hooflady

OK I have a two month old 28 gallon tank. It's an upgrade from a ten and I've had the same fish fo a year with two new ones. Well, I put the two new ones in without a quarantine and then we got ick. OK so I trated and changed water all looked better but I ran out of meds. So what did I do? I bought this Lifeguard instant ocean all around treatment and it was for Marine Fish! I have tropical, bala sharks, algae eater, bottom feeder, sunburst platties and two tiger barbs (the new ones). Well this was in there 24 hours before I relized everybody looked terrible! COVERED in spots and hiding. I did a 50% water change and raised the temp from 76 to 82...maybe too fast. Now they are tail swimming and laying at the bottom...one is laying over almost sideways and my tiger barbs are head standing before my eyes. Will they be ok if I do another 50% change tommorrow or is this too much? We have spring water which I have tested at Pet's Mart and they say it doesn't need anything except some water conditioner...any advice? I'm soo lost! I deal with horses and this is alot more difficult! I Need help!

Lucy

Hi hooflady, welcome to FishLore.

I'm really sorry you're having trouble and your fish aren't feeling well.
Do you have your own test kit? It would help if we knew what the readings are for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates.
Also how many of each kind of fish?

Keep the temperature at 82 for at least 2 weeks to kill the ick. Also vacuum the gravel, I believe the spores can live there....someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.

I would increase the aeration, higher temps mean less oxygen in the water.
That would be my guess as to of part what's going on.

Others will be along shortly, and hopefully be able to help you more.
Hang in there, I know it's rough seeing your babies sick.

Good luck.

MissMTS

Welcome to Fishlore

I am so sorry to hear about your fish. I would definetly do another water change tomorrow and vacuum the gravel. How quickly did you raise the temp of the water? The reccomended rate is about 2 degrees per hour.

I know that this is a completely personal choice and I am in no way telling you that this is the decision you should make....but if you feel like you need to end their suffering there is a product called Euthanese that is used to humanely euthanize a fish that is to sick to recover. I just wanted to let you know your options, since your fish sound like they were pretty damaged by that Lifeguard medication.

Good luck with everything, and please keep us posted about any changes.

sirdarksol

Welcome to Fishlore.
Nope, Lucy, you're pretty much spot on.

Ich lives as a cyst on the fish, then falls into the gravel, where it undergoes rapid cell division, making hundreds of sister cells, which then become more ich.

Up to 82 degrees, higher temps will speed up the division process (good if you're medicating the tank, because meds affect certain stages of the cycle). At 82.5 degrees, a certain stage of the life cycle apparently stalls out, killing the ich over a couple of weeks.
I would raise the temp one degree more, just to be sure it was pushed over the 82.5 line, and add some anti-ich meds. I normally don't suggest meds, but it sounds like the ich has gone pretty overboard here.

Ich exists in nearly every water supply. Most of the time, fish can deal with it, but if they are stressed, their bodies can't handle the infestation as well. Because of this, it's really important to keep ammonia and nitrites at zero, and nitrates below 20ppm.

hooflady

Wow! Thanks! I raised the temp by adding warmer water but in 1/2 HR! I must be crazy! So I quickly added a few ice cubes after reading that the o2 was depleting. They did look like they were gasping for air! Well, I'm happy to say they look better already! I have a long air stone on full and a filter that pumps 100 gal. an hour. It's full of bubbles in there to treat the ick but such a quick change must have felt like being choked! The only ones that are still shaking some are the tiger barbs. I read they could only handle 78 degrees. I'm at 80 now and thought I'd wait to hear back before raising it tomorrow. I do not have a gravel filterand I've been changing 25% EVERY DAY FOR FIVE DAYS NOW. I just poured it in and it kicked up some gunk on the bottom. Guess I must have kicked up those spores (cysts?) and that's why they all look like they rolled in salt? I thought it was the medicine for marine fish. I removed it and put the filter in. Should I change it in two days or so and continue to raise the temp to 82? All my guys are in pairs like Noahtiger barbs, bala fish (one med 1 small) sunburst platty, red tail platty?, and gee I forget what those two are called.lol

sirdarksol

Yep. Two degrees every day until you get to 83 degrees (to put you over the 82.5 degrees).
Keep airstone going while the temp is up.
Use freshwater ich medication precisely as it states on the box.
If the meds say to do partial water changes each day, be sure to do a gravel vac while doing so (that will help suck up the cysts).
The barbs will deal with the higher temp for awhile.
Keep the temp up for at least 2 weeks, to make sure the ich dies off completely.

hooflady

Thank you all so much! I'll be purchasing THE RIGHT med to continue the five day treatment I started and get a gravel vac. Watch the temps and go from there...Do you suggest any certain brand of testing kit? I have been taking samples in but I should have one here and test often. Our spring has been quite full lately and it flows through our horse pasture...I'm thinking nitrates may be higher with the added "fertilizer" being deposited in that field. I think I want to know now just so I know what I'm giving my dog! Oh wait, and ME too!!! Which one should I get?

Alessa

Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Master Test Kit is the one most accurate and most reliable, used and recommended by mostly all people in this forum.

also, if you could get your hands around some of these "recovery" supplements: vitachem, fish protector, stress coat, or garlic guard, that would be great. The first is a vitamin supplement, the second two are water conditioners that #1 clams fishes and reduces stress and #2 speed up the healing proccess. And the third is a garlic supplement (can be replaced for minced garlic juice really) which boosts up their immune system. They are not neccessary but will really help your fish heal.

really sorry you are going through this!

Welcome to fishlore

hooflady

just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their quick replies as the temp. change may have killed my babies...all look better and are active except the tiger barbs. They are the new ones that I introduced just before I got THE ICK. Here's a pick of one of them I think they call this headstanding? Only one is doing it...I put in a mineral cube and water conditioner as well as some aquarium salt (but no garlic)Worked 14 hrs. today so I just got in and I have yet to get a test kit. Thanks for the readings and maybe someone could start a thread on symptoms such as headstanding and what their causes might be? I surely don't know but I would love to be enlightened!

clinton1621

The tiger barbs most likely introduced the ich if they are new to the tank and are the most affected, stress from transportation and being in overcrowded pet store tanks usually causes this outbreak... ever see green water in a tank at the pet store? They are treating ich, a couple of good recommendations are to study the fish in the tank you are buying them from, if ANY of them appear to have any abnormal spots, lesions, ragged or split fins, or just generally dont seem to be swimming or acting healthy dont buy ANY fish out of that tank or you are taking a chance on disease for your home tank. Also, as an extra precaution you may want a quarantine tank if you dont have one already =)

hooflady

They are new...I need to get my old 10 gallon out to do the quarantines...sad. I didn't even realize this. There was one in there that the others were eating on and I told the guy but he said they were aggressive and did that sometimes? Pet's Mart...

clinton1621

Its really sad to say this, but most people who work at pet stores know absolutely nothing about what they are selling, usually if there is an injured or dead fish in a tank that other fish are eating on its because it was sick... and most likely the other fish either are or will be sick as well, pet stores rarely treat their fish because they are only in their tanks for a few days before being sold and dont show any signs of disease until you get them home =( I forgot to add that earlier, dont buy any fish out of a tank if there is a dead fish in it just to be safe. I'm not sure what the "headstanding" you said the barbs are doing is, but my guess would be they could possibly have an injured/damaged swimbladder from stress and extreme ich infestation

sirdarksol

Salt may not be advisable with your tank inhabitants. I believe the shark will be extremely irritated by it, and every algae eater I've ever heard of is troubled by salt. While it does hurt the ich parasite, it is doing an equivalent amount of harm to fish that react badly to salt, keeping them stressed. I wouldn't add any more salt, and just keep doing water changes as the medication says. This will slowly remove the salt from the tank. Just my opinion, though.

Alessa

did you check for your water parameters yet? (ammonia, nitrie, nitrate?)

nitz

I noticed that you don't know about the nitrogen cycle. So does that mean you didn't cycle your tank before you put the fish in?

You might want to read this:
http://www.fishlore.com/NitrogenCycle.htm

Testing for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate as alessa has suggested is what you'll need to do. If you haven't cycled the tank, the ammonia and nitrite in the water are causing your fish even more stress.

Also, I was reading a thread yesterday that said you should have a filter that filters your tank water at least 10 times per hour. You have a 28 gallon tank with the filter turning 100 gallons per hour so you're under filtered. So you could do with adding another filter on there. Maybe someone else will correct me on this if I'm wrong on this.

Tiger barbs are generally schooling fish so it would have been advisable to get at least 5. Thank goodness you didn't or the outbreak might've been worse but that's something to think about after your tank gets back to normal.

fishchick

My tank has something wrong with water , the pet store does the testing , just have to take a sample of the tanks water down to pet store for them to test ! I lost all of my fish within days of each other had 3 rummy nose and 2 angels ! I did do a fishless cycle as usuall beforehand !

Lucy

I wouldn't trust a fish store to test my water they generally use the strips, which are usually inaccurate, and they rarely tell you anything but 'it's fine'.

I'd suggest you purchase your own test kit. I use the API master kit, as do many other members on the forum.
I did visit a LFS that did use the API kit, and I trusted those results.

Fishies-for-me

If any of the fish in one tank appear ill you may want to pass on any fish in the store as most chains and a lot of lfs have a central filtering system...it is all in the back and connects all of the show tanks...in effect making them all one big tank!! So if one fish in one tank at one end of the store looks sick...the fish you buy from a tank at the other end of the store could be incubating the same thing.