twinston

i just found the second dead hermitt crab. i'm not even sure where their shells are. something is killing them. i useed to have 4 of the red legg hermit crab and i see only 1 right now. there were also 7 of the blue legg and there is only one also. my cleaner shrimp also came up dead this evening and i got a spikemin ammonia, but not nitrite. i did a 25% water change. what could be killing the crabs or are they just killing each other for the shells?

clinton1621

What type of fish do you have in the tank?? The ammonia will definitely kill them, invertebrates are very sensitive to ANY levels of ammonia and or nitrites, even levels that fish can survive will kill all your snails, crabs and shrimp. Also maybe buy a copper test because some water sources have copper in them which will also kill them.

twinston

the ammonia spike is probably because of all the dead inverts coming up. before then all levels including nitrate was 0. which is why i am so worried.

clinton1621

Are you sure they are dead, or was it their "outer skin" after they shed that you found?

twinston

i found the legs and it looks like pieces of dead crab. if the crabs are not dead, then what is causing the ammonia spike. i'll try looking for the other crabs just incase

clinton1621

Maybe your tank isnt fully cycled?? How long has it been set up? you should have a low nitrate reading even with saltwater if your tank is cycled completely.

Tom

I know that when I got my scarlet legged hermits they molted right away and I thought they were dead, so just give them a few days and maybe you will see more running around the bottom of the tank. Also, what size is your tank? Cause if it is a small tank, the other hermits could have killed them for the space. If you have too many hermits, you will end up with a few dead ones.
Tom

twinston

it is fullu cycled. been up for about 3 months. also before the ammonia spike all parameter including nitrate had cycled to 0. the tank is a 55g. i ahad 4 red leg hermits and 7 blue leg hermits. i hope they're just molting. actually i forgot they did that. it may be just the dead shrimp causing the spike. i know thats dead, because the snails were all over it. what else can cause an ammonia spike?

clinton1621

overfeeding, buildup of decaying matter under/between/on your live rocks, anything dead (the shrimp) but it could have just molted as well

Tom

In the saltwater tank, you need to go really slow. You have to wait about a couple months for it to cycle properly, then you have to add a few things every couple weeks after that, so this way you don't get a sudden spike. And did you get cured LR or non-cured, that is an important thing to know?
Tom

twinston

i got uncured and used it to cure the tank. i thought once the water parameters peak and then go down to 0, then the tank is cycled. ammonia has been 0 for over a month now so has nitrite and even nitrate. that is why i'm worried about the spike. nitrite and nitrate are still 0. am i misunderstanding the cycling process?

Tom

That's really weird. I can't explain that, but maybe one of the more experienced SW keepers can help with this one.
Tom

Oil_Fan

Here's a long shot of question for you. Have you been hearing any tapping sounds at night? It's highly unlikely but you could have a mantis shrimp. They are some of the most ferocious killers out there. They come in via your LR. They have a arm used for smashing the shells. When they use it, it comes out as fast a bullet does. Needless to say it can smash the shells of a crab. Head to YouTube and do a search there. You'll see some very cool videos of them.

But I do agree that the increase in ammonia is likely from decaying crab. I do find it hard to believe that you ended up such an aggressive set of crabs that you only have the 2 left.

The water you use for water changes... Do you make it yourself or do you get it from your LFS? If you make it yourself, do you run it through a RO/DI unit? If you make the water yourself, it's quite possible and even plausible that the water has copper in it. If it's not run through a RO unit, then the copper will remain. And that would be deadly to inverts. So again a copper test kit would probably a good thing.

twinston

you guys have all been wonderful tryingto help me. i think i found the source of my ammonia spike. one of my fish is dead. i found her when i got home and looked around. i think it may have died on tuesday. its the last time i saw her briefly. she was having problems adjusting and stresed out. i also added amquel+ to try and detoxify the ammonia in the tank. the rest of the fish seem to be doing ok. the tailspot blenny is the only one that seems to be breathing heavily, but he's been doing that since i got him a month ago. i was still within my warrenty so they're going to replace her for me. i'm a little heartbroken so i think i'll go have some ice cream lol. thanks again guys. i'll watch out for a mantis though i'm not sure i've ever heard a tapping sound. i found another red leg hermit so i'm just missing one. i saw 4 of the blue leg so i'm missing 3 of those and 12 of the snails are still around so i'm only missing 3, but i see one of the snail shells on a crab, so i guess i know where one of the snails went.

Shawnie

Im sorry you are loosing fishies and crabs...one question for all the sw experts...shouldnt there be a nitrate reading if the tanks cycled? just curious because Im not a sw person ....goodluck with everything!

twinston

thats what i thought too, but someone told me that since i have such a deep sand bed, about 3in i have anaerobic bacteria and also i have hair algae in the tank which may be another reason why my nitrates are low. also my tank is very lightly stocked with gobies and blennies with a total lenght of about 6in in the tank.gobies and blennies are very slim. example a 2in blenny or goby occupies less surface area than say a 2in tang, butterfly or angel mainly because of the shape of the body.

Oil_Fan

My nitrate readings are usually 0. Though I am fighting with diatoms for the last couple of months. I'd gladly trade. The diatoms make my sand ugly!!

twinston

my tank did that too, but after a water change it went away. test for phosphoros. could be that.

twinston

oh and siphon the sand bed. it helped with mine.

Oil_Fan

I already do that but they come back in a couple days. I believe I do have some phosphates. The problem is that the API test for phosphates, the color chart is real subtle for the lower level of readings. Very easy to mistake one level for another. I really need to get another brand and see if it's any better.

Fishies-for-me

My freshwater tanks had a lot of diatoms ..but that is natural in new tanks. In one it has completly cleared up and the water is now crystal. The others I am still getting diatoms in one but green algae is the problem in 2....lol ...Whaddaya do??

twinston

that's what i'm dealing with the greens. i have my tiny regal in there and he's going crazy like i rolled christmas, birthday and thankgiving all into one and delievered it personally to him. with the diatoms, how old is the tank? it could be that you can just wait it out if your tank is only a couple of months old. like i said mine just went away on day and hasn't been back since then.

twinston

ok i just got another spike in ammonia again. it went back up to 0.25 yesterday. this time no dead fish. i did vacuum the substrate just to make sure there was no food buildup and added more amquel+, the ammonia is back at 0 today. i don't know if this could be the source, but i had a power outage 2 days ago and there was no one to open up my canister to release any gas buildup. now the fish is back to breathing heavily even though ammonia is now back at 0. what can i do?

nemo addict

just another point that if a hermit dont like it shell ie to small they will kill other crabs for there shell s do you have larger shells for them to move in to ?

twinston

well being the idoit that i am i didn't know that, so i guess that is what i'll be getting tomorrow. you know i just got another ammonia spike. the strange thing is that i haven't fed frozen food, added any new fish or had any die. SO WHY AM I GETTING THESE AMMONIA SPIKES ? i'm getting really worried now. i just happen to check my tank last night. i usually do at around 1am if i'm not asleep. i saw my firefish swimming erratically, and trying to hide behind the heater. the purple firefish was laying at the bottom of the tank barely moving. ammonia was 0.25, i had to do an emergency water change 25%, dose the tank with prime since it was all i had, and add a poly filter (which by the way is awesome. my water is so clear and smells wonderful). this moring everyone looks ok. now ammonia is back down to 0. somethig is kiling off my bacteria colony and i don't know what. any ideas out there?

nemo addict

wot water are you using ?? tap water or ro

twinston

tap water, but how can it be the water when the spikes are happening days later.

Oil_Fan

That's easy. Just removing the chlorine isn't enough. There could be other things in the water causing you issues. That's why I asked earlier if you used an R/O unit. They remove pretty much everything. It's very likely that you have some copper in the water.

Think about it...you do a water change. You increase the copper in the water but it will take a few days for the change to really take effect. You then have a snail die because of it. That in turn as it decays, causes an ammonia spike.

First thing is check with your water company. See if they publish a report on the water they deliver into the home. I know where I live they do. You check on the report for a number of things that could be an issue. Odds are you can check into that online.

Next would be to run a specific test for copper. If it comes back as being positive, check your water before adding it to the tank to verify the source.

Good luck.

twinston

thanks oil_fan, i'll look into it.

NirvanaandTool

Yea this about sums up why tap water is the devil for saltwater tanks.
Not only can it introduce nitrates and phosphates into the water which can cause huge algae blooms but it can introduce copper into your tank killing your inverts and coral.

I'd try to pick up an RO/DI system asap. What a difference they make.

Mine (Typhoon III from Air, Water, Ice Inc.) came with a TDS (total dissolved solids) tester to measure when the cartridges need to be replaced. I tested my tap water and it came up to 120-128 PPM of total dissolved solids. All that junk (nitrates, phosphates, etc etc) was then being dumped into my tank daily for my evap top off.
I tested the water after it came out of the ro/di unit ..... 0-3ppm! I've noticed a big drop in algae growth with it.