scatty

Hi everyone. Very new at this forum thing, so please be patient with me. What a great site!!! already I've learned so much. I've always kept goldfish with great success and grew up with big tropical tanks, but this is the first time I've done the tropical thing on my own. It was my sons birthday pres actually
So... we have this very harmonious little 20 litre tank that was originally for the betta. I've added 5 cory catfish and 6 white fin ornate tetras (so many as I felt bad having schooling fish in small numbers). Everyone appears very happy, and we've had no problems in 3 or 4 weeks, I'm just worried I've overstocked it. Any thoughts on that? I have no idea about pH, or anything else other than temp, which is 22-26 celcius. Appreciate any comments anyone may have.

aquarist48

Hello and Welcome to Fish Lore. First and most importantly is the nitrogen cycle.
http://www.fishlore.com/NitrogenCycle.htm
This will really be a great help to you.
As for you being overstocked I have to say yes, you are over stocked for a 20l (5.5g) tank. For small fish a good rule of thumb is 1" of fish per gallon of water. (this is a bit flexible).
Betas do much better on their own in their own tank. Thank can be very aggressive towards other fish.
If and when you have the means an API (liquid) Master test kit is most recommended on this site. This will test for your ammonia, nitrites and nitrates that is mentioned in the nitrogen cycle link I posted above.
Without knowing your readings for the above and being that you are over stocked, your fish are at risk for ammonia poisoning.

scatty

Uh-oh, that doesn't sound good. The betta we've had for ages. He started out in his own little bowl, but as winter hit I was finding it impossible to keep him warm enough, thus the bigger tank with a heater. I added 2 cory's cause I love em. This betta has always been much more aggressive than the last we had, and started attacking his reflection, and tearing his fins up in the filter initially. interestingly though, now the tank is so busy, he's calmed right down, is quite busy himself (when not resting in the weed), and seems to have joined the cory clan. The 3 new corys I have are only babies and are quite out there. They bump and bustle with the betta at feed time, and even suck on his fins a little at times. This bothers him not in the least. They wont nibble his fins will they? I've been assured that they wont, and it does look as though everyone's getting along famously. You've scared me with the ammonia poisoning thing tho! must read up on the nitrogen cycle. thanks so much for your reply. So much to learn!

aquarist48

Glad to hear that they are all getting along. You've come to the right place for information. I'm sure you'll get more responses as well. Many of us have been where you are and hopefully most of us have learned from our mistakes Have fun and learn as much as you can. It's a wonderful hobby.
If you have any more concerns just let us know! Have a good day today!

Lucy

Welcome to Fish Lore
Great advice from Aquarist. I'm glad everyone's getting along in your tank, sounds really cute.
It's going to be hard to keep the parameters in check with that many fish in such a small amount of water.
You may want to look into getting a larger tank. The tetras will appreciate having more room.

Good luck and enjoy the forum

Sharkitty

Welcome! You are quite overstocked, but as Aquarist said, most of us have been there at some point or another. Your betta is very likely to get nibbled at, and if he is getting his fins caught in the filter you should cover it with pantyhose (never washed with soap) or a piece of sponge. You should either get a new tank, asap, or take some of your fishies back if the store will have them.

scatty

What a great bunch of people here. Again, thanks all for bothering to reply - your help has been much appreciated. This morning I noticed the tetras looked pretty stressed and were not hanging together. Fortunately my friendly fish man was happy to take them back, so We're back to 5 corys and a betta. Maybe still pushing it but I have a good feeling about it now. It certainly looks more balanced. Unlike ol fishface (the betta). Not sure he's terribly balanced but he is totally entertaining. I took care of his obsession with the filter exactly as you suggested and also had to put a backdrop pic on the glass between the tank and the filter as it was in the black plastic of the filter that he could see his reflection. He continued to be obsessed with that spot in the tank for a while, and when I was convinced he was truly demented he finally gave up. Now he just swims madly around with the littlest corys and plays tug of war with them over bloodworms at feed time. It's the funniest thing they've got going on. 3 of the corys will take food from our fingers and love to spend lots of time at the top - I've never seen catfish like these ones, they're just so cute. Got a pH testing kit, and the guy at the shop can test nitrate etc whenever I need, so that'll do me for now. At the moment all is good and the tank is cycling well. Now all I have to do is id some snails that came with weed to make sure they're not pests. Anyone know how I can tell if they're pond snails or if there are others to avoid? Or even if it matters? Happy fishkeeping and thanks for the warm welcome.

Sharkitty

Hey Scatty,

For some reason us new fishkeepers (me just a few months ago) think that pH is the most important thing, when really it's just about the least important, so long as it doesn't fluctuate much. What you really should be concerned with is ammonia and nitrite, and I honestly wouldn't trust your fish store to test it.

How old is your tank? If it's not at least 3 months old I would guess that it is not actually cycled. Cycling isn't something you can see. Clean water and fish that look happy don't actually equate to a cycled tank. I would suggest that your very next purchase be an API Master Test Kit. They run between $20-$30, but will last you for years. I

n the meantime, you should commit to doing daily water changes in your tank of just about 50%. This will keep the ammonia and nitrite at reasonable levels. You can't see these things, but they will be deadly to your fish if they build up in the water before you have enought good bacteria to deal with them.

Let us know if you have any more questions!

Kara

scatty

Hiya Kara

The tank is about a month old. I understand it won't be running at optimum yet, but I think it's on it's way. 50% EVERY day wow. I've done 2 changes of about a third since we've had it, but you think that I could still poison them doing that? Is there a reason it hasn't happened yet? does it take longer than that for toxins to build up to dangerous levels? and if so, why change so much daily? Sorry if they sound like stupid questions, just trying to get my head around it.

As for trusting the fish store, I actually do. I live in a fairly small community and I know the guy is a fish FREAK and also has a really good rep. Plus he's been so helpful so far (I wish I'd started out thru him), and although he didn't actually tell me pH is ultra important, he did say it was a fair indicator if ammonia and nitrite levels start to climb. I have a background in chemistry (albeit food, not fishtanks ) and understood where he was coming from. Maybe my bucket chemistry style will not suit fish, I'll be careful, and buy the full testing kit asap. I guess that equates to about $50 Australian. Maybe next week.

Meanwhile, fishface and his cory friends look ALOT happier and more settled since the sudden population reduction.

I'll keep the questions coming, I'm sure. OH! here's one...If I have a population explosion of pond snails, will my betta eat them if I break the shells for him?

Sharkitty

Hello again!

Yup, 50% daily is pretty important. Bettas are relatively hardy, which is why they can survive in those death cups, but it still isn't good for their overall health to be exposed to the level of ammonia and nitrite that build up in an aquarium that isn't cycled, which yours is almost certainly not. Ammonia doesn't come instantly - it's a result of rotting food and poo, but if it's been four weeks with that many fish I'm guessing it's spiking pretty hard right now. I really don't know about cories. I'm glad to hear they appear happy, though.

Since it's only a 5 gallon a 30-50% water change will only take 10 minutes TOPS. Get a tube of nearly any kind or a pitcher and you're done super fast. Obviously don't forget the dechlorinator, e.g. Prime.

I don't know about your betta eating pond snails. If they are small enough I think he might, but he'd have to realize they were food. Someone who has tried it will hopefully come along and comment.