Agressive Small Clownfish...what To Do?

Hello.

Thanks for reading me. I'm new to the saltwater world and I'm facing, what my LFS says is normal.
I have a 15 gallon tank with a medium cleaner shrimp, one small clownfish ( 1 inch) ,2 turbo snails, and 3 dwarf red crab.

The thing is that I started my aquarium with two clowns... and it always one has to die. The second attempt I got a larger clown but the smaller got really angry and chased the other like crazy. I did some aquarium landscaping and everything went better for a couple of days... the larger clown died after three days of peace. The fish looked perfect all the time and it was eating and behaving normally. I check water parameters and everything was perfect.

Now I only have one small clown and I'd like to add another one... Is there any thing I can do to prevent this fights and deaths?

Thanks.

 

I don't think you'll be able to add another clown without removing the little poo head that terrorizes the others. They are known to be territorial and aggressive so I would also call this normal, but you just got one that's extra aggressive

 

Trade in the aggressor and get 2 new clowns

 

Clownfish form pairs (or a reverse harem with multiple males) of a dominant female and a subservient male. Adding one other clown would put too much stress on whichever fish became inferior, and would likely kill it in a tank of that size. I'd trade it in.

 

HI Welcome to Fishlore and congrats for taking a walk on the salty side. Things will get better.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you've got a bad egg there, (forgive the silly), and I agree with others. If I were in your shoes I would try to return it to the store it was purchased from, and if that weren't possible, I'd call other stores and/or look for another home... preferably in a big tank with tank mates that could keep him in check.

Clowns do have a bad reputation so it is not abnormal for one to show heavy aggression. However, it's definitely up to the individual and I would hazard a guess that less than half of juvie clowns will end up this way if presented with a 'proper' upbringing. In other words...

Smaller tanks should always be stocked from the least to the most aggressive, so if there is another species you would like, it's a very good idea to stock it first and not add a more aggressive fish (like a clown), until the 1st is completely comfortable in its new environment and eating well. For example, a yellow watchman goby will need a burrow or cave, a place to feel safe, which it has acclimated to and can call it's own. If a meanie clown comes along later, the goby is healthy and already has its safe space.

If you want two clowns, and that's it, then they should be purchased from a larger group at a very young age and added to your tank at the same time. This is usually easily done as fish stores get in large amounts of baby clowns and generally house them together while they are small. Aggression generally rears its ugly head as maturity approaches so it makes sense that if they are raised together, chances of them getting along are higher. However, with more than one clown, you will need them to pair up, where one grows larger and becomes female but still tolerates her mate. This does happen in nano tanks and you can find evidence of it online, but does it happen more often than not? Idk, but in smaller tanks, chances are slimmer, and when one is attempting a pair, there kinda needs to be a backup plan in mind. Meaning, at the first signs of aggression, the aggressor is removed to another tank or a quick and dirty quarantine. More on that if you're interested. I would not do two clownfish in a 15 gallon tank and would not even do it in my own 20 gallon long.

Lastly, again, it's definitely up to the individual fish, and I do think plenty of percula and/or occelaris clowns aren't so bad. For myself, I worried endlessly and added other fish well before the clown came along, which was a firefish who spent way too long alone. Anyway, I also wanted a yellow watchman goby (ywg) and a pistol shrimp for him to pair up with. What do you know? I go out looking one day and find a ywg in the same small fish box as a cute little designer clown at the LFS, and the price was more than fair. Snatched them up and brought them home to a 5 gallon quarantine. The goby stressed in qt but the clown was never mean to him. In fact, the clown was nothing but nice and always slept at the opening of the goby's bolt hole, and the goby displayed more comfort when the clown was near. In the display tank (only a 20 gallon long) I had a firefish, who did not take lightly to a clown, goby, and shrimp entering his home. However, again, the clown showed no aggression to the firefish and he still slept at the entrance to a new burrow belonging the goby and shrimp. Eventually, I added a royal gramma basslet, and despite my clown being buddies with my goby, I still worried... as this was the first time a new fish entered what is now the clownfish's territory. I guess I got lucky because the clown and the gramma hang out all the time now too. Lucky me, our clown seems to be everyone's buddy.

I do think you have an extra rotten fish there and would likely have better luck if that fish goes, and you start fresh.

 

Definitely remove the clown. You won't be able to add anythig else until you do. As mentioned above they can get pretty aggressive/territorial once established and as mentioned it's best to pair from the same group.

 

Hi, welcome to the salty world (and Fishlore)

Clowns are part of the damsel family, and as such, are notorious for being aggressive toward conspecifics, well, not aggressive, but territorial. So your LFS is correct with their "it's normal", especially in a small tank.

Firstly, what species of clown? You don't want to mix a percula with an ocellaris (or in fact, mix any species of clown), but if you're looking for another, at least look at the same species. Secondly, if you want to keep your incumbent, then, try introducing a much smaller fish. The incumbent will be bigger, and is more likely to pair with a smaller fish. The larger becoming the female. I stress the following: there is no guarantee that this approach will work, but it seems to have the greatest chance of success.

If you're not attached to the current fish, see if you can exchange.

IMHO - the only sure fire way to ensure compatibility is to buy a known (preferably mated) pair. Known pairs cost more, but it's better than trying to deal with 'forcing' a pair.

Sidenote: In a smaller tank, you want to be careful stocking anything else, as clowns will typically take over the whole tank claiming it as their territory.

Smaller tanks should always be stocked from the least to the most aggressive,

All tanks should be stocked this way Be it Freshwater or Saltwater

 

I don't think you'll be able to add another clown without removing the little poo head that terrorizes the others. They are known to be territorial and aggressive so I would also call this normal, but you just got one that's extra aggressive

Thanks for answering.

HI Welcome to Fishlore and congrats for taking a walk on the salty side. Things will get better.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you've got a bad egg there, (forgive the silly), and I agree with others. If I were in your shoes I would try to return it to the store it was purchased from, and if that weren't possible, I'd call other stores and/or look for another home... preferably in a big tank with tank mates that could keep him in check.

Clowns do have a bad reputation so it is not abnormal for one to show heavy aggression. However, it's definitely up to the individual and I would hazard a guess that less than half of juvie clowns will end up this way if presented with a 'proper' upbringing. In other words...

Smaller tanks should always be stocked from the least to the most aggressive, so if there is another species you would like, it's a very good idea to stock it first and not add a more aggressive fish (like a clown), until the 1st is completely comfortable in its new environment and eating well. For example, a yellow watchman goby will need a burrow or cave, a place to feel safe, which it has acclimated to and can call it's own. If a meanie clown comes along later, the goby is healthy and already has its safe space.

If you want two clowns, and that's it, then they should be purchased from a larger group at a very young age and added to your tank at the same time. This is usually easily done as fish stores get in large amounts of baby clowns and generally house them together while they are small. Aggression generally rears its ugly head as maturity approaches so it makes sense that if they are raised together, chances of them getting along are higher. However, with more than one clown, you will need them to pair up, where one grows larger and becomes female but still tolerates her mate. This does happen in nano tanks and you can find evidence of it online, but does it happen more often than not? Idk, but in smaller tanks, chances are slimmer, and when one is attempting a pair, there kinda needs to be a backup plan in mind. Meaning, at the first signs of aggression, the aggressor is removed to another tank or a quick and dirty quarantine. More on that if you're interested. I would not do two clownfish in a 15 gallon tank and would not even do it in my own 20 gallon long.

Lastly, again, it's definitely up to the individual fish, and I do think plenty of percula and/or occelaris clowns aren't so bad. For myself, I worried endlessly and added other fish well before the clown came along, which was a firefish who spent way too long alone. Anyway, I also wanted a yellow watchman goby (ywg) and a pistol shrimp for him to pair up with. What do you know? I go out looking one day and find a ywg in the same small fish box as a cute little designer clown at the LFS, and the price was more than fair. Snatched them up and brought them home to a 5 gallon quarantine. The goby stressed in qt but the clown was never mean to him. In fact, the clown was nothing but nice and always slept at the opening of the goby's bolt hole, and the goby displayed more comfort when the clown was near. In the display tank (only a 20 gallon long) I had a firefish, who did not take lightly to a clown, goby, and shrimp entering his home. However, again, the clown showed no aggression to the firefish and he still slept at the entrance to a new burrow belonging the goby and shrimp. Eventually, I added a royal gramma basslet, and despite my clown being buddies with my goby, I still worried... as this was the first time a new fish entered what is now the clownfish's territory. I guess I got lucky because the clown and the gramma hang out all the time now too. Lucky me, our clown seems to be everyone's buddy.

I do think you have an extra rotten fish there and would likely have better luck if that fish goes, and you start fresh.

Thank you very much for this explanation. I have to think about removing my clown.

Hi, welcome to the salty world (and Fishlore)

Clowns are part of the damsel family, and as such, are notorious for being aggressive toward conspecifics, well, not aggressive, but territorial. So your LFS is correct with their "it's normal", especially in a small tank.

Firstly, what species of clown? You don't want to mix a percula with an ocellaris (or in fact, mix any species of clown), but if you're looking for another, at least look at the same species. Secondly, if you want to keep your incumbent, then, try introducing a much smaller fish. The incumbent will be bigger, and is more likely to pair with a smaller fish. The larger becoming the female. I stress the following: there is no guarantee that this approach will work, but it seems to have the greatest chance of success.

If you're not attached to the current fish, see if you can exchange.

IMHO - the only sure fire way to ensure compatibility is to buy a known (preferably mated) pair. Known pairs cost more, but it's better than trying to deal with 'forcing' a pair.

Sidenote: In a smaller tank, you want to be careful stocking anything else, as clowns will typically take over the whole tank claiming it as their territory.


All tanks should be stocked this way Be it Freshwater or Saltwater

Thank you. There is a lot to learn now in Saltwater