Axolotl setup questions!

Yeah that's probably not enough filtration. I just looked that filter up, and it's rated for 10-20 gallons, and is the smallest, least powerful filter in the Whisper line. I think the cloudiness is axolotl poop. Axolotls require extra filtration because they poop a lot. Which is kind of a pain because they require low flow. For most heavy poopers you could just get a more powerful filter, but not so much an axolotl. In my personal opinion, this is why HOB filters aren't a good option for axolotls. A more powerful HOB filter will cause a stronger current in the water. For this reason I always suggest sponge filters for axolotls. I personally use a sponge filter that is rated for 55 gallons in my 20 gallon axolotl tank.

An external canister filter would also be a good option, as the input and output can both be directed and controlled however you want, and it has very extensive and customizable filtration. But canister filters are also much more expensive than sponge filters.

 

Yeah that's probably not enough filtration. I just looked that filter up, and it's rated for 10-20 gallons, and is the smallest, least powerful filter in the Whisper line. I think the cloudiness is axolotl poop. Axolotls require extra filtration because they poop a lot. Which is kind of a pain because they require low flow. For most heavy poopers you could just get a more powerful filter, but not so much an axolotl. In my personal opinion, this is why HOB filters aren't a good option for axolotls. A more powerful HOB filter will cause a stronger current in the water. For this reason I always suggest sponge filters for axolotls. I personally use a sponge filter that is rated for 55 gallons in my 20 gallon axolotl tank.

An external canister filter would also be a good option, as the input and output can both be directed and controlled however you want, and it has very extensive and customizable filtration. But canister filters are also much more expensive than sponge filters.

That could be why! I’m gonna keep this filter on it but could I add a sponge filter to the tank or will that cause a minI cycle? Plus I have an air pump and don’t really need it for the air stone, that was just a bonus! It’s marina 75 air pump... idk what that calculates too or what size air pump that would be but I’m sure this could help with maintaining the tank.

Now Ik why I feel like I have to keep doing water changes!!!

 

Keeping your existing filter on the tank and adding a secondary filter is exactly how you seed a new filter. You run both filters for a week or 2, and during that time the beneficial bacteria that already exists on your current filter will spread to the new filter. It will NOT cause a minI cycle so long as you don't remove the old filter for, like I said, a week or 2. I personally run dual filters on a few of my tanks, so that way any time I set up a new tank, I can just steal one of my pre-seeded filters and some used tank water, and I don't have to cycle the new tank.

You might find that running both filters does indeed cause too much of a flow and irritate your axolotl. If you run across this problem, let me know here because I can help you overcome that hurdle.

That air pump model is rated for tanks up to 25 gallons, so in conjunction with the existing filter it will be strong enough. If you do remove the old filter eventually, you may have to upgrade the pump.

 

Keeping your existing filter on the tank and adding a secondary filter is exactly how you seed a new filter. You run both filters for a week or 2, and during that time the beneficial bacteria that already exists on your current filter will spread to the new filter. It will NOT cause a minI cycle so long as you don't remove the old filter for, like I said, a week or 2. I personally run dual filters on a few of my tanks, so that way any time I set up a new tank, I can just steal one of my pre-seeded filters and some used tank water, and I don't have to cycle the new tank.

You might find that running both filters does indeed cause too much of a flow and irritate your axolotl. If you run across this problem, let me know here because I can help you overcome that hurdle.

That air pump model is rated for tanks up to 25 gallons, so in conjunction with the existing filter it will be strong enough. If you do remove the old filter eventually, you may have to upgrade the pump.

Thank you so much! Is there anything else I need for the sponge filter? I just assume you attach the tubing to the sponge and then it filters???

 

Yep that's it. Ideally you should have a check valve for safety. If the pump were to stop for any reason, you don't want water to back up into it.

 

Which one is better for Baymax???

 

Get the one rated for the larger tank. Your air pump will control the bubbles, so if you're worried the filter will be too much, don't be.

Also, I noticed you are keeping guppies and shrimp with your axolotl. I don't know if you are aware of this, but that is strongly advised against. Are they meant to be feeders?

 

Get the one rated for the larger tank. Your air pump will control the bubbles, so if you're worried the filter will be too much, don't be.

Also, I noticed you are keeping guppies and shrimp with your axolotl. I don't know if you are aware of this, but that is strongly advised against. Are they meant to be feeders?

Thanks for the advice!

The guppies and shrimp were meant to just help with the cycle and provide that source of ammonia while cycling /seeding... then I kept them in it to provide a source of food if he ever got hungry and I wasn’t there. I know they are advised against but others in the past have done just fine with them. He ate one of the he fishes a few days ago but that’s it. I could add them to my 55 but that tank is already overstocked. Do you think they play a role in the cloudiness???

 

Any livestock in the tank could be contributing to the cloudiness, but I'm pretty sure that's mostly the axi's fault. I understand you used those fish to cycle the tank. And yes, the axI will eat them eventually. I just didn't know if you intended to keep them as permanent tank mates, because that could stress him out in the long term. The guppies might even nip at his gills, because those gills look an awful lot like bloodworms. I don't want to tell you what you can and can't do with YOUR tank, though. I just wanted to make you aware of the risks and the reasons it's advised against.

 

So I did a water change to try to reduce the cloudiness. Went and bought a sponge filter, hooked it up and thought everything was good but now it seems more cloudy also, the sponge won’t sink... is that Normal for a sponge filter? It’s also bubbling... here’s what it look liked this morning:


After water change:


And now:

 

Squeeze the sponge in the tank water, it will sink once you get all the air out of it.

Oh wow that is super cloudy. It got cloudier when you did a water change? It looks just as cloudy in the before picture as it does in the after picture, to me. How long has it been since adding the new filter?

 

Squeeze the sponge in the tank water, it will sink once you get all the air out of it.

Oh wow that is super cloudy. It got cloudier when you did a water change? It looks just as cloudy in the before picture as it does in the after picture, to me. How long has it been since adding the new filter?

Not long, about two hours now... will it hopefully resolve itself with the new filter or do I need to do something else? I mean Baymax is swimming around and has a straight tail so he’s not stressed I think

 

Give it 24 hours.

 

Update:
So I took photos throughout the night to try to keep track of the cloudiness.
Here’s 9:00


10:00



I also just noticed his tail is curved... could that be because of the cloudiness? I will test water tomorrow. I also didn’t feed him much today, as water was too cloudy so could that be it? In addition, when I do water changes, I read to add the conditioner to the tank after removing water and then adding water to tank... is that correct?

 

I don't see a change in the cloudiness. I hate to say it, but it may be possible that your bacteria colony died and your tank went out of cycle. I say this because, no, it is not correct that you should put the water conditioner in the tank last. The water conditioner should either go into the tank before new water does, or, ideally, it should be mixed with the new water. Tap water contains chemicals like chlorine and chloramine, which kill bacteria. You're trying to maintain a beneficial bacteria colony in the tank, that will break down and deal with fish and axI poop. The water getting cloudier after you do water changes, and even after adding additional filtration, is a symptom of a bacteria bloom. I mentioned this in an earlier post but you said your water parameters were in check, so I went with it being filtration.

Here's what you should be doing when you change the water:

1: Remove the axI from the tank. With fish you don't normally have to do this, but considering the water coming out of your tap is at least 10 degrees warmer than the axi's tank is, you will need to temperature acclimate him after the water change. If you change the water with him in the tank, the temp will change too fast for him. Put him in a tupperware of tank water and sit the lid over it (don't seal it). If you can use the container to catch him, instead of a net, that would be ideal, because then he would never be removed from water, but sometimes these guys can be hard to catch so you may have to use a net to coax him into the container. Also remove all hides, caves, fake plants, and other loose decorations and ornaments from the tank. Keep real plants in the tank. Unplug your HOB filter.

2: Drain the water from the tank with your siphon hose. You should be using a gravel vac for this. Using a gravel vac is how you will suck up all the waste that is sitting on the tank floor, like poop, or uneaten, decaying food. You should have removed all the caves and whatnot, so make sure you vac where those sit. I know you have sand, but you should still be using a gravel vac. People who say "I can't use a gravel vac because I have sand" are wrong. Just hover the vac barely above the sand, so you suck up all the stuff sitting on top of the sand without actually sucking up the sand. If you do suck up some sand, put a kink in the hose to stop the siphon, the sand will fall back out, then release the kink to continue the siphon. Take the carbon cartridge out of your HOB filter and rinse it off in the bucket of dirty tank water, then put it back in the filter.

Since you are trying to clear up this cloudy water, I suggest you remove 75%-90% of the water. Normally I do not suggest this large of a water change, but in this case, it's kind of necessary. DO NOT do a 100% water change. As a routine water change, I would suggest you change 25-50% of the water. This will cause a less severe temperature swing, but still enough that warrants removing the axi.

3: Fill a bucket that has never been used for chemicals or soaps or anything other than new tank water, and is a separate bucket from your dirty tank water bucket. While the bucket is filling, pour your water conditioner into the bucket, and only pour in the amount you need for each bucket. This will stir in the water condoner while the bucket fills. Be sure to only use cold water.

4: When pouring the new water into the tank, try not to disrupt the substrate (sand). Disrupting the sand will kick up a bunch of debris, and, well, cloudy the water. You can do this several ways. Some people put a large item, like a rock, or a plate into the tank, and pour the water onto that. Some people transfer the water to a smaller container, like a pitcher, and pour the water in more slowly. Some people put the bucket of new water on a higher shelf than the tank and use their siphon hose to transfer the water into the tank. Some people use a combination of these methods. Whatever method you use, just try to kick up as little substrate as possible. When the tank is full, turn your filter back on.

(If you use a python or similar water change system, steps 3 and 4 will be different. You should dose the tank with enough water condoner for the entire tank before putting in new water, however you should still try not to disrupt the substrate)

5: Put the container that you put your axI in into the tank, and float acclimate him for 15-30 minutes, until the temperature in the container matches the temperature of the tank, then release him back into the tank.

For this water change, you may also need to add a bacteria product since your tank was possibly kicked out of cycle. But let's get the results of your water test before we decide if that's necessary. We will need to know your ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. Also, does the tank smell? Not just a slight musky smell, I mean like a fishy smell.

I'm sorry for the super long post I just want to be as helpful as possible.

 

I don't see a change in the cloudiness. I hate to say it, but it may be possible that your bacteria colony died and your tank went out of cycle. I say this because, no, it is not correct that you should put the water conditioner in the tank last. The water conditioner should either go into the tank before new water does, or, ideally, it should be mixed with the new water. Tap water contains chemicals like chlorine and chloramine, which kill bacteria. You're trying to maintain a beneficial bacteria colony in the tank, that will break down and deal with fish and axI poop. The water getting cloudier after you do water changes, and even after adding additional filtration, is a symptom of a bacteria bloom. I mentioned this in an earlier post but you said your water parameters were in check, so I went with it being filtration.

Here's what you should be doing when you change the water:

1: Remove the axI from the tank. With fish you don't normally have to do this, but considering the water coming out of your tap is at least 10 degrees warmer than the axi's tank is, you will need to temperature acclimate him after the water change. If you change the water with him in the tank, the temp will change too fast for him. Put him in a tupperware of tank water and sit the lid over it (don't seal it). If you can use the container to catch him, instead of a net, that would be ideal, because then he would never be removed from water, but sometimes these guys can be hard to catch so you may have to use a net to coax him into the container. Also remove all hides, caves, fake plants, and other loose decorations and ornaments from the tank. Keep real plants in the tank. Unplug your HOB filter.

2: Drain the water from the tank with your siphon hose. You should be using a gravel vac for this. Using a gravel vac is how you will suck up all the waste that is sitting on the tank floor, like poop, or uneaten, decaying food. You should have removed all the caves and whatnot, so make sure you vac where those sit. I know you have sand, but you should still be using a gravel vac. People who say "I can't use a gravel vac because I have sand" are wrong. Just hover the vac barely above the sand, so you suck up all the stuff sitting on top of the sand without actually sucking up the sand. If you do suck up some sand, put a kink in the hose to stop the siphon, the sand will fall back out, then release the kink to continue the siphon. Take the carbon cartridge out of your HOB filter and rinse it off in the bucket of dirty tank water, then put it back in the filter.

Since you are trying to clear up this cloudy water, I suggest you remove 75%-90% of the water. Normally I do not suggest this large of a water change, but in this case, it's kind of necessary. DO NOT do a 100% water change. As a routine water change, I would suggest you change 25-50% of the water. This will cause a less severe temperature swing, but still enough that warrants removing the axi.

3: Fill a bucket that has never been used for chemicals or soaps or anything other than new tank water, and is a separate bucket from your dirty tank water bucket. While the bucket is filling, pour your water conditioner into the bucket, and only pour in the amount you need for each bucket. This will stir in the water condoner while the bucket fills. Be sure to only use cold water.

4: When pouring the new water into the tank, try not to disrupt the substrate (sand). Disrupting the sand will kick up a bunch of debris, and, well, cloudy the water. You can do this several ways. Some people put a large item, like a rock, or a plate into the tank, and pour the water onto that. Some people transfer the water to a smaller container, like a pitcher, and pour the water in more slowly. Some people put the bucket of new water on a higher shelf than the tank and use their siphon hose to transfer the water into the tank. Some people use a combination of these methods. Whatever method you use, just try to kick up as little substrate as possible. When the tank is full, turn your filter back on.

(If you use a python or similar water change system, steps 3 and 4 will be different. You should dose the tank with enough water condoner for the entire tank before putting in new water, however you should still try not to disrupt the substrate)

5: Put the container that you put your axI in into the tank, and float acclimate him for 15-30 minutes, until the temperature in the container matches the temperature of the tank, then release him back into the tank.

For this water change, you may also need to add a bacteria product since your tank was possibly kicked out of cycle. But let's get the results of your water test before we decide if that's necessary. We will need to know your ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. Also, does the tank smell? Not just a slight musky smell, I mean like a fishy smell.

I'm sorry for the super long post I just want to be as helpful as possible.

okay I’ll have to do that then I may run to petco and pick up prime bc I have tetra water conditioner bc it was the only one on hand at the time but the directions are so weird it doesn’t seem right. I’ll test the water and put the results up but this is what the tank looks like now this morning :


Water doesn’t appear to smell at the moment but I could be wrong

Edit: so l lost all of my bacteria.... I don’t even know what to do now. This could be because I did remove my one filter media as I thought the other filter would be seeded but I guess it wasn’t I just tested nitrites and nitrates, as if I have nitrites, then ik I lost it all and I had .5 ppm nitrites, and 10-20 nitrates ppm.

What should I do now to gain the cycle back as quick as possible???

Just did water change! This time however, I added water conditioner to each bucket I added to the tank! Hopefully this will work out now... just hope it cycles quickly, but we’ll see. He’s floating in the tank right now acclimating and then after 30 minutes I’ll add him in.

 

That water doesn't look perfect, but it does look improved.

To get your cycle back, you're going to have to wait it out, probably. It might be a good idea to dump a bottle of Safe Start, or some other bottled bacteria, into the tank. If the nitrates are gone, the cycle is gone and you're starting over, so let's treat this like a fish-in cycle. Tetra SafeStart is specifically designed for fish-in cycles. You may have lost the cycle from putting untreated tap water into the tank and then adding the water conditioner last, after the tank was full.

Why did you remove the old filter already? I told you that it takes a week or 2 to seed a new filter. You just installed this sponge filter yesterday. Why did you think the new filter was already seeded? Please reinstall the old HOB filter and run both the HOB filter and the sponge filter simultaneously like you were previously advised to do. I know your cycle is gone now, so we're not trying to transfer bacteria anymore, but even so, just that one sponge running off of that small air pump is not enough filtration. As I previously said, if you want to remove the HOB filter, you will need to upgrade the air pump that powers the sponge filter. Also, that sponge filter you got looks like a different shape than the ones in the screenshots you posted asking which one to get. How many gallons is that sponge rated for? I'm guessing you looked on amazon but ended up finding it locally instead? That's fine, but it needs to be rated for at least double the tank capacity if you intend for it to be your only filter.

 

That water doesn't look perfect, but it does look improved.

To get your cycle back, you're going to have to wait it out, probably. It might be a good idea to dump a bottle of Safe Start, or some other bottled bacteria, into the tank. If the nitrates are gone, the cycle is gone and you're starting over, so let's treat this like a fish-in cycle. Tetra SafeStart is specifically designed for fish-in cycles. You may have lost the cycle from putting untreated tap water into the tank and then adding the water conditioner last, after the tank was full.

Why did you remove the old filter already? I told you that it takes a week or 2 to seed a new filter. You just installed this sponge filter yesterday. Why did you think the new filter was already seeded? Please reinstall the old HOB filter and run both the HOB filter and the sponge filter simultaneously like you were previously advised to do. I know your cycle is gone now, so we're not trying to transfer bacteria anymore, but even so, just that one sponge running off of that small air pump is not enough filtration. As I previously said, if you want to remove the HOB filter, you will need to upgrade the air pump that powers the sponge filter. Also, that sponge filter you got looks like a different shape than the ones in the screenshots you posted asking which one to get. How many gallons is that sponge rated for? I'm guessing you looked on amazon but ended up finding it locally instead? That's fine, but it needs to be rated for at least double the tank capacity if you intend for it to be your only filter.

I didn’t remove the HOB, I removed an extra media from my 55 bc it was too big for the filter. The sponge was at a local pet store and is rated for a 40 gallon. This was the quickest way to get the tank fixed. I’ll get some safe start for the tank to help finish cycling it!

 

Okay thanks for clearing that up. I was so confused.

 

Today, tank seems a bit cloudy still but not as bad as it was initially. I might do a 50% water change and try to really clear it up. If I have time, might buy one of those instant add in chemicals to try to boost the cycle. Hope this works!

 

How is Baymax doing this morning? Any updates on the cloudy water?

 

How is Baymax doing this morning? Any updates on the cloudy water?

He’s acting very sluggish in my opinion, but staying on the bottom which is better than him always being on the top of the tank! He’s eating like a champ, but won’t eat any pellets. He only eats live worms from the backyard

I didn’t do a water change bc dealing with some water issues in the house

 

Thanks for the update. What's wrong with the water in the house?

I'm starting to wonder if your pretty blue sand is contributing to the cloudy water. You said it's really really fine sand... so fine it suspends in the water column? Or maybe the water is leeching blue dye off of the sand. Just a thought. Something worth maybe investigating.

 

Have you tried a freshwater clarifier? If you haven't, I would suggest tubbing your little guy, add the clarifier, put a HOB filter back on the tank with a very fine pad often called a water polishing pad (you need something to grab the bound particles) while leaving your sponge filter in the tank, and give it 24 hours.

 

Thanks for the update. What's wrong with the water in the house?

I'm starting to wonder if your pretty blue sand is contributing to the cloudy water. You said it's really really fine sand... so fine it suspends in the water column? Or maybe the water is leeching blue dye off of the sand. Just a thought. Something worth maybe investigating.

Our septic system busted and needless to say, using water was not a priority

It is really fine where if I pour water straight into it, pieces will float in the tank. I never thought it would leech....

Have you tried a freshwater clarifier? If you haven't, I would suggest tubbing your little guy, add the clarifier, put a HOB filter back on the tank with a very fine pad often called a water polishing pad (you need something to grab the bound particles) while leaving your sponge filter in the tank, and give it 24 hours.

I really don’t want to use a chemical to try to fix the problem as then I would have to keep using it. The HOB is on the tank. I really don’t like the idea of tubbing him as to me, that’s stressful!

 

Even without the chemical clarifier, the water polishing pad is a good idea if these look like floating particles clouding the water to you. You could also try stuffing a bunch of stuffed animal fluff (aka filter floss) into your HOB filter's chamber, but I don't know if this would be as effective as a polishing pad.

 

I really don’t want to use a chemical to try to fix the problem as then I would have to keep using it.

With clarifier, that isn't the case. Once the micro particles that are clouding the water are removed from the tank by the polishing pad, they are gone unless you are doing something to add them back... If the cloudiness clears up but then comes back after using the clarifier, I would say you have a different problem than micro particles in the water column.

FWIW, they handle tubbing really well. I had to do this with a bunch of mine for many months, and they all looked stellar!

 

How's Baymax?

 

How's Baymax?

He’s doing okay.... still a bit stressed after the move, but hopefully he’ll be good as new tomorrow!

He’s doing okay.... still a bit stressed after the move, but hopefully he’ll be good as new tomorrow!

 

Oh wow a whole new tank and a whole new substrate! Look at that! He looks happy.