5 Gal Betta Set-Up: Advice/Help

I don't think a heater is going to be much good in a power outage

LOL, I didn't word that quite how I intended, did I? I was thinking about having a generator - in my area lots of people have them. Guess I forgot to mention that would be a necessity,....

 

Lol no problem I have one in case of hurricanes so I knew what you meant. ^^ Btw how do the readings look? I listed them above. Just got finished doing a 20% water change and adding a new silk plant for more foliage.

 

By those readings I would say that you're not cycled. Starting to, but not finished. Keep doing water changes and using Prime

 

Yeah the bacteria must have died before fish was added. :-/ Well I will just continue to cycle with him in there and monitor for any stress.

Now as far as water changes go, should I continue daily 20% water changes or is that too often? I've never done a fish in cycle so I'm not sure how often a 5 gal would need. I guess while ammonia is at .5 that means daily until it drops back down right? Then when it hits 0 every other day?

 

You actually don't want it to hit zero until you're cycled. You're going to need to use Prime daily coupled with water changes to keep it low, but not remove it completely.

 

Is daily water changes and prime daily going to make ammonia hit 0? I don't want to necessarily slow down the cycling process by fully removing ammonia it needs. I mean .5 isn't ideal but like you said merely means the tank is cycling - but I'm a little worried to switch to every other day with the water changes.

I know the live plants will also help with ammonia control (not a lot though since I only have 3).

So I'm not sure...every day or every other day?

 

Whatever is needed to keep the ammonia at 1.0ppm or below. Prime will render up to that amount safe for your Betta for 24 hours.

 

You know I could just do a test every day and if I see the ammonia start to spike close to 1 then I will do the 20% change, meanwhile using prime daily.

In regards to knowing when the tank is 100% done cycling, what exactly should the parameters be for such a small tank? I've been told by friends who keep very large aquariums that it can be difficult to get a tank less than 10 gal to truly cycle. Also if/when the tank does level out how often is it recommended to do water changes for a 5 gal? I've heard 2/per week from some and 1/per week by others.




Also just curious...so the tank has a filter which uses both a cartridge and a bio wheel on it. I know carbon becomes useless after so long, and at the same time I also know that you don't necessarily want to replace it because you are just then basically trashing your good bacteria.

Now in my old tanks (which had a massive filter) I used both the cartridge and a media sponge as well as bio balls to keep the good bacteria in place. That way I could replace the cartridges without trashing my cycle. But for this aquarium there is limited to no extra space available.

So what are your thoughts?
Is there a way to modify the filter or is replacing the cartridges with the bio wheel going to be safe? I know some argue against the bio wheels effectiveness...
(I can provide s of the filter if need be)

 

You can cycle any size tank. It may be more easily stabilized with a larger volume of water but it's not that hard. None of my tanks to date have been more than 8 gallons and they've all cycled.

As for that carbon cartridge, is the carbon in a sort of pouch between 2 sheets of "cloth"? You can just slit that cloth and empty out the carbon and keep using what's what's left. Most of your BB are going to be on the Biowheel anyway

 

Unfortunately it's the type where the carbon is separated with black grated plastic. You know I could probably just open that compartment up though and empty it out.

Also today's readings are about the same.
Ammonia: 0.5 (still)
pH: now up to 6.8 (+.2)
Nitrite: still at 0.5
Nitrate: 0

Only change was in GH which has cut in half down to 75 (-75). Reading could have been slightly off though.

Good news is that Ryuu is making bubble nests around the new silk plant!! It's a 14inch plant so some of the leaves I placed on the water's surface. Makes a great place for him and he seems to like the extra foliage.

 

So far so good! Still no sign of a cycle really kicking into high gear but you have nitrites so that's something

Just remember when you do rinse out your media (don't do it yet, at least not the biowheel) to swish it gently in old tank water or treated tap water. Untreated tap water could kill off your BB

Ryuu sounds happy enough though so you're on the right track!

 

Alright here are today's readings:

Ammonia: approx .7 (up)
Nitrate: 0
Nitrite: 1.0 (up .5)
Chlorine: 0
pH: approx 6.4 (down again)

GH: 150 (back up)
KH: 30 (down by 10)
Temp: 79-80 approx

I did not do a water change yesterday so I am doing a 20-30% today. Also adding Prime of course.

Ryuu is building larger bubble nests now and really just experimenting with smaller ones all around the surface of the tank trying to see which location is best. His coloration has really improved.

 

Is Ryuu the fish in your avatar? He's really cute. How do you pronounce his name? Like Rye-you? What are you using to test your GH/KH, the API liquid tester? If so, your KH is lower than mine, I didn't think that was possible. I recently added some crushed coral to my filter, it's supposed to keep the pH stable or raise it if I use enough. So far, mine's been stable but I'd like it slightly higher since I have snails and shrimps. I also had 2 pH crashes within a month in my new tank, which the general consensus seems to be caused by low KH.

 

It's actually a Japanese name for "dragon spirited" so the pronunciation is Ree-yoo but more of an "L" sound for "ree." It's kinda tricky to say, lol. He is a very active/spirited fish and the way he swims around almost mimics the ballet of a Japanese dragon. That and he's completely fearless to absolutely anything that enters his "territory." He attacks the siphon, net (for the shrimp), water dropper, etc. but surprisingly LOVES attention, i.e. fingers. He's a very unique fish behavior wise in my opinion. I put the net loop in the water the other day and found that he loves to swim through it. He spent about 10-15 minutes just going back and fourth; in and out. I'm very happy I was able to rescue him.

As for the KH and GH it's our tap water...come to find out our water is very low in metals and also low in pH. I'm not sure if that's problematic for betta? I actually use test strips (API) for those two tests, so it might be off, but honestly the colors are 100% same as what's depicted on the charts.

It seems the nitrogen cycle is trying to start since the I am now having a spike in nitrites. Ammonia should be down tomorrow though if that's the case. I still have a 0 nitrate reading though so I don't know how exactly long it's going to take.

Oh here's a new photo of Ryuu by the way. His colors have really come out beautifully. He is now more of a vibrant blue with bright white tipped fins near his pecs.
(And sorry for quality, I used my phone)







Ok so good news is that the tank is indeed trying to cycle. Today ammonia is down, nitrites are up and I finally am reading some nitrate levels (approx 10-15). Ammonia is still in the low .3's though so still needs time. Just going to keep up what I'm doing.

I did a 20-30% water change and added an Anubias start (literally just a leaf/steam with rooting) which had separated from the plant I purchased prior.

 

Alright another update:

I'm now getting a nitrite spike of about 2-2.5 ppm. At the same time my ammonia is still down at .2-.3ppm but it seems that there's really been no change. Yesterday it did go back up to .5 which caused me to do a 40% water change to drop it back down.

I know ammonia is needed for the start up, but should it really be staying at .2-.3 during the nitrite spike? I've never had my levels overlap. The good news is that nitrates have gone up so surely it means the tank is still on its way right? The betta seems to still be ok, eating voraciously as usual; though I have cut his feedings down slightly. He is one of those fish that will just keep eating and eating regardless on how much is provided.

He did construct a rather large bubble nest yesterday but today there are only very small ones. He has not shown any signs of panting though and his gills look nice and healthy.

 

It's common for some overlap in the different readings while your tank is cycling. Since your nitrites are up now, you know the cycle is progressing. You will probably see low nitrate readings soon. Sounds like your betta is settling in nicely.

 

Today ammonia levels are finally down to about 0.1 to 0 so there is little to none showing up on the readings.

I am battling the nitrites now which has spiked up to 3-4.5ppm. I'm doing 20% water changes daily, but honestly the Betta has shown no signs of stress. Gills look great and he is building fairly large bubble nests every other day in the morning. Appetite is good, and even the shrimps look extremely healthy. (absolutely none have died; so I still have 7 which I hope is not too many)

Nitrates are up to about 25-30ppm so the tank seems to be close. Just need to get through the nitrite spikes and I should be golden. pH has also risen to 6.8 but the GH and KH levels are still not that great.

As long as the Betta continues to behave/look healthy I am just going to continue my rounds. I figure if I see even the slightest sign of stress I will up the water change to 40-50% if needed.

 

My KH levels aren't that great either. I live in a heavy limestone area, so you'd think mine would be high but they are not. I've had 2 pH crashes in my newest tank over a period of a month. Thankfully with the addition of some crushed coral it hasn't crashed again, but I'm still only getting 3 drops on the tester before it changes colors. My pH is on the higher side (7.6) which is weird for having such a low KH. My shrimps and betta are doing fine as well. Sounds like you are close to having your tank be fully cycled. Keep up with the partial water changes and you should be good to go soon!

 

Hey quick question..

so I have been using apI strip tests for my pH levels, but purchased the liquid tester (API brand again) since it was on sale and also since they tend to be more accurate.

So here were my readings:
Strip test: 6.8-7.0
Liquid test: 7.6

Which one should I believe? I mean honestly the liquid test was more difficult to read vs the strip tester. How high of a pH can Bettas tolerate/thrive for long periods of time? I know fish can "adapt" to certain levels but I'd hate for the little guy to become stressed.

Oh also, nitrites are up to 5.0ppm but still no signs of stress....should I do a 40%+ change or stick to 20% and monitor the fish?




Oh and hey I have a low KH and high pH too if the liquid test is right lol.

 

HI pH is no problem at all. My bettas have done quite well in pH well above 8! What is your ammonia reading? Did you get the Master Test Kit or just the API pH test?

 

Ok awesome, so I won't worry about pH then.

Yeah I bought a master kit (API brand) the other day since they had them on sale. I was already using the liquid tests for ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates while having to use strip testers for the pH and KH and GH levels (since liquids were bought separately).

Ammonia is officially at a 0ppm reading and has stayed like that for 2 days now.

Nitrates are at 20-25ppm
Nitrites @ 4.5-5.0ppm

I'm just a little concerned about the nitrites remaining that high for 2.5 days now, though I know spikes are expected with a tank cycle. Should I up the water change (daily performed I should mention) to 40% or stay at 20%? I don't want to be changing the water too much to circumvent the cycle, but again I'm not too experienced with 5 gals.

 

Change as much water as you need to so the nitrites are below 1.0 and add enough Prime to the new water for the whole tank volume.

 

You are almost there! I'd trust the liquid testers over the strips. The last pH crash I had in my tank the nitrites were reading the highest level on the color chart for over a week. .25 ammonia and the usual nitrate readings - the ammonia never spiked higher. No problems with the betta, but I was doing water changes and dosing with Prime all the time it seemed like. Then one day - poof - no nitrites. It was pegged at a darker purple than the highest reading on the chart one day, the next day it was a nice teal blue. The little bacteria were busy that day I guess.

 

Alright guys I definitely need advice. My family has run into unfortunate circumstance and will need to travel for two days. Is the tank going to be alright??? We are in a new neighborhood so there is absolutely no one who can change the water for me. I have a friend who can feed the betta but that's it.

What should I do???
I was considering a 50%+ water change the day before we leave. What do you guys think?

 

What are your numbers currently? Also, how early are you leaving? I'd personally try to do it the day you leave if possible (of course, if still battling the nitrites, day before as well). Honestly, I'd just skip having someone come feed, especially since you are still cycling and that person wouldn't do the water change.

 

My readings right now are as follows:

Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 4-5
Nitrates: 15-20
Chlorine: 0 (of course)
pH: 7.6
GH: 150
KH: 30
Temp: steady 82 (with heater)

If the betta and shrimp don't feed in two days are you sure they are going to be alright? The betta tends to chase the shrimp when he is fed late. Unfortunately this is one of those fish who begs and begs for food and throws tantrums if his hunger isn't satisfied. I've cut his feedings down to two small feeding intervals to avoid bloat.

I'm completely freaking out as I had not planned this what so ever, I've been so diligent on water changes and prime dosing. I just want things to be alright. I have not viewed ANY stress from the betta what so ever, and the nitrites have been 4-5ppm for about 2 days now.




I don't leave till tomorrow afternoon, and I am definitely planning on doing the water change as close as I can to before I leave.

Would you recommend a high volume change? I'm up to doing whatever is necessary.

Oh I should also add I did do my routinely 30% water change today.



And I just checked my level(s) log and actually nitrites have been at 4-5ppm since Saturday. Again absolutely no stress observed with the betta or shrimp what so ever.

 

I would get a large water change in now and before you go.
Your fish may not seem to be stressed or anything, but those levels are high
What are your parameters right now?

 

Same as listed above (I had taken those parameters in the afternoon). I did a retest on the nitrites and used a strip test on the ammonia just to confirm its still at zero.

The nitrites are still practically the same, maybe down to 3.5-4ppm now. I can do both a larger volume change in the morning and another in the evening before I leave if it's needed. I just want to be cautious to not shock the Betta from two large volume changes (temp here has been below 60F). I could do a 50%+ then a 20-30% change or do you think a 50/50% is better? I can honestly do any volume I have the time and the supplies.

 

Many people will go up to a week without feeding if they're going on vacation or something. I would be surprised if there was any concern with 2 days without food. Fish will generally try to convince you they haven't eaten in months, even if you fed them 5 minutes ago My honest concern would be the nitrites over the lack of food.

You mentioned the cold temps shocking the betta. Are you matching the water temp that you are adding to the tank temp before putting it in? This time of year, I try to adjust what is coming out of the tap to be as close to the temp of the tank as possible by having a combination of hot and cold going into the bucket.

 

I feed my fish every other day. So not eating for two days should not be an issue

 

No I haven't actually had any issues with shocking the Betta with the water, but have had to be careful when performing large volume changes.

It's been unusually cold where I live, so room temp is causing the new water to drop below 66 degrees. The tank is kept at 82 with a Hydor heater for the time being until the weather returns to its normal 78-80 degrees. Our tap is hard to guage so I just have been being more cautious, especially since a large volume change means the heater has to be unplugged. Basically I just add new de-chlored water that's slightly warmer/about same temp as the tank and add it in slowly.

I did a giant volume change today over 50-60% and was able to postpone my departure till tomorrow morning. So I am going to test the water again tonight and most likely do another medium/little water change.

 

When I do my water changes, I take a thermometer out of one of the tanks to get the temp out of the faucet the same. I usually read it a degree higher than the tank to account for any cooling from the time I take it from the tub to the fish and get the bucket of new water poured into the tank. I think if you do a water change before you leave and don't have anyone come in to feed the fish for the 2 days you are gone, you will be fine to feed when you do get home, and then do a water change afterwards (to pick up any food that might have sunk when you fed them). Try not to worry about your fish while you are traveling, and take care of what you need to do.

 

Also, since I don't think anyone has said it yet, best of luck with whatever it is that is causing the trip. Let us know how the nitrites are looking tonight, hopefully they're lower.

 

Thanks! Unfortunately it is a sudden illness in the family and I need to travel to stay with them until Monday. It was definitely sudden and unplanned unfortunately. I just moved a few months ago so I'm still settling into the new house. I've been home so often lately that I decided to get a tank and set it up (cycle; choose fish, etc) before I had to return to my studies and work.

I've been out of fish keeping for a few years so I've forgotten how frustrating it is to cycle a brand new tank; especially one of small volume. Patience is definitely a virtue, I just wish I didn't have to leave it so suddenly. I've been "babying" the tank every step of the way so far.

Anyways...here are my levels as of tonight. And this is after yet another large volume change today.
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 4.5
Nitrate: 10-15
Temp: 82

(GH, KH, Chlorine still the same)
So only change is the VERY slight change in nitrite. I did have a .1 ammonia reading but I think it was a fluke because it was gone by the afternoon.

I am going to get up bright and early to feed the Betta and then immediately do a water change before I leave. I'm going to only feed him directly so I know all food pellets are eaten, that way he at least is fed Saturday. He can definitely survive fasting 1.5 days - even if he begs to differ (he is a voracious eating machine).

By the way I've noticed he's become more and more "nippy" and aggressive with the shrimps...at what point do you throw in the towel in housing them together? I'd hate to have to "fire" (give away) my wonderful cleaning crew, they do a fantastic job. He seems to chase them more and more, although they can take shelter in the low to the gravel plants I have in there. I guess I could get some more they were actually really inexpensive and easy to install.

 

I'm sorry to hear about your family member. Hopefully they recover quickly.

Patience it a virtue, one I definitely wish I had, lol. I was hoping the nitrites would be down a bit more today I think doing the water change, not feeding, and then you can do another large water change when you get home on Monday. Having a little less ammonia in the tank from fish waste due to lack of food, hopefully they'll drop a bit more while you're out of town, or even better, you'll come home to a cycled tank!

Have you tested your tap water by chance? I know mine runs .5 ammonia, so if I test for ammonia shortly after a water change, it always shows ammonia in it because the BB needs time to get through the ammonia I added. Hooray for Prime.

As to the betta + shrimp, I think it all depends on the individual betta. If he's going to eat them/constantly harass them, I'd personally give up on housing them together or add some extra places for them to hide out where he's less likely to find them. Some people have had wonderful luck keeping bettas with inverts, some have had horrible luck with it.

 

Alright so I just returned home and headed directly for the tank. Thankfully the fish is alright with no signs of stress (i.e. panting, abnormal color/behavior, etc). If anything he was more than happy to see me walk up to the tank and immediately went to begging for food.

Right away I grabbed my water testing kits for some readings (out of curiosity of how the tank fared while I was gone). Believe it or not nothing has changed...if anything nitrites have dropped to 4 instead of 5. The only thing that concerns me is nitrates have not budged what so ever...if anything the color looked slightly weaker, though read at the same level. So my readings as of today (before water change) are the following:

Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 4
Nitrates: 10
Chlorine: 0
pH: 7.8
KH: 30
GH: 150
Temp: 80F

Should I be concerned Nitrites aren't letting up? They're driving me crazy...I have been performing water changes daily with large volumes every 2-3 days. I wish those nitrates would boost soon.




Oh and yes our water does contain small traces of ammonia (very small) so the "fluke" reading was just me testing too soon after a water change.

 

Well, good that the nitrites have dropped a little bit at least. Maybe cut back to feeding every other day until the BB catches up and gets through the nitrites? Other than that, I'd just say keep doing the water changes, daily if needed, until everything is under control. My tap has ammonia in it too, so I completely understand that feeling.

 

So just a quick update:
Everything still remains the same, no changes at all. I've cut down on feedings to smaller portions. I was going to attempt an every other day regiment, but Ryuu threw an absolute tantrum. So every other day I am going to just feed him minimally (1-2 pellets).

Although I wanted to ask...I was doing a water change/gravel cleaning and I noticed something about his coloration. Now I use a LED light when cleaning since the aquarium light has to be off and removed to access the tank; and when it lit him up I noticed he is almost "marbling" around his face and gills, but it's a gold color? Is this normal in blue crown tails? And no it's not a rusty color like with velvet disease, it's a rich color that fades into the blue. You can really only see it well if you're shining a LED light on him; incandescent light doesn't really make it pop or as noticeable. His fins near his pecs are also starting to change to white with dark blue tips, so maybe he is just maturing? I haven't been able to capture the gold on his face yet, but here's a terrible quality of his fins.


You can see the "black" (which is actually a dark blue) spot on the one fin. The other has more of the change but he tucked it right when j snapped the . He is also starting to get lighter blue (maybe turning white?) on the top of his head.

 

He could well be a marble, in which case there's no telling what colour he'll end up!

 

I'm a little concerned because the scales are a iridescent gold, which makes me worry it might be velvet (just what I need right?).

To be fair though his pecs have grown in iridescent blue scales as well (not to mention have grown a LOT since I've had them, they've really fanned out). So again is it a sign of maturing/better coloration due to better water conditions, or something I need to be concerned with?

I cracked out one of my old point and shoot cameras since my DSLR is broken and under repair. I had to use a minor flash to capture what I'm talking about, but I want to see what you guys think. Let me just upload the s and I will post them in my next post.

Just more more info as to his behavior....he is not pinning his fins or scratching, his gills do not look inflamed, he is not panting at all, he is still very active swimming around the tank (not just staying at the top or bottom), his appetite is voracious as always, and he has been doing his bubble nests again. Did I forget anything? (lol) Oh yes and he shows immense interest when I approach the tank (follows my fingers and such).