Betta Finrot . Pick A Treatment. Tank Mates To Consider

Discussion in 'Freshwater Aquarium Quarantine' started by sassymomma, Apr 19, 2017.

  1. sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    My Betta looks like he's developed finrot

    He was in a community tank during February when it was struck with a fungal infection

    Everyone was treated

    While in the qt tank, he lost a chunk of fin, and I separated him from the rest and continued treatment. He recovered

    Since then the tank was sterilized and set up for him. I watched him closely, doing water changes daily or other day while it cycled

    Currently we run with 0ammonia. .25nitrites, 10nitrates..ph7.5

    I am still doing daily or every other day changes


    However......his heater malfunctioned, dropped his tank to 72

    I have taken the hated blue j├Ąger heater (he hates it, I love it) and brought it from the other tank to warm his water. Which means bringing his old buddy the bn pleco, because the big tank gets too cold without a heater.

    So this tank now holds a Betta, 2nerite snails and a pleco

    It's a 29 gallon, cycling.

    I'm just trying to determine the best treatment option for the fish, given that he has tank mates

    I have aquarium salt
    Epson salt
    Tetra fungas guard

    Here are some pics[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
  2. adh/smile

    adh/smile Well Known Member Member

    I'm so sorry to hear your betta's fin-rot issues! Poor guy!!!
    I like to stay away from medications unless I absolutely NEED to use them, but I would suggest you raise the temperature higher than 72. Maybe 75-80? I don't know what BN and snails temperature requirements are. That will help skive off any further infection and rot a little bit. I would also suggest you do epsom salt baths and continue with the water changes. I would do every other to every three day water changes. You don't want to stress your fish out while they are in the healing process too much.
    I hope this helps and your betta gets better!!!
     
  3. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    I've raised it to...hang on let me check....76

    I was going to raise it again in a bit

    Already it's warmer than the preset heater was holding it

    I have a touch of Epson in his tank about two tsp to the 20 or so gallons that is in there

    I don't know what pleco salt tolerance is, so I was going slow-adding a teaspoon with each water change (I change 5gallons at a time)


    It never occurred to me that changes might stress him....he always hangs out by the syphon and then swims into the clean water as I pour. He's not your normal Betta.....enjoys the community tank and likes current. He even bottom-feeds pellets, because he learned from his tank mates

    However, I believe that he is of the typical poor pet store genetics, because he seems prone to rot ever since he came home
     




    Last edited: Apr 19, 2017
  4. adh/smile

    adh/smile Well Known Member Member

     
    Here is a good web sight I have found helpful. You might already know all the things it says but I thought I'd share it anyway.

    I would bathe your betta in epsom salts in a separate container or 5 gallon bucket for 10-15 minutes. Then you won't stress your betta out too much. Though it will still be somewhat stressful to net your betta every day, the salt bath will be more beneficial.

    My betta is similar to yours. He loves being social and bottom feeding if there is anything to eat down there. I don't think that genetics have anything to do with fin rot. It might. But I've never heard of that connection.

    Hope this helps!
     
  5. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    Thanks I'll check it out

    I'm going out tomorrow so I'll grab a pair of containers for the purpose
     
  6. KimberlyG

    KimberlyG Fishlore VIP Member

    Epsom salt acts differently than Aquarium salt. Epsom draws fluids out and acts as a mild laxative. Aquarium salt is a tonics for healing and aids in gill function. They do very different things.
     
  7. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    Ok, Thanks for clearing that up

    He's not constipated , just ragged....so I will stop the Epson
     
  8. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    SO I was cleaning up my photos last night...and it occurs to me that this boy has had fin rot to one degree or another almost since we had him.

    I wonder if theere is someting more at play here than simple water quality.

    He has been on Tetra fungas guard during this time- that was when he was in the QT, and it got worse. It might help now, except I think I read that fin rot is bacterial in nature, not fungal. I don't thing he was in the tank when I dosed the community whe Antibiotics, so he probably missed that...He was in there for Lifeguard

    Water is currently 0ammonia, 0nitrite..I only have 2 tubes but last time I looked the nitrates were 10. I'm going to pick up some containers today for salt baths, as I have nothing that was not already used for other things.

    He's perked up since yesterday, but his tail is now in 4 strips..he looks like a crowntail :(

    The photo in my Avatar is him in February, after his recovery from a round of rot- that one was very minor. This- his worst yet
     
  9. pumpernickel

    pumpernickel Valued Member Member

    So my betta's tail is almost always slightly ripped up. But this is a pretty normal problem for these guys as they have long flowing fins. Have you ever seen long finned varieties of, say, cories or plecos? Have you ever noticed that they are almost always frayed? Basically, the same thing can happen to bettas. Especially when they can happily swim all over, and there are decorations they can squeeze themselves through and get caught on. He could be tearing his fins allowing infection to set in on the injuries. Basically, if this is the case, you just have to keep an eye on new injuries. Now, I know people like to avoid medication, myself included (I study microbio quite a lot as a student) but if you are noticing recurrences, I would recommend a round of kanamycin or tetracycline (both are broad spectrum antibiotics). If you chose to do this however, he needs to be quarantined. The snails would be fine, but since plecos are scaleless, it's best to resuce risk. The issue with the long-term use of salt treatments is that bacteria actually have an easy time growing accustomed to hyper saline environments and the salt become less effective over time. I also use Indian Almond Leaves in my tank. I don't know how well they work per se, but my snail loves to eat them.
     
  10. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    I also prefer to avoid meds

    I usually add a little salt, keep his water clean, and watch for improvements

    He always has thus far

    I like that salt changes out of the water after a few cleanings, and there is no restrictions telling me to not clean my tank for a number of days


    He is a very active Betta, well known for squeezing into tight spaces...I have rearranged his tank multiple times to compensate for the habit

    I think that this round was triggered by his heater malfunction, and resulting temperature fluctuations
     
  11. adh/smile

    adh/smile Well Known Member Member

    Thank you for adding that! I seem to have forgotten to clear that up myself. Sorry about that.
    Another big thing about the trouble with betta fins ripping so easily is because of their breeding. Fin rot does not come from their breeding or genetics but their extraordinarily long, beautiful, and fragile tails do. This new way of breeding bettas (particularly the males) is a thing pet owners have done over the years to enhance color and tail beauty. Now, over time, the betta tails have become so long they are no longer natural. The tails actually prevents the betta from swimming normally to some degree. Since the fins are literally just hanging off the betta as a sort of "drag" it is very easily out of the control of the betta making the tail very prone to get snagged on things in its environment. The betta just does not have enough mobility to move its tail out of harms way before the tail gets ripped. There is nothing we can really do about the bettas that have already been genetically "altered" in a way to look more beautiful. The only thing we can do as fish owners, is to make sure there is as little objects for our little guys to get snagged on.
    I would definitely try to prevent as little small places for him to hide in as possible. Having too small a space might cause his fins to get pinched as he turns around or get snagged on something in that small space. I had a betta once who loved small spaces too and he actually dislodged a rock and squashed himself. He was the most stupid betta I ever owned. So just be cautious about the small spaces and make sure 100% that it can not collapse on the betta!!!
     
  12. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    Exactly

    This time round I went with plants, coconut huts, and a glass bowl. He has a sponge filter instead of HOB, because he has been known to wrap around the intake and lose tail segments to the filter.

    The only thing in there not fully "Betta proof", is the log that I brought for the pleco. I placed that so that the Betta can't use the natural cave in it as the end could snag him [​IMG]
     
  13. pumpernickel

    pumpernickel Valued Member Member

    Sometimes they honestly don't even need to get snagged. The drag created by them swimming can cause their tails to become frayed. This happens a lot with the really active, young bettas. The best you can do is keep the water clean and warm. But to be honest, fish are a lot less sensitive to meds than people may realize (the exception being for things like copper). If you become worried that it may advance to body rot, or that it keeps reemerging, don't be afraid to use a broad spectrum antibiotic. These ore only toxic to fish and people at concentrations high enough to enter and inhibit the functionality of mitochondria in the cells. With antibiotics, the biggest concern is resistance, so it is important to follow the instructions exactly and not end treatment early. Also, less is more. Usually one or two rounds is sufficient for external infection.
     
  14. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    well, he's still pretty active...and his colour is as good as always. He's making bubble nests and eating well, so I don't feel like he's sick. He's probably torn from activity and cool water.

    I have him up to 79 now- that's the max the pleco can stand. When I buy him a smaller heater, I'll lower his water level a bit, and give him less work to get to the top- I had to raise it to the minimum fill line on the thermostat, making his water level about 11" deep, where I'd been keeping it closer to 9 before. I can see him working to reach the top and he's got new holes in his ventrals....I expect to see those tear soon too[​IMG]
     
  15. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

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    Attached Files:

  16. KimberlyG

    KimberlyG Fishlore VIP Member

    He's got that darker, almost melted or singed thing happening at the very tips of his fins. Keep doing the clean water changes that you have been doing but be prepared to move on to nitrofurazone and furazolidone if it gets worse.
     
  17. pumpernickel

    pumpernickel Valued Member Member

    I also see pinhole fin rot, so be sure to keep an eye on that, too.
     
  18. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    I have the med on hand and ready to go. Taking regular pics to compare progress/recession

    I got a smaller heater today so I can lower his water level for him to limit activity a bit
     
  19. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    Decided to add the med

    I left the water level higher, which gives me the option to syphon pleco poop without messing with his dosage-I just won't refill what I remove

    Waiting on the nerites to complain and crawl to the top, then I will remove them
     
  20. OP
    OP
    sassymomma

    sassymomma Well Known Member Member

    It looks like the pin holes on the Caudial fin??(bottom fin) have closed

    The tail is not in ribbons anymore.....splits only go to about 2cm from his body, instead of splitting the entire fin

    He's swimming better, and spreading his lower fins and tail a bit when making bubble nests

    I have yet to see him raise the top(ventral?? ) fin, so I can't speak on it's condition[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     




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