Betta Fish Spitting Out Food....not A New Fish

Hello All-

Recently my 4.5 month old Betta fish started spitting out his food. He looks excited to eat and quickly goes for it like always... and then spits it out and eats it...and spits it out again. Once he's done it like 3 times.. I'll just take the pellets out. Sometimes he will eat them after a while.. sometimes not. I am feeding him the same micro pellets I always have. Previously he would sometimes eat all 3 of them at a time.

I have always fed him just pellets. Times I tried to change up his diet (frozen Brine Shrimp) he didn't eat it... but I think that may be bc they didn't float.

I had a little scare with him recently bc I thought he wasn't pooping. He doesn't look constipated and wasn't acting different. I just didn't see poop in the tank like I always do.

I think part of the reason this is happening is because I just recently noticed I have detritus worms. I think they may have come in with a new plant. At first I freaked out... but later learned they can actually be beneficial in keeping down waste etc. I think this may be the reason for the lack of poop.. and there is also a lot less plant decay on the sand.... almost none. Where there was previously a lot.

I think my betta may be eating the worms.... or nibbling on them. Sometimes I see him focusing on something on the bottom of the tank.. and then he comes to the top and spits out some little white specks.

I know for new bettas.. spitting out food is common. My question is... has anyone had this experience with a not new betta? That they will spit out pellets they previously gobbled up right away? Is my fish just sick of the food? Is he spoiled now because he is eating live worms? lol. Also.. he did this earlier last week.. and I starved him for a few days.. and then he started eating the pellets again... but I gave him the tiniest ones I could find, one at a time.. and no spitting. This morning I didn't... maybe he suddenly wants only small ones? Maybe he is confused by the texture now that he also eats worms?

Should I be concerned? He seems to be healthy otherwise. He has a bit of a stress stripe, but I think that was from the PH change a few weeks ago that has now been resolved. He is back to being his very active self.

 

It may be that the food is not as fresh as it used to be and he just doesn't like the taste!

 

I actually thought that last week... and I bought a new container of food! He started eating the new pellets again no problem after I starved him for a few days.. and now pulled this again this morning.

I was being careful to give him only small pellets though. Maybe I should try that?

I am also feeding him a lot less in general. I used to feed him twice a day... now only once. I figure if he is eating worms.. I don't want to over feed. Plus the twice a day was becoming a hassle bc I don't always get home at the same time, etc.

 

You could be right about the worms. Detritus worms tend to show up when there's excess food around anyway so reducing his food will also reduce theirs.

 

HI there. What are your water parameters? Not eating can be a symptom of water quality issues.

I would definitely do a good vacuuming to get any excess food up, and try to get those worms out of the tank. As Aquaphobia said, they are a direct result of over feeding and the food rotting on the bottom of the tank. So it is good that you decrease the feeding.

As far as frozen brine shrimp, did you thaw it before feeding? It should float in bit of a cloud in front of him. You don’t need very much. You could also do frozen blood worms, or dried blood worms, that have been pre-soaked. Bettas get bored with their foods, so changing them up is important.

Also do a weekly 24 hour fast, followed by a blanched deshelled pea to help prevent digestive issues. See if that helps too.

Tank cleaning/get rid of worms
Change foods
Weekly fasting with peas.

Hope this helps with things. Good luck.

 

I clean the tank once a week. I didn't do a water change yet this week bc.. with the advice of a family member who is a long time fish keeper.. I was doing too many water changes and too much water. 50% once a week. It made it hard to keep the tank (5 gallon) stable given I have soft water. I also used to gravel vac when I changed water every week.

I read that people often believe Detritus worms is the result of overfeeding, but that is a myth. Or people are getting them confused with Planaria worms. I never had let over food in the tank.. I watched the fish eat every thing. The appearance of these worms directly corresponded to me adding a plant.

Tank parameters ph 7, ammonia, nitrites, nitrites all zero. KH in tank about 5 drops. GH in tank about 5 drops. (KH and GH out of tap is like practically nothing... I have some rocks in the tank that help give GH to plants)

I already do a 24 hour fast for the fish and always have.

Tried a pea and he wouldn't eat it..spit it out. This is also when he started to get picky with the pellets. Before that he ate them no problem...its like me trying to feed him the pea triggered this whole picky eating business.... odd.

I did pre-soak the Brine Shrimp...I think that's what made them sink to the bottom right? I've read another place that I can feed them a small piece of a frozen cube with a tweezer or toothpick and it will thaw when it hits the water.. at least this way it will be at the top so he can eat it?? That's what I was thinking. Thawing first did not work and made a big mess.

I have read that detritus worms are normal part of the planted aquarium and typically live in the substrate and go unnoticed and are helpful for tank maintenance. I think mine only came out of the substrate because I accidentally had the filter outflow kicking up the sand and I didn't realize.

Just an observation.. not saying anyone's advice is wrong or whatever... but it seems that on these forums the advice given by everyone is always.. more water changes.. more water changes. Whereas in "real life"..... aquarium stores... (and I don't mean Petco... I mean trusted aquarium stores.. I live in NYC, so we have some world known trusted stores here) or other people that you talk to in person that have actually owned fish for many years.... you tell them about the amount of water changes you are doing and they look at you like you are crazy. That you are making the tank unstable... and causing more problems.

Even though you are matching the "ph" when you do whatever changes etc... that is still NEW water.... and the water changes once it settles in your tank.. and comes into contact with.. your substrate.. plants... driftwood... etc. People's argument is always.... if its the same PH it would not shock the fish.... but PH is not the only attribute of water. My brother (long term fish owner) said... imagine someone coming in and changing the air in your house all the time.... kinda true.

If a tank is cycled properly.. has no ammonia... no nitrate and low nitrates (my test never show any that I can see from the test.. its the real test... not the strips).. why change the water so often?? I can understand more if your tank is over stocked.

This is not to say either advice is right or wrong.. but I am always having this battle with myself...am I changing too much? And then I post on here and people are like.. more water changes. There is so much conflicting advice. Changing 50% of the water once a week seems like a lot to me.... and I don't think doing more water changes is going to be good for stability. I was thinking to change the water once every two weeks now... to try and get the tank more stable.

I'm wondering if this is a NYC versus other parts of the country difference. In NYC we have very soft water with hardly any minerals.. and if water parameters need to be adjusted for your fish.... (crushed coral in the filter) etc... it takes a few days for that to take effect... you water change at the end of that week... what's the point?.. starting all over again. With hard water... its much harder to change parameters of the water.... so the water you are putting in from the tap is probably closer to what your tank settles to. I dunno... I know I am just rambling... but I can't get over how vastly different people's advice is on this matter and I really wonder why.

Regardless, I appreciate everyone's input.. I am just confused on what to follow.

I have tried to slowly get out some of the worms out since last week by sucking them out with a turkey baster and then replacing that small about of water every 2 days.. which is only 1/2 quart or something. So even though I didn't do a water change this week... there has been maintenance and some new water.

 

Actually in a small tank and especially with soft water doing fewer water changes will lead to instability. You want to do more frequent smaller changes to really keep it on an even keel. With low mineral content in the water you really don't have the buffering capacity to keep the pH from crashing. Remember that your cycle bacteria use carbonates so if you don't have much to begin with they'll get used up and you'll end up with what's known as old tank syndrome. Then you do a big water change, your pH swings back up and since all the bacteria gave up the ghost you probably have unprocessed ammonium. It isn't killing your fish because at low pH it's in the form of ammonium but as soon as the pH goes up it converts to ammonia and your fish suffer.

 

See I read that too... but that has not been my experience at all. I am having trouble seeing the "science" play out in my tank. before I got my fish and was cycling the tank.. I wasn't changing the water much at all.. the PH was stable and all of my plants were living. Once I got the fish and started changing the water every week.. my plants literally started melting. I realized after going through like a dozen plants and talking to someone in a fish store that this was because the water I was putting in has NO GH which was starving the plants... however... once the water is in the tank.... it will build up GH from the elements in the tank to create stability... crushed coral being my main one. Soft water becomes more stable with natural elements in the water to stabilize it.

I added seiyu rock to my tank which seems to have resolved my GH problem even with the weekly water changes and my plants now live.

When you have no minerals to begin with... added that mineral deficient water causes more problems.

I am thinking about the amount of water I changed slowly over this week when trying to removing the worms..... and I have these small 1 and 2.5 qtz buckets..... I think it must be about 1 gallon over the whole week.. so that's 25%. So it was probably between 20 and 25%. I think I can manage doing two very small water changes each week.... 2 qtz (1/2 gallon each). It was actually less time consuming than my usual 50% once a week and didn't cause any crazy fluctuations.

Do you think a 1/2 gallon twice a week is a good schedule for a 5 gallon tank? This would mean with the two water changes.... I end up changing out 25% of the water total.

Basically, was getting aggravated by the situation bc I felt I couldn't do any more than I was currently doing with my 50% once a week... it was taking me a while on the weekend... bc I was add the water back slowly.. etc etc. But I think doing these two small changes per week with 2 qtz of water each time.... that may be better for my tank and actually work better for my schedule as well.

Sorry if I'm sounding all annoyed today... just having a little frustrations with this hobby.

 

Yeah, aquarium chemistry is confusing and I'm not even sure the people doing the explaining really understand it either

Have you thought about adding minerals to your water? Then you don't have to wait for them to dissolve out of the rocks.

 

Jen514Ab I have the same issues... and I agree with your logic - and find the same thing plays out with my planted tanks. My tap water is very soft too, and I have seiyu stone and crushed coral in my tanks as well. If you get something like equilibrium (which is a GH booster) and alkaline buffer (for KH - also by seachem) to add to the new water, you can match what your tank waters params are, and be able to change as much water as you want. Also, if two 25% changes are easier, go for it!

 

ummm I have seen products like "trace" which I think add minerals right? You know.. it occurred to me.. but I really just don't know much about it. Since I have my plants surviving now with the rocks... I am kinda like... if it aint broke don't fix it you know? And they look nice as well... the rocks I mean. I am only keeping very easy plants... Anubius and Java Fern. I do add a betta water buffer from Seachem... Seachem recommended that product when I was telling them about my plant problem. So there are nutrients for the plants in that... and minerals I believe.. for both the plants and betta. I do not like to add a ton of that though bc it is phosphate based. which.. causes algae apparently. I have some Algae... but nothing crazy.

If I feel the plants need more nutrients during the week I also have Seachem Flourish... does that have minerals? I'm all confused by all the products... Flourish.. Trace... etc etc.
I think I went too crazy trying to use everything I thought I needed in the beginning.. trying to simplify now. I also just started "aging" the new water.. which I read is better for unstable water.

Do you feed your betta frozen brine shrimp? If so, how to you feed it to him at the top of the tank? I think I want to try again giving it to my fish tomorrow.

 

Aging wster is more important only if you have a lot of dissolved CO2 in it which causes the water to be acidic. Once the CO2 offgases the pH goes back up. That where the instability comes from. No CO2 no need to age the water.

 

I use a pipette to squirt them out one by one-ish in his face... bloodworms are easier.. lol, one of my guys will yank the worm out (I'll push one worm out halfway, & let him grab it), and he'll wiggle/tear it away like a dog playing with a rope lol.. so cute! My other guy turns his nose up at bloodworms and I've been giving him live mosquito larvae (he's smarter than my other guy, who I don't think would catch them in time... don't want mosquitoes in the house lol!) edit: I also feed them pellets Omega one Betta buffet... also, what's funny is I can feel the force he yanks on the bloodworms with!

Also, flourish is plant food, won't have an effect on your GH/KH... equilibrium (GH) is for planted tanks and yes, it took me awhile to sort out all the differences in their products lol! Alkaline buffer is the other one you would want. (For KH)

Also, I defrost the chunk of frozen in warm water in a disposable shot glass, & the mix with water helps in picking up the shrimp/worms in smaller amounts so I don't squirt too much in the tank

 

But how would I know if I have dissolved C02?? lol... is that a dumb question? I was told by someone on this site that aging the water helps with "off gassing" especially after adding the chemicals to the water. The problem I was having was.. I would add the water.. and the PH would drop when added.. (even if it matched the tank PH originally).. and then go back up again... or sometimes keep dropping. It just was very unstable the first few days.

I actually do have Equilibrium.. but do not use it. Since having the Seiryu rock in the tank my GH is good, so I haven't had the need to add it.

Haha thanks for the tips on feeding the frozen food. I'll try squirting them in my fish's face! lolol layful:

 

Not a dumb question!

Take a bucket of tap water and test the pH. Then run an air stone in it for a few hours and test the pH again.

 

Lol

The equilibrium will be good for adding to the new water before putting in the tank... if your PH fluctuates like you describe, then you probably should age it... does aging it help keep the fluctuations minimal? Also, do what Aquaphobia said above (and no, not a dumb question at all!!)

 

Hmm ok.. I will try that. Gotta see if I can borrow an airstone. If I have a lot of dissolved CO2 would the PH go down after the airstone? When I do this.. should I not add any of my typical chemicals like my betta buffer ?

 

Nope, don't add any chemicals. You don't really need the air stone, it's just that agitation helps to release the dissolved gases more quickly so you don't have as long to wait for a result.

Dissolved CO2 forms a weak acid which results in a lower pH. Driving that off if there is any should result in a higher pH.

 

ahh ok.. thank you for the tips!

My fish ate his pellets his morning. I fed them to him one at a time... and picked the small looking ones lol. He did not spit anything out. I think he learned his lesson since yesterday morning after I removed them when he spit them out.

Sometimes if I just put all 3 in a once he will gobble up all 3 at once... he used to do this all of the time without a problem. Now it seems he needs smaller bites.

OK this is a reallyyyyy silly question.. get ready....

Is it possible that a fish can injure or lose its teeth?? I ask because before all this started.. I noticed by fish seemed to be crunching on his pellets more than usual... as if they were harder than usual....I could hear the crunching. I think some of them could've gotten wet when I put the spoon back in the food... causing them to dry harder.

I've gotten new food since... but maybe he is having trouble chewing some larger pieces because he injured something (his teeth??) with all that hard crunching?? lololol

 

Hey, sounds good to me!

 

Hello All-

Recently my 4.5 month old Betta fish started spitting out his food. He looks excited to eat and quickly goes for it like always... and then spits it out and eats it...and spits it out again. Once he's done it like 3 times.. I'll just take the pellets out. Sometimes he will eat them after a while.. sometimes not. I am feeding him the same micro pellets I always have. Previously he would sometimes eat all 3 of them at a time.

I have always fed him just pellets. Times I tried to change up his diet (frozen Brine Shrimp) he didn't eat it... but I think that may be bc they didn't float.

I had a little scare with him recently bc I thought he wasn't pooping. He doesn't look constipated and wasn't acting different. I just didn't see poop in the tank like I always do.

I think part of the reason this is happening is because I just recently noticed I have detritus worms. I think they may have come in with a new plant. At first I freaked out... but later learned they can actually be beneficial in keeping down waste etc. I think this may be the reason for the lack of poop.. and there is also a lot less plant decay on the sand.... almost none. Where there was previously a lot.

I think my betta may be eating the worms.... or nibbling on them. Sometimes I see him focusing on something on the bottom of the tank.. and then he comes to the top and spits out some little white specks.

I know for new bettas.. spitting out food is common. My question is... has anyone had this experience with a not new betta? That they will spit out pellets they previously gobbled up right away? Is my fish just sick of the food? Is he spoiled now because he is eating live worms? lol. Also.. he did this earlier last week.. and I starved him for a few days.. and then he started eating the pellets again... but I gave him the tiniest ones I could find, one at a time.. and no spitting. This morning I didn't... maybe he suddenly wants only small ones? Maybe he is confused by the texture now that he also eats worms?

Should I be concerned? He seems to be healthy otherwise. He has a bit of a stress stripe, but I think that was from the PH change a few weeks ago that has now been resolved. He is back to being his very active self.

My betta does the same thing. He hates brine shrimp. I also have those worms but they are harmless so don't worry. If you can get him to eat anything try blood worms.

- thaw frozen cube in room temp water
- take one out on a toothpick and wiggle it in the water
- betta will love it :>

also your betta probably isn't eating the worms. They are so small they pretty much never even see them. I just feed my betta whenever he looks like he needs food ( I tell by his tummy. He has been eating the shrimp babies so I haven't fed him in DAYS. he is so full from babies lol )

 

yeah the worms are extremely small. I do see him come to the stop and spit white stuff out of his mouth though.. I think he is hunting them lol.

My betta does not look bloated at all...and he acts all hungry like usual. I used to feed him twice a day but switched to feeding him once. I actually have frozen worms to feed him.... and I want to... but I worry he'll like the worms so much and not want to eat pellets... and I know a diet of just blood worms isn't the best. I was thinking maybe I can take the brine shrimp and roll it into small bits.. like balls/pellets. Might make it easier for the fish to eat it or recognize it as food. My issue with the Brine shrimp is its consistency... how is the fish supposed to chase all this little shreddings... Bettas aren't though types of eaters lol.

The one worry I still have is the lack of poop. Do you notice the the worms eat the fish's poop? Since I've gotten these worms.. my tank looks a lotttt cleaner. There is no fish poop on the bottom or even plant decay. Prior my white sand was always looking dirty.

 

Try mysis shrimp over brine.. they're larger

 

ahhhh are they? ok.. I didnt know that. I might even have baby brine shrimp... not sure though. Maybe that is also part of the issue.

 

So I got the Mysis shrimp and feed them to my betta this morning! He ate them! yay! One of the mysis shrimps actually feel off the tweezers into the water.. and he went after it =) I feed him 2 of them.... I think that seems okay.

Thanks for the suggestion. These are definitely better than the Brine shrimp with them being bigger. Because at least I can actually grab an actual shrimp and give it to him and its not just crumbs floating in the tank. I don't even see an actual shrimp from the frozen brine package.

So... I think what I thought were "worms" in my tank are actually Copepods. They are super tiny and do not move like worms. but apparently copepods are harmless too.

 

I had a betta who actually used to hunt copepods. I have no idea how he could even see them.

Yay on the success with the mysis shrimp!!!

 

Yay! Glad it worked for you!