Are neon tetras easy for beginners?

I’ve heard conflicting things when talking about neon tetras ease of care, some say they are beginner friendly and others say they’re not.
Would you recommend a school of neon tetras for a beginner? I have a 105 litre tank and plan to get neon tyres and Lambchop Rasboras, is this a good idea? If so how many if each, I know they’re schooling fish so just depends how many the tank will allow. Thank you!!

 

Hi Frankieee

Unfortunately neon tetras are not as good as they once were. Until new blood is brought in to the hobby what is often sold in chain stores is inbred and weak.

Green neons are similar in size and colour and may still have a stronger bloodline?

When the tank has a fully functioning nitrogen cycle Lambchop Rasboras or Harlequin Rasboras are a good fish .
There are no true beginner fish. Not really. They all require a nitrogen cycle and fresh water to replace the toxic waste water. They all suffer if and WHEN over feed . As a beginner it’s hard to learn not to feed fish multiple times per day.

With 105 litres / 27 gallons to work with you could have two small groups but I encourage you to think about one larger school of mid water fish and perhaps some dwarf ( 6 ) corydoras ?

 

Danios are often touted as "bulletproof fish", as they can be a bit more forgiving to beginner mistakes-because those will definitely come-but like any other fish, can only go so far in the neglect and overfeeding department before they too throw in the towel.

 

As a beginner you may not be aware of the nitrogen cycle mentioned above. To keep fish you need to have a clear understanding of how it works and what that means for our tanks and fish. Fish stores are notorious for not mentioning this to new fish keepers or they try to sell them a bottle of bacteria instead. Even if you choose to use a bottled bacteria product (they do work sometimes) to cycle your tank, you still need to have a working knowledge of the nitrogen cycle before setting up your tank.

Cycling a tank before adding fish takes weeks.

 

As Flyfisha said, as a result of their popularity their genetics aren't as good as they once were. There are other tetra species that I've found to be much more hardy. Serpae tetras, lemon tetras, and pristella tetras head that list (that's in my experience; of course there are many tetras that I don't have any experience with).

 

and pristella tetras

My first fish. I actually cycled the tank with them and they went on to live longer than any of the other fish except the BN Plecos. The last one lived over 5 years.

I've noticed lately that the ones my LFS is selling now are much bigger than the ones I had.

 

Thank you everyone, I’ll take all this into consideration and keep you all updated!!

As a beginner you may not be aware of the nitrogen cycle mentioned above. To keep fish you need to have a clear understanding of how it works and what that means for our tanks and fish. Fish stores are notorious for not mentioning this to new fish keepers or they try to sell them a bottle of bacteria instead. Even if you choose to use a bottled bacteria product (they do work sometimes) to cycle your tank, you still need to have a working knowledge of the nitrogen cycle before setting up your tank.

Cycling a tank before adding fish takes weeks.

Absolutely, I am a beginner but definitely eager to learn and do more. I do animal care so know basics but am definitely waiting for a few weeks before even thinking if adding anymore fish

 

Neon Tetras are not "genetically weak", they are poorly raised and incorrectly kept. Commercial breeders in the far east raise massive numbers in small quarters, and to overcome the risk of an infection wiping out their investment they use a lot of antibiotics. These prevent diseases, but also leave the fish with weakened immune systems. These weakened fish are then shipped halfway around the world, still tightly packed together. Once removed from the medicated water, they are susceptible to any and every bug that might be found in "clean" water. If you can source a breeder from Florida your chances of getting healthy specimens increases dramatically. Not sure if wild specimens are even available these days.

The other problem is that, over the last couple of decades, most information sources have listed the temperature range for Neons as going up to 80-82 degrees. The appropriate temperature range is 68-76 degrees, and going higher weakens the fish and shortens the lifespan. If you read literature from the 50s and 60s you will find this. I believe a single book listed a higher temperature range back in the 1980s, and apparently was the source for almost every reference site on the internet.

That said, I would not recommend them for a beginner, for the reasons given at the top of this post. Some people get lucky and get the fish past this initial hurdle, at which point they are often quite hardy if kept in the optimal 71-75 degree range.

 

IF, you want to give florida bred neons and other tetras a try, this place does ship to they have a pretty large selection of fish and been runnign for 50 years or so. basically try the number or the email on the shipping page, try to establish a conversation of what you are looking for, if they have it currently for sale they will tell you, and give you cost and shipping and all that.

I've been there a few times, this is the outdoor place with the cement burial vaults repurposed for fish tanks. was a good place with a good staff and lots of good fish to choose from, but been a good while since I been there. on facebook they said they just recently got gold neon tetras in, they do get new stock in, and try to breed their own stock in the vats. as they conduct business and at least they used to, when the stock got low, take them off of for sale and someone would work with them trying to get them to breed and repopulate rather than constantly going to the distributors/importers. Im sure there's others but these people used to be really good.

Neighborhood Fish Farm
Shipping

 

Neon Tetras are not "genetically weak", they are poorly raised and incorrectly kept. Commercial breeders in the far east raise massive numbers in small quarters, and to overcome the risk of an infection wiping out their investment they use a lot of antibiotics. These prevent diseases, but also leave the fish with weakened immune systems. These weakened fish are then shipped halfway around the world, still tightly packed together. Once removed from the medicated water, they are susceptible to any and every bug that might be found in "clean" water. If you can source a breeder from Florida your chances of getting healthy specimens increases dramatically. Not sure if wild specimens are even available these days.

The other problem is that, over the last couple of decades, most information sources have listed the temperature range for Neons as going up to 80-82 degrees. The appropriate temperature range is 68-76 degrees, and going higher weakens the fish and shortens the lifespan. If you read literature from the 50s and 60s you will find this. I believe a single book listed a higher temperature range back in the 1980s, and apparently was the source for almost every reference site on the internet.

That said, I would not recommend them for a beginner, for the reasons given at the top of this post. Some people get lucky and get the fish past this initial hurdle, at which point they are often quite hardy if kept in the optimal 71-75 degree range.

I have a question about that. Assuming that the problem with neon tetras is that they are over medicated at the fish farms (and I'm not saying that's wrong), why do other tetra species seem to be much more hardy? I assume they come from the same farms and are treated the same way, but if not this wouldn't be the first time I assumed incorrectly.

Is it a combination of the weakened immune systems and too high temperatures, and other tetras are okay in warmer water? I've heard that fish can often handle one stressor, but do poorly with more than one.

I'm not arguing with you, because I know you've been doing this longer than I have, and are almost certainly more knowledgeable and have done more extensive research. I'm just curious.

 

I have a question about that. Assuming that the problem with neon tetras is that they are over medicated at the fish farms (and I'm not saying that's wrong), why do other tetra species seem to be much more hardy? I assume they come from the same farms and are treated the same way, but if not this wouldn't be the first time I assumed incorrectly.

Is it a combination of the weakened immune systems and too high temperatures, and other tetras are okay in warmer water? I've heard that fish can often handle one stressor, but do poorly with more than one.

I'm not arguing with you, because I know you've been doing this longer than I have, and are almost certainly more knowledgeable and have done more extensive research. I'm just curious.

I just want to hear the answer!

I have my theories on this subject from food fish framing and aquaculture research. just want to hear another perspective.

 

Neons are fairly unique among common aquarium tetras. In the wild they come from the upper Amazon basin, primarily in Peru. Higher altitudes, closer to the mountains, yet still under jungle canopies in clear waters that tend to stay cooler. They are not a blackwater species like Cardinals and Green Neons. The clear water, while on the acid side, is not as highly acidic as blackwater. It is also much cleaner with less sediment. Most of our aquarium Tetras come from slower moving lowland water, which tends to not be as clean.

In the Far Eastern fish farms, the waters are usually more acidic, and always much warmer. The Neons are forced to breed at warmer temperatures than they would normally. However, warmer water=less oxygen, and a higher metabolic rate means they are exposed to more polluted conditions than tetras that have systems normally adjusted for living in warmer waters. Therefore, they must be treated more heavily than other tetras.

Genetic weaknesses come mostly from limited breeding stock. However, the numbers of Neons used in the Eastern farms are usually more than the number of fish in a shoal in nature. It is possible that the efforts to reduce losses with medications are also resulting in unhealthy specimens breeding, but the numbers do not support that theory.

 

They are not a blackwater species like Cardinals and Green Neons.

According to a book on Peruvian ornamental fish published in 2021 (in Spanish) they are found in blackwater. It does say that they occur in vegetation or in shady areas beneath dense forest layers, so the water in these shaded tributaries is likely to be cooler than in the bigger rivers. It also says that they have a widespread distribution in the Amazon region of Peru, Colombia and Brazil and even occur outside of the Amazon basin, and that those for exportation are mainly collected in tributaries of the Amazon. This book can be downloaded free in pdf format if anyone is interested.

"Habita en los tributarios de los principales ríos, en regiones de agua negras, entre la vegetación o en zonas sombreadas bajo las capas densas del bosque."

"Fue registrada en Perú, Brasil, Colombia, inclusive fuera de la cuenca amazónica. De amplia distribución en la Amazonia. Los individuos para exportación son extraídos de los afluentes del río Amazonas".

Peces Ornamentales de la Amazonia Peruana, Carmen García Dávila et al.

 

If someone is exporting/importing wild Neons, I'd love to find out who. So far as I am aware, the vast majority of commercially available specimens are captive bred.

I think the authors of this article are confused about the nature of blackwater. It is usually devoid of vegetation, yet they note that Neons live in vegetated areas. I think they are including certain clear waters in their definition of blackwater. And I did not exclude Colombia and Western Brazil as part of their range, I just pointed out that most were primarily collected from Peru "back in the day". The important facts are still the same.

To point out just one difference between clear and black waters, Neons will breed at a pH of 6.0 to 6.5, while Cardinals prefer 5.5 or lower to spawn, as do most true blackwater fish.

 

If someone is exporting/importing wild Neons, I'd love to find out who. So far as I am aware, the vast majority of commercially available specimens are captive bred.

I think the authors of this article are confused about the nature of blackwater. It is usually devoid of vegetation, yet they note that Neons live in vegetated areas. I think they are including certain clear waters in their definition of blackwater. And I did not exclude Colombia and Western Brazil as part of their range, I just pointed out that most were primarily collected from Peru "back in the day". The important facts are still the same.

To point out just one difference between clear and black waters, Neons will breed at a pH of 6.0 to 6.5, while Cardinals prefer 5.5 or lower to spawn, as do most true blackwater fish.

You are probably right, although the authors do refer to clearwater and whitewater in descriptions of other species. It is difficult to get correct information, for example about the red pencilfish, Nannostomus mortenthaleri, I have read both that it inhabits densely vegetated areas and that it is a backwater species. I suppose the vegetation could refer to flooded riparian vegetation rather than aquatic plants?

The book also does say that the majority of the capture (58%) is for the national market. The only period when exportation was greater than the national trade was in the period 2007-2013, the authors mention that they are commercially bred in Europe and the USA. I am sure the neon tetras we get here in Ecuador come from both Peru and Colombia, they seem to be pretty healthy.

 

Neons are fairly unique among common aquarium tetras. In the wild they come from the upper Amazon basin, primarily in Peru. Higher altitudes, closer to the mountains, yet still under jungle canopies in clear waters that tend to stay cooler. They are not a blackwater species like Cardinals and Green Neons. The clear water, while on the acid side, is not as highly acidic as blackwater. It is also much cleaner with less sediment. Most of our aquarium Tetras come from slower moving lowland water, which tends to not be as clean.

In the Far Eastern fish farms, the waters are usually more acidic, and always much warmer. The Neons are forced to breed at warmer temperatures than they would normally. However, warmer water=less oxygen, and a higher metabolic rate means they are exposed to more polluted conditions than tetras that have systems normally adjusted for living in warmer waters. Therefore, they must be treated more heavily than other tetras.

Genetic weaknesses come mostly from limited breeding stock. However, the numbers of Neons used in the Eastern farms are usually more than the number of fish in a shoal in nature. It is possible that the efforts to reduce losses with medications are also resulting in unhealthy specimens breeding, but the numbers do not support that theory.

Thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

 

I am just suggesting a video on the subject

 

Great video about Cardinals but has no relevance to regular Neons, which come from an entirely different region of the Amazon basin. Some of the first underwater shots demonstrate the absence of vegetation in blackwater environments. A friend of mine, Randy Carey, was deeply involved in Project Piaba a few years ago. We shared an interest in breeding Characiformes, particularly the ones most people aren't aware of.

TClare, I noticed that they did not mention Asia as breeding captive Neons, which is strange since most of this species in the US hobby come from that region. Definitions of blackwater, clearwater, and whitewater can vary, and Fishbase says they are found in both blackwater and clearwater. Given their wide distribution in numerous systems, I can believe there are populations from both types. I would love to see a population from true blackwaters; I wonder if they might look or behave differently.

 

I noticed that they did not mention Asia as breeding captive Neons

Yes, I thought that was strange as well, but no mention, perhaps because previously their main export markets were to USA and Europe.

Incidentally Project Piaba have a lot of interesting short videos of fish in the wild (but not neon tetras that I have seen), and they also collaborated with the two part documentary "Wild Caught" which is definitely worth a watch, it is available on YouTube.