20 gallon long Apistogramma tank build

Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #41
I don't know... lot of rocks... needs more wood, I think. Otherwise good start.
Lol thank you! Believe me. If it weren't for being in quarantine with the vid, I'd have spent even more on hardscape and plants.
Here it is less cloudy than last night. Definitely needs more plants and wood.
IMG_20220109_074650.jpg
 
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TClare
  • #42
While more wood would be nice, I am sure it will be good once it is planted and well established.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #43
I
While more wood would be nice, I am sure it will be good once it is planted and well established.
I'm sure of it. I tend to plant densely from the start. It's killing me not having the rest of it here lol.
 
TClare
  • #44
I
I'm sure of it. I tend to plant densely from the start. It's killing me not having the rest of it here lol.
Hopefully won't be too long...
 
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Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #45
Water is less cloudy. Looks better now. I cut the wood into a few pieces to give more space for the light. Spread the cut pieces around the tank. Changed the island on the right a little to. I like this better. It'll look better with more plants and when the water clears a little more. I didn't do a great job rinsing this sand. Should have gone another half hour.
IMG_20220109_222536.jpg
 
NearMeBettas
  • #46
Tank looks gorgeous!
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #47
Thank looks gorgeous!
Thank you. Just got the caves in today. Fedex is goving me and buceplant the runaround about my plants. Probably going to have to get a refund if they don't show in the next day or two.
IMG_20220110_205945.jpg
 
NearMeBettas
  • #48
Thank you. Just got the caves in today. Fedex is goving me and buceplant the runaround about my plants. Probably going to have to get a refund if they don't show in the next day or two.View attachment 831361
Wow, that looks beautiful. You're going to Ave some happy future fishies.
 
MacZ
  • #49
Thank you. Just got the caves in today. Fedex is goving me and buceplant the runaround about my plants. Probably going to have to get a refund if they don't show in the next day or two.View attachment 831361
I hate those caves by now... I was going to ask. Completely forgot.
The holes are too big and Apistos prefer caves with one entrance. Often the females will dig the entrance shut so only they can get in and out. Either place them inbetween/under the rocks or take them out. They have no use for the fish and just take up space.

Otherwise I love what you did.
 
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TClare
  • #50
Yes, the caves spoil the natural look of the tank. Its not difficult to create small caves with rocks and driftwood, you could also try hiding the caves and partially covering the entrances, but as MacZ says they take up space...
 
Berryblue
  • #51
I agree that the caves take away from the aesthetic. One thing I have done in the past is to cover them by gluing Java fern over the cave, leaving all but the opening. Eventually, the roots will cover the cave and create a more natural look.
 
MacZ
  • #52
I have to add, I hate them because they are still marketed as cichlid caves. Which is simply impossible as the thousands of species have completely different requirements. There are cichlids that will never even enter a cave except in a case of life or death. There are scenarios where they fit, nonetheless. I would definitely use them in growout tanks for Malawi or tanganyikan cichlids. Or in quarantines. Easy to clean and remove.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #53
I agree that the caves take away from the aesthetic. One thing I have done in the past is to cover them by gluing Java fern over the cave, leaving all but the opening. Eventually, the roots will cover the cave and create a more natural look.
This was my initial plan. Wanted to cover them with the bolbitis and anubias i had coming in from buceplant but fedex has had different ideas unfortunately lol. Once I'm able to I'm definitely going to cover them with more plants.
I have to add, I hate them because they are still marketed as cichlid caves. Which is simply impossible as the thousands of species have completely different requirements. There are cichlids that will never even enter a cave except in a case of life or death. There are scenarios where they fit, nonetheless. I would definitely use them in growout tanks for Malawi or tanganyikan cichlids. Or in quarantines. Easy to clean and remove.
Believe me, i was hoping to hide them with a ton of plants but hopefully that will happen soon. If they don't use them i have no qualms with removing them but i figured I'd give it a shot, couldn't hurt. Don't have the dough for the fish yet so I'll be throwing one or two platy in there to keep the cycle going till i can get the apistogramma. I've got a tank i can put them back in when the time comes.
 
MacZ
  • #54
Believe me, i was hoping to hide them with a ton of plants but hopefully that will happen soon. If they don't use them i have no qualms with removing them but i figured I'd give it a shot, couldn't hurt. Don't have the dough for the fish yet so I'll be throwing one or two platy in there to keep the cycle going till i can get the apistogramma. I've got a tank i can put them back in when the time comes.
Oh, it's not about the visuals for me. It's the fact people still get tricked into buying them. I'm sometimes kind of a miser and when giving advice I'm always trying to show up the options worth their money and try to flag money graves.
These "cichlid caves" are on my list of products I try to spare people, just as one-use activated carbon filter cartridges and liquid CO2.
 
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Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #55
Oh, it's not about the visuals for me. It's the fact people still get tricked into buying them. I'm sometimes kind of a miser and when giving advice I'm always trying to show up the options worth their money and try to flag money graves.
These "cichlid caves" are on my list of products I try to spare people, just as one-use activated carbon filter cartridges and liquid CO2.
I completely understand. I'm a dog groomer by trade and see so many people buying usless products that don't work for their dogs (i.e wrong style brushes, bad harnesses and leashes, foods etc.) I'll try to set these up so they might actually be more usable for the apistogramma. Make the entrance smaller a bit, block the back entrance in some way maybe. They where supposed to be black as well to match the lava rocks but shipping everywhere in the U.S is all backed up right now.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #56
Plants from buceplant finally showed up. Only the bolbitis and anubias survived. The rotala coinleaf and the crypt retrospiralis both melted to mush. They're sending me a replacement package now. They no longer had the rotala in stock so I'm getting some anacharis instead(it was cheaper so i got a store credit)
IMG_20220113_200128.jpg
 
Linda1234
  • #57
My female hongsloi doesn't dig (I have other species of apisto that seem more prone to dig under drift wood); she does like a defensible corner - it seems every 2 weeks she picks a nice new spot to lay eggs (i have them in a 29 which is same length/width of a 20 long. The male will chase her when she is not ready to breed; so it is important to have a place where she can hide - he is not too aggressive with her (this is fish specific); and if she goes to the top and lower her fins he will leave her alone; also he doesn't harass her during feeding time. They've been together for about 18 months now.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #58
Haven't had the time to post or do anything with the tanks in a bit due to covid and a family emergency. Here's what I'm settled on so far. I feel it needs more epiphite plants and the rest need to grow in, but the scape is what I'm most happy with.
IMG_20220129_135437.jpg
IMG_20220129_135459.jpg

Now I'm stuck on 2 things.
1. I like the hognsloi but I'm looking at a few cacatuoides varieties that have really caught my eye.
2. Change the background to all anacharis with a sword i have in the back left in the middleish?
 
Linda1234
  • #59
Haven't had the time to post or do anything with the tanks in a bit due to covid and a family emergency. Here's what I'm settled on so far. I feel it needs more epiphite plants and the rest need to grow in, but the scape is what I'm most happy with.View attachment 834034View attachment 834035

Now I'm stuck on 2 things.
1. I like the hognsloi but I'm looking at a few cacatuoides varieties that have really caught my eye.
2. Change the background to all anacharis with a sword i have in the back left in the middleish?
In my not so great opinion the hongsloi have better personality than the cacatuoides. I favor nijensi; hongsloi and borelli over cactuoides... The only thing cacatuoides having in my opinion are strong colours in some of the domestic strains. Also they are a bit larger than, for example, the small borelli.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #60
In my not so great opinion the hongsloi have better personality than the cacatuoides. I favor nijensi; hongsloi and borelli over cactuoides... The only thing cacatuoides having in my opinion are strong colours in some of the domestic strains. Also they are a bit larger than, for example, the small borelli.
I don't mind a bit larger since this will be a species only tank with only two, maybe 3 if 2 females would work with 1 male. If it's not enough of a footprint then only a m/f pair will be going in. I'm not looking to get greedy with it but if it will put the males attention on another female, giving the other a break from breeding but i don't believe a 20 long will be big enough for territory reasons. I'm probably still going with the hongsloi but it will depend on what my lfs has in stock or even the online retailers i purchase from. I'm also going to take out the other stems, move the sword to the center and fill the rest with the anacharis. Overloading with plants has taken away from the over look of this tank i feel. Going to keep the epiphites to fill in the rocks, as well as add more anubias and some bucephalandra.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #61
Well, it's finally happened. I found a beautiful hongsloi at my lfs, the way i decided was to just go with what ever the store had in stock. Unfortunately they didn't have females but should be getting some next week so I'll be adding his girlfriend soon. I also had to "rescape" a little to catch the platy i used to keep the cycle going till i got the apistogramma. Not much but enough to say it's different. I also hid the caves and made the entrances a bit smaller with anubias roots and stones.
IMG_20220211_222920.jpg
IMG_20220211_222913.jpg
IMG_20220211_222908.jpg
IMG_20220211_222852.jpg
 
MacZ
  • #62
Nice specimen.

I just hope introducing a female works. If not you will have to take the fish out and rearrange the tank, otherwise he will stick to the territory he claimed and it becomes a dangerous situation for the female.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #63
Nice specimen.

I just hope introducing a female works. If not you will have to take the fish out and rearrange the tank, otherwise he will stick to the territory he claimed and it becomes a dangerous situation for the female.
Nice specimen.

I just hope introducing a female works. If not you will have to take the fish out and rearrange the tank, otherwise he will stick to the territory he claimed and it becomes a dangerous situation for the female.
Ill definitely keep a close eye on this. Those rocks thankfully have tons of gaps and caves on top of the two caves i put in there so hiding spots shouldn't be an issue. As it stands he prefers the left side of the tank with the anachris and anubias over the java fern but will travel to both. Worst case scenario i have a lone male with some top dwellers maybe? But I'm definitely giving the female a shot first.
 
MacZ
  • #64
Those rocks thankfully have tons of gaps and caves on top of the two caves i put in there so hiding spots shouldn't be an issue.
Hiding spots are not the point. The point is the male probably claiming the whole tank as his territory. If that's the case she'll be forced into permanent hiding. That's no life.

Worst case scenario i have a lone male with some top dwellers maybe?
What I proposed very early on. Would work easily and smoothely.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #65
Hiding spots are not the point. The point is the male probably claiming the whole tank as his territory. If that's the case she'll be forced into permanent hiding. That's no life.


What I proposed very early on. Would work easily and smoothely.
Right now it seems he's only claimed the right side. I might even change things up just before adding her to be sure but i think it will be fine. If not, I'll look into what was previously discussed. I'm feeling pretty confident it will be fine but it's good to have a back up. I've got a 15 gallon i can temporarily house her in if need be. Thanks again for your help.
 
MacZ
  • #66
Don't underestimate the territorial behaviour of these fish.
 
Fishnturtleguy933
  • Thread Starter
  • #67
Don't underestimate the territorial behaviour of these fish.
I won't. Any issues will be corrected before it gets bad and not after.
 
Linda1234
  • #68
My hongsloi is in a 29 is not too greedy; but the female does have to hide when she is not breeding. It is not uncommon for her to hide near the top in the plants or in the back behind the sponge filter or piece of drift wood. A 29 has the same width/length as a 20 long - just taller.
 

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