About My Fish...

bridget mary
  • #1
So I have 2 fish, a black moor goldfish and a shubunkin.
My black moor is the first fish I've ever owned and the first pet ive ever owned and I bought him at petsmart for $6.
I have made ALOT of beginner mistakes with him and I'm honestly very grateful the poor little thing is still alive in the 3 days I've had him.
1.) I put him in a 2 gallon tank filled with tap water and no water conditioner, no nitrogen cycle, nothing.
2.) I fed him goldfish flakes and I think he may have swim bladder disease because of this.
3.) He almost died in the 2 gallon tank. It was the 2nd night I had him and I noticed he was floating on his side on the top of the water. I had the tank but I was afraid to put my 2 fish(I had gotten the shubunkin on this 2nd day) in as the water conditioner told me to wait 24 hours and I hadn;t even gotten bacteria for the tank yet.

Now ive gotten a lot of advice from this forum. But I haven't made an account until today. In the last 3 days Ive made 3 trips to petsmart to buy a bigger tank(5.5 gallons right now, which I know is small but its all I can afford/fit in my apartment right now), bought Seachem Stability and Regulator for the tank, have properly been cycling it with the stability and I have cleaned the tank once(Ive only had this new tank for 2 days now).
The PH is at 7.4 according to my attached reader on the tank, the ammonia levels are >0.02 ppm. I don't know about nitrite but I think I'm okay with that too because of the bacteria from seachem stability ive been adding for 2 days now.
The only thing I'm really concerned about is my shubunkin and my black moor being in the same tank in the first place. I fear that because my black moor is still a little sick(I'm strongly suspecting its swim bladder), my shubunkin is bullying him into further not eating. I do not feed them fish flakes anymore, I bought Omega One small pellets for goldfish for them.
My shubunkin is healthy, he's very fast and he eats all of the food I drop into the tank. I have had to take my black moor out twice now to feed him seperately because if I dont, he won't get to eat.

Are they supposed to be tanking together in the first place? I only bought the shubunkin because I saw that in the aquarium at Petsmart where I had gotten my black moor, there were also shubunkins in the tank.
Or is my shubunkin only bullying him because my black moor is sick? I know goldfish are cannibals so that's another reason I'm concerned.

To clarify again, I'm very very new in fish owning and pet owning in general and I just want my fish to be happy. Ive made a lot of mistakes but I think ive been doing better and I'm not putting my fish's lives at risk anymore.
 
Katie13
  • #2
I would rehome them. It's way too small and won't even work as a temporary home unfortunately. The tank would be great for a betta though!
 
Iridium_2256
  • #3
So you obviously you know that you need a bigger tank, which is good. I've seen many a beginner throw their fast-growing 25 cent feeder fish in a tank the size of a teakettle and leave them alone for 2 months, then wonder why the thing dies. But let me get off my tangent here.

First, how big are the fish right now? are they still juveniles or have they grown for a bit in the pet shop? As for the compatibility, once you get that swim bladder fixed the shubunkin will be a faster eater than the moor, but should still be fine if you keep an eye on that
I would pick up prime as well, as it binds up ammonia, nitrates, and nitrites(I wish there was an acronym for that, lol) for 48 hours, so you may be able to keep your fish in the tank while it's cycling(still risky though)
Other than that, the only major issue is they will grow quickly, so you will need to make some size accommodation for them. A 5.5 will work for a little bit, but my previous feeder fish grew from about 1/2 an inch to 3 in 6 months. A betta would suit the tank a little nicer if you can't get any larger of a tank. Good luck!
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #4
So you obviously you know that you need a bigger tank, which is good. I've seen many a beginner throw their fast-growing 25 cent feeder fish in a tank the size of a teakettle and leave them alone for 2 months, then wonder why the thing dies. But let me get off my tangent here.

First, how big are the fish right now? are they still juveniles or have they grown for a bit in the pet shop? As for the compatibility, once you get that swim bladder fixed the shubunkin will be a faster eater than the moor, but should still be fine if you keep an eye on that
I would pick up prime as well, as it binds up ammonia, nitrates, and nitrites(I wish there was an acronym for that, lol) for 48 hours, so you may be able to keep your fish in the tank while it's cycling(still risky though)
Other than that, the only major issue is they will grow quickly, so you will need to make some size accommodation for them. A 5.5 will work for a little bit, but my previous feeder fish grew from about 1/2 an inch to 3 in 6 months. A betta would suit the tank a little nicer if you can't get any larger of a tank. Good luck!

I think theyre both juveniles. The black moor was listed as a small, and the black moor I picked was smaller than all the others in the tank with him. Can prime be used with the stability? I was concerned getting in because I thought the prime would kill all the ammonia that the bacteria from the stability feed on.
 
Iridium_2256
  • #5
Prime will just bind the ammonia to make it harmless to fish, not neutralize it. I'm pretty sure it won't disrupt your cycle. It won't affect the bacteria in stability either.
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #6
Prime will just bind the ammonia to make it harmless to fish, not neutralize it. I'm pretty sure it won't disrupt your cycle. It won't affect the bacteria in stability either.
A bit more related to the original topic but do you think it would just be better if I took my shubunkin back and got a slower swimming twin tail to be a companion for my black moor instead? I feel bad but I do care a lot for my black moor and I'm really not sure if theyre compatible tank mates. I did a little more research and every website I clicked on said that it isn't a good idea to have these two tanking together.
 
david1978
  • #7
If you took one back I would just keep the one till you could upgrade its home. Another thought I had would be if you had a filter for the 2 gallon you may be further ahead to put one in it since there isn't much difference between 2 in a 5.5 or 1 in a 2.
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #8
If you took one back I would just keep the one till you could upgrade its home. Another thought I had would be if you had a filter for the 2 gallon you may be further ahead to put one in it since there isn't much difference between 2 in a 5.5 or 1 in a 2.
That's another thing, the filter on the 2 gallon didn't at all which was another mistake I made having them in that tank. It was one my friend gave me until I could get my own tank, I didn't realize it could be so detrimental on the fish.
I do realize a 5.5 is small and will eventually upgrade when I move out of my apartment into a house in 2 months, but for now I think 2 would be okay. The only reason I'm so against having only 1 in the 5.5 is because fish are social animals too and I don't want my black moor to be all alone.
 
pugletfan
  • #9
Welcome to Fishlore!! Many of us have been in your shoes. I know I have. You have come to a great forum for information and guidance.
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #10
my black moor refuses to eat at all today. what do I do? I plan on cleaning their tank today, the ammonia levels are at 0.05 ppm right now. I just bought seachem prime and I'm hoping that will imrpove the water from what ive been using(top fin water conditioner)
 
Iridium_2256
  • #11
He will be fne for about a week or two if he refuses to eat, but he is obviously not happy. I would put him in his own tank as soon as you can
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #12
He will be fne for about a week or two if he refuses to eat, but he is obviously not happy. I would put him in his own tank as soon as you can
ive just decided to take the shubunkin back. I can't bare watching it try to eat my very sick black moor. I'm unsure if I should take my black moor back to petsmart too and ask if they can help me with him
 
Travis Bradbury
  • #13
To be honest, listen to almost nothing people at petsmart have to say. Most employees there are there for just a paycheck and have next to little or no fish knowledge at all. This isn't always the case, but 98% of the time it is. Also their fish typically has a disease.. again not always the case but most likely.

Your better off trying to find somewhere that sells just fish specifically. I'm in Toronto, so that's Big als for me. From there its pick and choose(if you have multiple places to choose from) and base it on how you like it, how knowledgeable they are.

When it comes with putting those fish into a small tank like that.. only thing you can do is get a bigger tank or remove them. That is too small for them. That might be why one of your fish is bullying the other. If one dies take it as a lesson learned, don't get discouraged.
It was a bad idea to put them in a small tank like that in the first place, but we all gotta learn somehow. I suggest buying a bigger tank that's a TALL. if its a TALL tank(like say a 30 gallon TALL) the diameters will be small on Width and Length, and it is a lot taller. With this you might be able to fit a bigger tank inside your smaller apartment because the aquarium is just TALLER.

Go look at websites selling used things(kijiji, craigslist, etc) and look for a used aquarium. You will have to clean it yourself, but it doesn't take long to do that for say a 20 gallon tall. Theres plenty of guides on this site to help you buy and clean a used tank. Read them before buying so you know what your looking for before buying(ex. cracks)

I'm gonna chime in on some knowledge YOU NEED to know, and just other things. I've said this exact same thing to beginners many times, so I'm just copy and pasting from another post I made from another thread to another beginner

- First things first.. READ UP ON THE NITROGEN CYCLE!!!!
Its literally the MOST important thing to do when it comes to this hobby. UNDERSTAND IT. LIVE IT. LOVE IT. WITHOUT IT YOUR FISH TYPICALLY WILL DIE.

- Bigger tank is much more easier to maintain(maintain as in not killing or stressing fish).
If you want a community tank I suggest getting a bigger tank tbh.. You'll get that "omg that will be cool to have, and that, and that, AND THAT" feeling.. might aswell have the space for it.

- When it comes to maintenance for a bigger tank grab a Syphon. You hook it up to your sink and can add and remove water through a single tube.. no slugging water.. this makes water changes extremely easy on bigger tanks.. rather than chugging 5+ 5 Gallon buckets of water both emptying and filling.
If you are going a bigger tank, buy one used, and clean it yourself. Many different threads about cleaning a used tank. This could save you HUNDREDS of $$$.. I got my 75 gallon+ stand for $90 CDN.

- When it comes to the type of fish for community, guppies, platys, danios, plecos, shrimp, mollys.. there's MANY different choices. The choice of fish is really up to your research. No one can tell you want you like.. search abit on good community fishes and go from there.

Fish-less or Fish-in cycle? Read up on the nitrogen cycle to understand this. Some people don't like fish-in cycle and think is cruel. Personally I think its okay to do.. Get a hardy fish. Keep + under 1ppm(while using because it detoxifys up to 1ppm)and your good as gold. I did a fish-in cycle on my FIRST TANK EVER and successfully got it done WITHOUT any deaths of my 5 guppies + 4 platies(which I adding during cycle). Though be prepared to do big water changes almost every single day!

Here is the formula I used for my fish-in cycle.
Ammonia + Nitrites = less than 1ppm add full tank volume of Prime, & . Recheck in 24 hours
Ammonia + Nitrites = 1ppm or more, do a 50% water change, add full tank volume dose Prime & Stability. Recheck parameters in 24 hours.

Stability just helps with the bacteria.. don't typically need it for a fish-in cycle but it doesn't hurt to get a small or medium bottle. I used it for the first week then ran out.

Fish-less cycle works just as well, but takes a lot longer usually and you don't get the pleasure of seeing fish in the tank. IF YOUR NOT WILLING TO DO LOADS OF WATER CHANGES(ALMOST EVERYDAY) DO FISH-LESS CYCLE.

- I do suggest getting .. doesn't have to be much. Past few weeks I've been dealing with green water because my too good of a light was boosting algae growth because I didn't have plants to use the nutrients in the water. I do have a recent thread on this if you care to read on it or look at the before and after pictures. Pretty sure you can view it from my profile.

- .. completely up to you. , or plant substrate. If you go sand you can buy it used. or cheap non-aquarium sand at hardware stores.. Pool filter sands seems to be the best non aquarium sand(which is what I have) though it comes with some cons.

Not sure what else to add.. feel free to ask any other questions
 
Cleo2019
  • #14
I would separate them. and quarantine the sick one.
 
pugletfan
  • #15
Returning one of the goldfish is a good first step.
 
bridget mary
  • Thread Starter
  • #16
Returning one of the goldfish is a good first step.
my store is closed :/ what do I do with this shubunkin? I don't want him near my black moor since my black moor is very sick. what do I do?
 
Cleo2019
  • #17
my store is closed :/ what do I do with this shubunkin? I don't want him near my black moor since my black moor is very sick. what do I do?
Sell it to someone.
 
Mcasella
  • #18
You can temporarily house the shubunkin in the 2 gallon until the store opens then take it back.
 
Cleo2019
  • #19
Is the shubunkin or the black moor the sick one?
Can't you give the sick one back since you said it was sick when you go it?
 
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