fishrule101

I am thinking about starring a FOWLR(fish only with live rock). I Already got a 28 gallon freshwater tank. I had it for about 1 month and a half. My tank haves compact lighting, rocks(not life),heater with tem at 80-82, filiter with bio wheel,and fake corals. I was wondering if i could keep the fake rocks in the saltwater tank so i don't have to buy any. I will only have about $90-$100. To make my life better my nearest fish store is about 45 mins. away. I will not have much money every week( I'm just 13). I know I will have to buy livesand($30), maybe live rock($45),salt($30) and a powerhead($20-30). I will need to know how to do water changes the cheapest way possiable, but still having heathly fish.I know I can keep my filiter,heater,and tank. Can I keep my lights? Anyways i just want to know what is nessary to keep my fish alive.

Jesses89

dont have that deep of a sand bed.... one bag of aragonite live sand (16 lbs) will proximately cost you 16 dollars or so.... in a 28 id say thats enough...

If its going to be just a FOWLR tank... those lights you have are fine....

In my opinion.. I wouldnt use the fake rock that you have in your freshwater...
Since moneys tight do this...
Get Lace Rock.. which will cost you about 98cents to 1.98 a LB... and then just buy some nice peaces of real live rock and put it on top of the lace rock... this will seed the lace rock and it will become live over time(7 months)

I wouldnt use the fake rock, but id definitely use the fake coral, since its going to be a FOWLR.

On salt... go with Instant Ocean... bag for 50 gall costs about 11$
you can fill your tank (28 gallons) and make the rest in an extra tub or something.. like a walmart tub... for future water changes...
will you have a skimmer?
if you dont get a skimmer id recommend doing a 5 gallon water change ever week.


as for powerheads... id get two maxijets 300? about 10$ each? or if u want more flow go with the 600s .. and id put one on each side of the tank.

What kind of heater is it? You have to realize that freshwater heaters wont work for saltwater tanks.. the saltwater will screw it up...
so youre going to have to probably buy a new heater... they arent that expensive.. check them out at your LFS.

anything else you need to ask just ask... pm me or whatever. Im happy to help..

GreenMan13

Saltwater is always a good idea to go slow with and if you are on a budget even more of a reason to go slower.

What I would do...

Do you like doing DIY stuff? Look into that for what you need. If you do if will be cheaper but will take longer to set up, specially if you do DIY Live Rock.

DIY Live Rock will cost about $40-50 for materials but will make more then enough LR that a 28 gal would need. You would need to seed it with some Natural LR though too which will be another $10-20 at least. This will take at least 4 months to make and get safe for fish though but would be the cheapest. Live rock is usually the most expensive part of a Saltwater tank. If you don't make your own, the lace rock might be a good idea, I dont know much about lace rock. At $1/lb it will run you about $20-30 plus some Natural LR at $10-20. This will take a few months too but not quite as long. Other wise you will want to go with Natural LR which will run you at least $100 at $4/lb at the cheapest.

Check the heater to make sure it was made for fresh or salt water since it will not work if it is a fresh water only.

A skimmer would be a really good idea too since they help keep tanks stable and help prevent costly mistakes. You can buy one of these for a little over a $100 to more or DIY for a little under $100.

The lighting should be enough. How much wattage is there?

Live sand you can just get play sand or pool sand and let it become seeded. This will take more time though too so your fish will have to be lightly stocked. That would be about $5 for 50lbs which is more then enough.

Then you will still need powerheads, salt, specific gravity meter which will run ~$50.

Salt water is not cheap in any way possible. What I have suggested with out fish will cost about $250 but that is over multiple months. Keep us updated on what you plan to do.

fishrule101

Thanks for the help. I am really glad i found some help. My heater is sw safe . I don't really know what the wattage is. On the back it said 24PS. I filiter is also sw safe. Yall never told me if i can keep it. If I want to buy play sand how will I seed it? What will i need to look for on the sand to make shur its fish safe. I will let my fish tank cycle for at least a month before i get fish. What do yall recommend for stater fish? I don't really think I will be able to buy a skimmer.I'm thinking about putting in a clowfish for the first few weeks after its cycle. Is too many for the first time,because i've read that sw fish need more room than fw. How many fish can i put in the whole tank and not be overstocked? These are the fish i'm planning in keeping 1 clowfish,2 firefish(hopefully purple),starfish,three green clown gobies,two or one shrimp that is red with white( i forgot the name),and a yellowtail damsel fish or three or four striped damsel fish ( if i get those i'll get like three) is that overstocked? I will get these fish over a long peroid of time. I will not get them each week. If yes what should I take out?

GreenMan13

That's good that is sw safe. Don't know what the 24PS is.
You can use that. Most people don't use HOB or canister filters anymore for saltwater due to the Live Rock doing the same function but better.
This is done by the Live Rock bacteria and critters. Basically you want sand that is not going to be sharp, have any metal in it, or have any chemicals in it. Play sand that you can get from HomeDepot will work or Pool Filter Sand bought from a Pool store. Both will need to be rinsed.
You need to cycle it until it is done cycling which can be more than a month. The time will depend on what you do about Live Rock. You didn't say what you thought you were going to do about that.
I don't think anyone will suggest doing your first Saltwater tank without a skimmer since they help buffer you from making huge mistakes that will kill your whole tank which will be pricier then a skimmer.
I don't know much about stocking quantities other then it should be lighter then freshwater. I haven't gotten there in my research.

What are you going to do about Live Rock? That will be the first major step to decide since it will determine the time frame before you can put in fish.

offminded

is lace rock the same as base rock?

fishrule101

I don't know what i'll do about live rock because my LFS is about 45 mins. away. I think I will be able to buy at least 5lbs of it. How many pounds should my fish tank have? One of the fish stores I go to sells live rock for 7.50 per lbs and petco sells 60.00 for 20 lbs of it on the net. The store( not net) sells it for 5.50-9.00 lbs? The problem is my fish store that I like seems always run out of it. They have this other thing the looks like coral but its with the live rock not corals. Its white and looks like branch coral.

Oil_Fan

I don't think so. I have some base rock in my tank and it looked totally different from the lace rock that I found pictures of online. Base rock is a bleached white color before it goes in the tank. The lace rock looks more like real rock right off the bat. And as near as I can tell, they both will turn into LR as the bacteria takes hold and such. Lace rock looks like it maybe a bit more porous but there is plenty of base rock that is too.

What I would do since you have limited funds, find a place either online or a LFS and has nice pieces of base rock for the majority of the rock. Or lace rock if you can find it. Look for stuff that is very porous. This will convert faster and be better for the tank. Then get a couple pieces of the real stuff. I bought a couple pieces from PetCo and I think it cost about $15 and was around 8 lbs. or so. Now it will take longer for the base rock to convert over but it will happen. If you can afford it, you can use a product like Stability by Seachem and it will get bio filter up and running in 8 days. That way you can add livestock a lot sooner. A small bottle would more than do you and it's not that expensive.

The HOB filter is fine but you'll rarely need to use carbon in it. Just use it when you need the clear up the water. Most of the filtration will be done by the LR anyways. Just keep the sponge in it. That'll also catch any larger chunks of stuff in the water.

The big problem for you is going to be the skimmer. Do you need it immediately?? No. You could get away without for a month or 2. It was about a month and half before I got mine. Will you need one? Absolutely!! They are very important. You may want to look on Craigslist and see if someone is selling a used one for cheap. You may even find some LR on there too.

Oil_Fan

You also asked about a shrimp that you couldn't remember the name to. It might be a fire shrimp. They're red with white spots. If it has a red stripe down it's back, then it's probably a cleaner shrimp.

This is my fire shrimp:

Jesses89

im going to have to disagree with the playsand, from home depot...
its ugly and will make your saltwater tank look unnatural... and itll take forever to be "live"
like i said before id just go with a bag of live aragonite sand... that will, again, cost you about 16$... the bag is 16 lbs of it. thats all you need.
(its already live and contains tons of different forms of beneficial bacteria... and micro fauna..)
from my experiences.. this sand stays cleaner than the rest...


thats the type of sand i have in my 75 gallon reef.
some pics of my sandbed

Jesses89

IMO... i wouldnt add any damsels... in a tank that size... they will get very territorial and bully your other tankmates nonstop.
there an endless list of types of fish you can add... look at the list again and tell us what kinds you like.. make a stocklist of about 4 fish.. and go from there..... more than 4 fish.. and id say youre overstocked... since you wont be getting a skimmer...

also are you planning on getting a test kit?

Jesses89

Its called Tonga Branch... its pretty much "live rock" but its way more expensive... since its perfect for reef tanks.. and it comes from tonga?

Since your fishstore always runs out... you can preorder some? pay for it... and when they get the next shipment they will hold it for you til you go pick it up...

Jesses89

Nice pic of that fireshrimp oil fan... i can never get a good one of mine since he doesnt like to be out in the open....

stripe down its back? are you talking about this kind of shrimp?



sikeeeeeeee i woulndt recommend that..

But the one you are talking about... with a stripe down its back... is called a scarlet skunk cleaner shrimp... cool shrimp
heres an old pic of mine..

GreenMan13

You will need about 1 to 1.5 lbs per gallon. So for a 28 gal that would be 28-42 lbs. Look on DrsFosterSmith.com

offminded

i didn't know petco sells live rock...i have never seen it at my local petco...is that something you have to order online? is the rock of good quality?

fishrule101

What? I can only add four fish??

fishrule101

I don't know. The rock on the web site said carrebean rock.

fishrule101

Yes its a skunk shrimp. Can I get one one those?? The next page haves more questions.