Angelfish troubles, several issues

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Becky Smith

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Hi folks. I brought an angelfish from the community tank at work to treat a sore in its side that I thought was from being picked on by the angel pair who lived in the tank. MelaFix and Pimafix seemed to work, as the sore scabbed up and looked much better. Now, for the past couple of days I have noticed these spots on him. I have scoured the web but I can’t find what this might be. I have looked closely to see if I see movement or stringy bits, in case it’s anchor worms. Not seeing any of that stuff. Any help to identify and treat would be much appreciated. He is the sole fish in a 30 gallon atm. I wanted to get him a friend, but not until this is figured out. Also, I’m in Canada, where most fish meds are apparently contraband... not sure why. Yesterday I added some aquarium salt and today I dosed with MelaFix again. Parameters are all good, and I have been doing a 50% wc once a week. Temp is 78.
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86 ssinit

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Not sure what that is but it seems these spots are showing up on angelfish and on discus. Clean water is the best thing for it. Seems they go away in a few weeks with clean water.
 
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86 ssinit

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I’d say 50% every other day for a week. See if it goes away. If the melafix didn’t call for the water changes wait till you finish douses before starting water changes.
 
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Becky Smith

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Hi again, I’m hoping I can get some more knowledge on this. It’s been almost 2 weeks since I posted about my angelfish rescue. He is still living solo in a 30 gallon tank. He still has the spots, and they might be a bit worse now, not really sure though. I’ve been searching and reading, and I believe that his condition is lymphocystis, a viral infection which is generally unsightly but not fatal or really harmful. The lesions should fall off with time (up to months), and any future outbreaks will be less severe.

I went through a 7 day cycle of MelaFix before hearing about lymphocystis. No improvement. Since then I have been doing 50% WC every two to three days (every other day more recently), and not adding anything to the tank except for Prime. I’m willing to do this until the end of time if it helps. Not seeing an improvement yet, but I don’t expect to with this presumed diagnosis.

Now my concern is that this fish doesn’t want to eat. He hasn't had a good chow down in at least two weeks. He ignores flakes and softened Bug Bites. He has nibbled on bloodworms, like maximum three or four little worms. I have tried adding garlic to food to boost his appetite, and tried my soft homemade gel food that I give to my goldies. He ignores it all.

He is swimming fine, he appears to be growing somehow, fins are perky, but most of the time he hangs out in a corner looking sad. I want to get some company for him (whole other issue), but I won’t until the cysts are gone.

So is anyone familiar with any of what I am describing? My heart hurts for this guy... he’s had it rough, and I really want him to enjoy his life. TIA.

Here is a picture from yesterday. Please note, this side has always been worse than the other, in the first pic.
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I have been trying to care for an angelfish rescue. He seems to have lymphocystis, which appeared to be improving slightly. I have been doing 50% WC every 2-3 days. I have large almond leaves in there too. He is alone in a 29 gallon. Levels are 0-0-10. His pH is higher than angels like it. Any tips on lowering it? Also, does anyone think this reddened and swollen eye is more of the lymphocystis, or something different? I have MelaFix and Pimafix on hand. I am in Canada, where antibiotics are essentially unavailable.
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angelcraze

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It's hard to tell, but I think the red eye might normal coloration. The dot on his nose looks like an injury (like from another angel perhaps, I've seen similar marks). Looks like maybe scale damage as well, not that it cannot heal. Was he beat up in the old tank? You are on the right track with the water changes and capatta leaves. I don't think the redness is part of Lymph, but i'm not sure i'd say it looks like Lymph either (going by the pic, you can see the actual fish). Just my guess is he was beat up and fresh clean water is the best medicine for that.
 

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jake37

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I would not touch the ph. Once the fish adjust to a ph it does more harm than good to muck with it. Since he's been in the tank for a few days and hasn't croaked i'm going to assume he has adjusted to the current ph. Also note that most ph ranges listed for a fish come from their natural habitat if your fish was not a wild fish it was probably raised in a different ph that might be totally unrelated to its natural habitat.
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my silver angles had natural red eyes. Take a look on line or local pet store at a lot of silver angels and see if their eyes look similar to your.
 
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He has been away from his community rank for about two months now. I initially took him to treat a hole in his side. It healed, although a small scab has been in that spot ever since. Then came the cysts. I have another post about that elsewhere in this site. Then, when those start to look better, his eye is messed up. Today it is a million times worse, and now I suspect pop eye. Sigh. Poor guy can’t catch a break. This pic is today.
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angelcraze

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Oh ok, I see it now. Yeah, looks like popeye for sure. I will check out your other thread now.

I'm sorry, I have to deal with snow, but I my heart goes out to you and good luck with getting him back to health. I know it's a pic, but it looks like missing scales /tissue damage to me. Lymph is more cauliflower like. What do you think?

If so, frequent water changes are the key to his recovery. He does need to eat eventually, so we need to address that.

I'll get right back, or hopefully you get a second opinion in the mean time.
 

86 ssinit

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Just from the hole by his head I’m thinking hole in the head. The holes in the back could be scrapes or holes. They do like like holes. Like hith there is another disease on the lateral line. This could be that and would get the same treatment as for hith.
 

angelcraze

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Great idea^^, it does look like missing scales or holes along the lateral line doesn't it?

Since this fish was being harassed in old tank pre rescue, it is most likely HITH brought on by stress. At least fresh water is still the best cure for this, you're in the right track. I like to add capatta leaves (Indian Almond Leaves) to help condition the water. They will stain the water tea colored, but it will be faint will frequent WCs. They are supposed to release antibacterial and antifungal compounds and I have good success using them especially for soft water fish like angelfish. I will toss in 1 large leaf for 30 gallons when i'm trying to heal a fish. I use 1/2 leaf as a regular thing per 30 gallons. For some applications where I don't want the mess of the leaf degredation on the bottom, I will add the IAL to the filter in a DIY pantyhose bag like a tea bag.

The other treatment is good nutrition. He is not eating :( And a good natural way to stimulate appetite is getting the best nutrients. So you could always try dosing the water with vitamins. Boyd Vitachem can be added to the water and when he is eating again, you can dose the food as well, so a good investment for right now and going forward.

My last suggestion option for when he is eating again is adding Epsom Salts to the food. Here is some info on how to do this as well as some general good info for treating HITH and Hexamita.
Treating Hexamita aka Spironucleus
It's more against the parasite responsible for Hex, but could have some effect for your angel you never know. At least it's available everywhere, cheap and doesn't cause any harm.
 
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Thank you for all the great input. I’m happy to say that the spots have basically disappeared. Unfortunately, now we have a case of what appears to be popeye. The eye is very red and swollen, and his mouth seems to be unable to close. While his appetite came back again since I originally posted, he is not eating once again. I don’t know if he doesn’t want to, or can’t. Unfortunately, I cannot get fish meds here in Canada, and when I look at ordering from USA, delivery times are between three weeks and two months. This, on top of postage fees that are higher than the cost of the product. Now I am treating with Melafix and Pimafix because that’s all I have on hand, and that interferes with my water changes, which I was doing every other day, because I am supposed to use these products for 7 days before a wc. Ugh... poor fish. Her he is today.
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I know, this poor little rescue is monopolizing this page, but his issues keep compounding. After what appears to have been lymphocystis cleared up, he developed popeye. I have threads on both in this section. Along with his bad eye, now there are red blotches around his mouth and eye (and nose?), he does not seem to be able to close his mouth, and is opening it very quickly. He is not eating anything, after just having just gotten his appetite back. He is alone in a 29 gallon tank. I have been doing water changes every two days. Levels are 0-0-5, but his pH is high at 8. I have two large almond leaves in there, for the past week or so. I can’t get decent meds in Canada. I only have MelaFix and Pimafix, and began dosing with these yesterday. Only now I’m not supposed to change any water for seven days from first dose. I’m concerned about his eye, but moreover, his mouth, lack of eating, apparent rapid breathing. He is as active as he has ever been (not very... he spends most of his days in this corner, and at night he moves out to the main part of the tank). My heart is breaking for this poor guy. I want him to have a good life. Anyone have knowledge or experience with these symptoms or conditions? Any favor would be great! Please check out the video.

There is redness at the base of his pectoral fins as well.
 

Andyfischer

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U can get octozin on amazon uk

Also angelsplus has metro infused flakes
 

angelcraze

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OMGOODNESS I didn't realize your post was from early January. Well his sides look great now, great job! So I guess it was missing scales?

I'm also in Canada, so understand your frustration. So is the eye protruding like it's retaining fluid? Do you have another pic? I just thought I saw one somewhere....I know Epsom salts are good to draw out fluid, but not sure about dosing the whole tank....
He is alone in the 30 gallon, no live plants?
 
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It was missing scales, but moreso little lumps and bumps. It is a little hard to tell from the pic... Yes, he is all alone in a 30 gallon tank. I have wanted to find some little friends for him, because I'm sure he's lonely, but not until he is healthy. I doubt that he notices, but across the room from him is my 75 gallon with my four goldfish, who are happy and healthy, and who swim around playfully together all day. It looks like he's watching them all the time. I'm probably experiencing more empathy than what is reasonable, but I just feel so sad for my sweet angel. <3 Here he is from the front...
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A201

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IMO, your initial diagnosis of Lymphocystis was probably correct. The Angel's immune system is apparently compromised.
Contracting Pop Eye / Bacterial infection, without any external stressors is another indicator of a weakened immune system.
There's something going on internally thats bringing the Angel down. Even if meds were available, selecting the proper one would be difficult without positively identifying the underlying illness.
You are doing a great job with the Angel, hope things get better soon.
 

angelcraze

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You could try some epsom salts in the water to hopefully bring some swelling down. For a 30 gallon, it wouldn't hurt to add just a bit (say 1tbsp per 10 gallons). Just remember in a non-planted tank you'll want to remove it by changing water because no plants to uptake magnesium. Just be sure not to keep dosing without removing/changing water. If you want google using Epsom Salts for popeye and see if it's something you want to try. But good water and nutrition is his best shot.

Whether it's Lymph, HITH or Hex, the treatment is all the same, so some vitamins would be helpful. Good luck!
 
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He won't eat a thing. :(

He is much worse today. His other eye is beginning to swell, and the skin around the first one is ragged and fluffy looking. Now he is hanging out close to the top of the tank... not gasping though. His mouth looks a little better. Still not eating. I added epsom salts, one tbsp per gallon. I am picking up Tetra Lifeguard today, but I'm losing hope. Everywhere I look, it tells me that water quality is the cause of my fish's woes, but water changes are more than regular, and parameters are always ideal. I don't know what I should do about water changes now that I have added the salt. I'm not going to use the MelaFix and PimaFix anymore for now. Screw the Canadian govt and its stupid restrictions on fish meds!
 

angelcraze

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Ahhhh :( Did you mean 1 tablespoon per 10 gallons? Or teaspoon per gallon? 1 tablespoon is a lot at once...I would water change some out now if that is the case. You would dose 1 tablespoon per 10 gallons, so 3 tbsp in your 30 gallon. So add slowly, maybe 1tbsp every 4 hours or so until you are at 3tbsp. Then when you change say 50% water, you just redose 1/2 the Epsom Salts dosage of 1.5 tablespoons. Make sense?

Your poor angel has already felt the damage from the bad water quality and stress of the old tank you rescued him from. These things take time to heal. You are doing the very best you can and I encourage you to not give up hope. I know Methylene blue has been contraband for years in Canada, sometimes you can find Kordon Methylene Blue at Big Als or at least you could.... if you do find it, let me know.
 
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