40g Goldfish Habitat - Advice?

In a couple of days I am getting a 40 Gallon (breeder 36x18x17) aquarium, conditioning the water for 24hrs and then will be adding 7 White Mountain Minnows to assist me in cycling my tank for a couple of weeks or so. I had originally thought about doing a fishless cycle, but after reading around and asking a few question, some said that my goldfish would be fine cycling in the tank, others said they would not, so I decided to use the Mountain Minnows instead of the goldfish because they are hardier fish and can survive a lot of mistakes, as a beginner goldfish aquarist, this felt safer to me. After the tank cycles I plan on adding 2 young Oranda goldfish. Am I on the right track, is it acceptable to do it this way?

I also had a few other questions:

* I know that goldfish like to snack on plants, but someone told me that there were a few tough plants that the goldfish may leave alone, what are these plants? I would like some live plants in the aquarium to assist in water quality and the production of some healthy algae.

* Other than White Cloud Mountain Minnows, are there any other fish that are suitable to live in a goldfish aquarium, preferably mellow tempered, slow swimming, even if they aren't common or “mainstream” choices. However, I have no interest in loaches, plecos or snails (not sure if there are any other options).

 

I still say fishless cycle.
However I know nothing about goldfish.
We had an outdoor pond and they did great all year round actually it was two ponds connected by a tiny chanel.
Yes there's other fish that can live in goldfish habitat kinda but the white clouds are the most common and cheapest.

 

Take it from someone who has done a fish-in cycle, it is WAY easier and less stressful on you to do a fishless cycle. Yes, it takes some patience, but a little patience is way better than daily, sometimes twice daily, huge water changes and sick/dead fish and testing constantly.

Anubias are good with goldfish, and you might get lucky and get fish that don't eat plants. Mine don't touch the amazon sword, the rush or the crypt in their tank, other than uprooting them occasionally with their incessant scavaging.

Goldfish generally do best with just other goldfish. Two orandas in a 40 gallon is tight but it can work with lots of filtration and water changes.

 

Cherry barbs are great tank mates, as are gold barbs. I have pearl gouramis and dwarf neon rainbows with my goldfish as well.

 

I still say fishless cycle.
Yes there's other fish that can live in goldfish habitat kinda but the white clouds are the most common and cheapest.

What other fish come to mind?

Take it from someone who has done a fish-in cycle, it is WAY easier and less stressful on you to do a fishless cycle. Yes, it takes some patience, but a little patience is way better than daily, sometimes twice daily, huge water changes and sick/dead fish and testing constantly.

Anubias are good with goldfish, and you might get lucky and get fish that don't eat plants. Mine don't touch the amazon sword, the rush or the crypt in their tank, other than uprooting them occasionally with their incessant scavaging.

Goldfish generally do best with just other goldfish. Two orandas in a 40 gallon is tight but it can work with lots of filtration and water changes.

Difficult even with just the minnows? I don't really mind a couple water changes. Thanks for the plant name, that's a start. I heard that 1 goldfish needs 20 gallon and 2 need 30g, so I went with 40 gallon thinking that that would be acceptable with the minnows and the goldies. Is that not the case?

 

No, goldfish require much more than 20 gallons. You can't really believe the tank sizes on profiles - it's better to find out from people who actually keep the fish, who can give you practical advice.

The 40 is good because of the footprint - that extra 6 inches of width makes a huge difference. IMO 40 is still small though.

 

What other fish come to mind?



Difficult even with just the minnows? I don't really mind a couple water changes. Thanks for the plant name, that's a start. I heard that 1 goldfish needs 20 gallon and 2 need 30g, so I went with 40 gallon thinking that that would be acceptable with the minnows and the goldies. Is that not the case?

It's not a couple water changes. It's almost all the water every day, sometimes twice a day, without fail. For more than a month because of the cold water, the bacteria don't multiply as quickly and also because fish-in cycles take longer because of the water changes. Yes, even with the minnows. With any fish. You have to keep them alive to keep your ammonia source, so you have to keep the water habitable for them. And because they're already stressed because they don't have perfect water parameters, it's more likely they will get sick and then you have to deal with treating them on top of everything else.

I mean, it's your call, I'm just telling you my experience. A lot of people are down with fishless cycles because it's easier on the fish, but for me, it's because it is SO much easier on you.

I think 2 in the 40 gallon is fine, like I said, as long as you have lots of filtration and keep up on water changes once it's cycled and are prepared to vacuum lots of poop. I keep four in a 55g, but they're pretty small.

 

I agree, cycling with fish is very difficult on you and on the fish.

 

I have never had a problem using fish to cycle tanks I've used everything from Blind cave tetra, guppies and golden cloud minnows. All survived and are thriving.

 

I've heard from my lfs that gold fish require big tanks

 

Tetra Safe Start? Don't know if the cold water will affect it, but it's worked for me every time I've used it.

 

Yes, it'll work in room temperature water.

 

Happy thanks giving to you all, and I thought I’d be the only one checking the forum on this day.

Cycling a new thank--plan on at least 4 weeks, realistically more like 6, of daily water changes using a conditioner such as Prime or Amquel-Plus that helps neutralize ammonia and nitrite. If you get minnows first to cycle the tank, look into TSS-Tetra Safe Start to help kick start the process. TSS can work well with fish with small load such as minnows. Beware that when you do add goldfish, it will be a big shift in the load, and you will likely have to do some water changes then to smooth things out for a little while.

You will eventually find out 2 goldfish in 40 gal to be a bit tight when your goldfish are full grown. But it’s doable with diligent maintenance schedule. Something like 50% weekly water changes with a large change and through cleaning every other month or so should do it for a while, just to give you an idea. If you manage the tank well and your goldfish grow to be large and healthy (this will not take long—maybe a year,) you may start noticing it gets more and more difficult to keep the nitrate level nice and low. (Nitrate is one indicator which you can test for and gives you an idea of other toxins accumulating in the tank.) If and when that happens, your options will be to do larger water changes more frequently, or get a bigger tank.

I do love Anubius as well for my goldfish—no fuss and just as tough as misc algae you will likely have to deal with. My guess is that you will see some brown/black kinds of algae start to grow in sooner or later, even before the green kinds, and the best thing to do if you don’t like them is to just scrape them off physically along with your water changes. The more plants you can get to start with, the better results you will have. I like to plant my plants in large clumps or islands in my tank, so I can still vacuum the surrounding gravel when I need to.

The key with goldfish is regular water changes. You will be doing at least one every week for as long as you keep your goldfish. And your goldfish will give much pleasure back to you. I hope you have a lot of fun with them.