Rams bred in my Community tank

[dking271]

A little background. I have three tanks running in the house, and will soon be setting up a fourth. My most established tank (46g heavily planted) was set up over a year ago and was intended to be an Angelfish tank. I put eight juvenile Angels in an attempt to get at least two of them to pair. Well that never happened, and as they grew, we began to cull them down. I now have what we believe to be 3 females (Pearl Scale Koi, Gold, Marbled) and one Male (Marbled), and we can not get him to pair with any one of them. All of my women squable, but they all seem to get along with him. Now, fast forward.

I've had a male German Blue Ram (jumbo, 2.5" in size) in this tank for around three months, and have been looking for a suitable female with no luck. I have also been preparing another tank to be a breeding tank for another pair of regular German Blue Rams. Well, last week I finally decided that the tank was ready and went down to my LFS to purchase a new pair (1.25"-1.5" in size). We put them into their tank on Saturday, and by Sunday afternoon, the male was relentlessly harassing the female. I made the decision to relocate her to the community tank that afternoon. Well, my jumbo Male (Bowser) seemed to fall instantly in love with her. He started strutting around flashing his colors, and keeping everyone away from her. This morning, I noticed she looked pretty plump, and thought no way she could be holding. Later in the afternoon, she was cleaning the top of a rock cave with Bowser helping. Early this evening, they laid about 100+ eggs and have been guarding them ever since.

Some funny things we noticed. Bowser keeps going over to my bubbler, grabbing a bubble in his mouth, swimming back over to the eggs and releasing it right over them. I have never seen this type of behavior before. Mom and Dad (Bowser and Peach) are both taking turns keeping others away. I have the Lunar lights on in the tank and will keep them on all night to help both parents protect their prize. I realize that it may take several times for these two to get it right, so I have already tried to prepare my kids just in case. I can't believe this happened so fast.

Tank parameters are as follows:

Temp - 81
ammonia - 0
nitrite - 0
Natrate - <5
pH - 7.4

Diet:

TetraMin, Omega One Color, TetraColor granules (varies daily)
brine shrimp pellets
Cory Wafers
Algea Wafers (for Pleco, but they will eat it)
Frozen Blood worms (1-2 times a week)
Freeze Dried Blood worms (sometimes)
Freeze dried krill (rare treat)
Live Brine shrimp (sometimes)

Any help would be appreciated.

[dking271]

Our eggs made it through the night. Dad was on them all night, and mom took over this morning. I am thinking about taking the eggs out and moving them to a QT/breeding tank. I don't think they will have a chance in the community tank. What should I be looking for? How long before they hatch? Would a 10g or 20g be better to try to hatch and grow these guys out?

[dking271]

Update 7/5 am:

I decided to leave the eggs in the community tank, as mom and dad are doing their job well. Mom and dad have been cleaning out the bad eggs and doing a great job of keeping everybody away. This morning, I am down to about 15 eggs, all of which look good. I have a ten gallon and a breeding net ready to go, and I am thinking about moving the remaining eggs to the net today.

Update 7/5 10:35:

Eggs hatched earlier this morning, I have at least 6 wigglers. A few are are trying their best at swimming, and can stay up for quite some time. I had to put a few small air driven filters, as the HOB created too much turbulence. Mom and dad stopped guarding their spot and are returning to normal.

[dking271]

Update: 7/6 am

I can count 5 wigglers, not sure if there are anymore, as they are sometimes hard to spot. We are ready to start feeding once the egg sack is gone. They have a moss ball in the tank currently which should also provide some infusoria. They are trying like heck to swim, and will move from the bottom of the tank to about 2/3 up, then float back down to the bottom.

I'm guessing based on what I read the yolk sack will fall off between 3-5 days, in which time we will begin feeding 2-3 times per day.

Update 7/6 pm

Sadly we are down to one wiggler left, and I don't think he is going to make it. I may set up a a 50 gallon breeding tank for this pair. If they spawn again in the community, I will let nature take its course.

[Darlene]

Good luck with the pair...I can't really help you out any...just wanted to say good luck.

[dking271]

Update:

7/8 We lost the last fry overnight this Tuesday.

7/11 My two Rams have spawned again 8 days after their first attempt. Their batch is a little more tightly compacted this time. Looks to be about 75-100 eggs, but it is really hard to tell. It appears these two are determined to have babies. I will let nature take its course entirely this time, only removing the fry once they are free swimming.

[angelfish220]

I'm sorry about the original batch, I hope this one turns out better

[zeebo]

Hi dking271,

see below

1) http://www.angelfire.com/tx/CichlidPimp/
2) http://www.geocities.com/yutaka_loo/breeding.html

I have been unsuccessful getting them to breed. Can't get them to bond.

All the Best & hope to hear good news.

[yeepage]

just brought a pair of German Blue's and had my breeding tank set upfor a while... so he goes...

[Juand15]

good luck and keep us update, my females died before i even put them with the male and is so hard to get a female over here in NC

[freshwaterguy]

Good luck with the breeding shame you lost the first lot, Rams sure are great to watch.

I got two male and two female Blue Rams today in my 200L and they are so cool will have to see if they pair off.

One question if my GBRs do pair off and have fry what would the recommended size tank be for the fry 5g, 10g ?

[dking271]

This Ram pair is currently with fry (day 10) in a specially set up 10g breeding tank. My plan is to grow the fry out in this tank or another 10g. Realistically, I should have used a 20g to breed them, but the 10g was already available. I wouldn't go smaller than 10g on a grow out tank.

[freshwaterguy]

Originally Posted by dking271

This Ram pair is currently with fry (day 10) in a specially set up 10g breeding tank. My plan is to grow the fry out in this tank or another 10g. Realistically, I should have used a 20g to breed them, but the 10g was already available. I wouldn't go smaller than 10g on a grow out tank.

good luck with your fry and thanks for the advice, I am avidly watching my new GBRs who have been in the tank for approaching 24 hours and I know the week or so is critical. Fingers crossed.

[dking271]

As long as they are getting along in the tank, your Rams may pair off. Most of my pairings have happened quickly and those that haven't paired easily have rejected their mate quickly as well. I have one very dominant male that has rejected two females i have tried with him. I will probably try to remove him and place him back once one of my females has established herself in his tank. If your pair gets along well, without pairing, the addition of another female will usually get a pair established. Sometimes the males will mate with both females, though I have had better luck with the parents tending the eggs and fry when the male has just one mate.