows for the rice to grow. I guess the question would be if betta splendens already existed before rice fields and just adapted to lower salinity or if they were a different species of betta that evolved to adapt to living in the rice patties and became splendens over time. Then the fact that our Betta Splendens in the stores are all domesticated versions of their cousins. They have been bred and raised in fresh water for so long that they probably couldn't tolerate the brackish conditions of the wild, thus why we dont use very much salt. I would say, keep it simple. Keep it fresh. Add some Indian almond leaf to lower the PH and tint the water.

  6. bassbonediva

    bassbonedivaFishlore VIPMember

    Let's get the difference between true brackish water and freshwater with aquarium salt straightened out before we go any further.

    True brackish water has a salinity of 0.5-30ppt (parts per thousand). This is created by adding MARINE salt (which contains many different minerals). Brackish water is generally only found in estuaries, where rivers meet oceans and the freshwater mixes with the saltwater, thereby diluting the salinity of the water.

    Freshwater aquarium salt DOES NOT create a brackish environment. First, the chemical make up of the salt itself is completely wrong. It contains different minerals. Freshwater aquarium salt is used in restoring electrolytes to the water that fish need and helping prevent/cure infection. Second, if you read the label on the aquarium salt, it says right on it that it is not to be used as a substitute for marine aquarium salt. If you look up how to make a brackish tank, it says to use marine salt. So, basically, by adding aquarium salt to your tank, you ARE NOT creating a brackish all.

    To the OP: You may be thinking of "blackwater," as some of the other posters have suggested. Blackwater refers to the tanins in the water that make it appear like black tea. Tanins are natural compounds found in rivers, lakes, ponds, and other bodies of water. They leach out from driftwood and decaying leaves. Most fish do very well with tanins in their water, especially if they are from areas where water flow is not very high, which would lead to a natural build-up of tanins.
  7. soltarianknight

    soltarianknightFishlore VIPMember

    Knew i forgetting something. This is very important. When i talk about adding salt its AQUARIUM salt, thus not Marine salt, there is no brakish dealing there. Though itd be intresting to tes out brakish water and bettas.
  8. Sharkdude

    SharkdudeWell Known MemberMember

    "Spring" water is what I've heard is the "best water for bettas" not sure the truth to that....
  9. soltarianknight

    soltarianknightFishlore VIPMember

    Technically, tannin laced IAL water is the BEST for bettas, however its not always easy to get IAL or a tannin source. Im not really all to sure the diffrence in spring and tap(i know there is, i just dont know them XP)
  10. CichlidnutFishlore VIPMember

    After reading this thread I thought I might give it a try. I already had marine salt. I did a major re-scape in one of my betta tanks that required me to drain the tank. So I've got a 10 gallon tank with a betta in it with a SG of 1.001, I hope this goes well.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2012
  11. Lucy

    LucyModeratorModerator Member

    I'm not sure what about this thread made you decide to put a betta in a brackish tank.
    Please do some research of FW fish and osmosis.
  12. sirdarksol

    sirdarksolFishlore LegendMember

    Bettas don't come from brackish water. They come from rice paddies. Rice cannot handle brackish water (in fact, many of Japan's rice fields are currently shifted to other crops because they were flooded with ocean water when the big tsunami hit). I'm not sure what would be the purpose of trying to keep a betta in brackish water. In my opinion, that would be like putting an arctic hare into a tropical section of a conservatory, to see if it thrives better than in its native environment.
  13. CichlidnutFishlore VIPMember

    1.001 isn't brackish. Also, Bettas do not just come from rice paddies.
  14. e_watson09

    e_watson09Well Known MemberMember

    I also have no idea why a thread like this would incline you to try it out. If it goes south then how are you going to feel after putting your betta through a science experiment just so you can test it out?

    I actually don't know the obsession with putting freshwater fish into brackish/marine set ups period.

    And yes 1.001 is brackish. ANY type of marine and fresh mix IS brackish, just at a different degree.

    Now back to the OP:

    I have never heard of bettas doing better in brackish water, I would actually assume the opposite that they would do poorly in brackish tanks.

    Aquarium salt (freshwater kind) is different and although I personally don't use it or like it I do know some betta breeders who use it.
  15. sirdarksol

    sirdarksolFishlore LegendMember

    Yes, 1.001 is brackish. Rice paddies are their primary natural habitat. It's the reason they have evolved the traits they have (the ability to breathe air, the ability to handle a certain amount of shift in temperature, the ability to handle a certain amount of ammonia in the water.) Rice paddies dry up almost every year, before filling up during the rainy season. In the dry season, the bettas have to live in very little bits of water. I'm certain that bettas can be found along the edges of their primary habitat, in similar areas, but this is what they were built for.

    This is why I can't see any reason to think that bettas do better in brackish water. I echo an above comment that, perhaps the OP heard "black water," as they do live in water laced heavily with the tannins of the plants growing in and around their waterways.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2012
  16. bassbonediva

    bassbonedivaFishlore VIPMember

    Saltwater has a specific gravity (SG) of 1.021 to 1.025. A typical brackish tank has a salinity of 1.015. ANYTHING above a specific gravity of 0 is considered brackish until you hit the saltwater threshold (1.021).

    I ran into a great diagram that explained how fish process the water in their environment and why freshwater fish can't survive in saltwater and vice versa, but I can't remember where it was. I think it may have been in a book we had come through work. Like Lucy said, research freshwater fish and osmosis.

    I just hope you figure it out before you end up with a dead betta on your hands.
  17. soltarianknight

    soltarianknightFishlore VIPMember

    My inclination was more of a theoretical desire then a actual experiment. There is no reason to try it in the first place. However, betta have been around longer then rice paddies. The question was simply were splendens around or did they evolve specifically to fresh water rice fields. Could a separate group live outside of the fields and so on. Besides, not all, not even close to all, species of betta actually live in the rice fields, many live outside of them possibly in b brackish conditions. However, as i said earlier, our domestic bettas are NOT a brackish water fish.
  18. sirdarksol

    sirdarksolFishlore LegendMember

    While bettas have been around for longer than humans have been cultivating rice, this does not mean that they have been around for longer than there have been the flooded drainage basins in which these conditions exist. Sure, not all of these plants are rice, but the drainage basins they live in have the same type of setup; grassy marsh plants and water that goes away during the dry season. "Rice paddy" is just easier to say than the above sentences.
    On top of that, I have found no examples of wild betta splendens living in brackish conditions. Doesn't mean that such examples don't exist, but until I see examples, I'm going to be rather skeptical.
  19. soltarianknight

    soltarianknightFishlore VIPMember

    Very true, theres only one speices im familiar with, Betta Mahachai. Which, ironically enough, maybe the brackish water splendens(genetic arguments rage on though lol)
  20. Shawnie

    ShawnieFishlore LegendMember

    I have a few reputable betta breeding friends as well as have bred them myself (for my own pleasures). NONE of them have kept their bettas in with salt/brakish setups. Although some will use it as medicinal purposes, (to each their own on that choice) I wouldnt put a betta in a brakish tank.

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