DarkFin

Amanda

The pacu do need at least a 250 gal. tank to live confortably. They get over 2 feet long.

platy ben

They arent set for school, they are set for one fish, pacus get very large and require tons of swimming space.

Hillstream loaches require well oxygenated water and a strong current, neither can be effectively created in a small tank.

jgon_

Hillstream loaches need high currents to be happy and thus need a larger tank where you could properly set that up.

And adult Pacus get HUGE so a large tank is required.

DarkFin

ok, but Some of these fish need to be classified as one not as a school, this really throws off any ideas people have to put in there tank, I would like to get some loaches, but i cant get a single hillstream loach because it needs a 55g to feel comfertable!!!?

And your telling me that I cant get a heavily ariated tank in a 30g im pretty sure i can if i tried

Amanda

Hillstream Loaches need very specific living requirements. That is why a large tank is needed. Kuhuli loaches would do okay in a 30 gal.

DarkFin

that is bull many people on other sites even told me 1 oscar would do well in my 30g and a rainbow shark? im sure that 6 inch thing would live in a 30g not a 55g. I have had a common pleco in a 10g for 8 years now, and he has been fine, these pages are wrong.

jgon_

Its not just aeration. They need a strong 1 direction current to immitate the fast moving streams they live in. To achieve this with powerheads and some pipes you really do need a larger tank. Just tossing a powerhead or two in a smaller tank is only going to create turbulence.

DarkFin

and what about all the other fish

Amanda

No, you're being cruel to your fish, and not taking into account the damage you are causing them. A common pleco needs at least a 75 gal. tank.
A single Oscar needs a 55 gal. tank, they reach 12 in. in length.

jgon_

As Amanda said, these loaches need very specific requirments. So if you were to set up a tank for them you would need to find other fish (clown loaches, bosemani rainbows) that could also thrive in that environment.

DarkFin

THE PLECO HAS BEEN ONLY 4 INCHES ITS ENTIRE LIFE, IT HAS GROWN TO ITS TANK, and if i am being cruel, what could they possibly happen to them that already hasnt

platy ben

No, it hasnt grown to its tank, your tanks stunted its growth.

Im afraid your the person in the wrong, not fishlores pages.

jgon_

You have stunted its growth and have most likely greatly reduced its lifespan.

Not to sound too snarky, but why do you insist otherwise on the requirments for fish when we have told and shown you the proper conditions they need to live full lives.

Surviving =/= thriving

DarkFin

I have been reading on other sites that an oscar could live fully in a 30 gallon and not a minimum of a 55g

platy ben

They are probably saying it needs atleast a 30G to survive, but atleast a 55G is needed for it too THRIVE.

jgon_

The internet is not an infailiable resource. You can't just cherry pick the information from sites that is most convient for you. Look at other sites and see what the general concensus is.
http://www.oscarfishlover.com/

I think they'd know what they're talking about when it comes to Oscars.

DarkFin

ok, then tell me this on this site,

it says a 6 inch swordtail would do fine for a 10g
then it says a rainbow shark gets 6 inches and needs a 55g? why.

capekate

Im not sure what site you read that incorrect information from. An adult Oscar cannot live in a 30g tank and be very happy. Sure you can keep any fish in any size tank, but that does not mean its the right thing to do.

Alessa

Darkfin,

First of all a ed bellied pacu is a HUGE fish that needs tons of swimming space. It is not ok to keep it in a small tank... If you have been to a public aquarium you'd see how huge they get and the swimming space they need.

Second, Fishlore lists the fish you can keep in schools because THEY NEED to be in a school. They do not live happily alone.

Yes, a common pleco can live in a small tank... but did you know it is cruel? did you know it being stunted, feeling horrible pains because its internal organs grow too big for its body size?

Third, an oscar cannot live happily in a 30 gallon. It can survive and will die young and/or in a horrible death because they are huge fish and also huge waste producers, in a 75 gallon you'd even need to move them eventually if you are humane; fish need room to swim. A red tailed shark is a very territorial fish that will get very agressive with age, therefore it is recomended that it is kept in a 55 gallon, not because it does not fit, because it needs a large territory so it will not become mourderous with other fish.


Fishlore writes the fish requirements to live a comfortable, long life. If you want to listen to the advice that other people is giving you in the other pages, regardless of it being inappropiate or cruel to the life of the animals that is ok, it is your desicion but that does not mean that the pages in FL are wrong just because we try to provide people with the proper living requirements of a creature that needs attention and understanding.

Also, like jgon_ said, the people in the internet are not exempt of saying things that are wrong... but what makes more sense? keeping a fish that would, in its natural environment grow to be 18inches + in a 10 gallon tank, or just believing that it is ok, because the truth is hard to accept?


It is not about "if the fish fits at the begining then it is ok", there are many things about keeping fish so that they can live a long healthy life, not being stunted, live and die a painful death. So before you get angry at people for trying to guide others to do what is right for a living creature, think about the reason why we do it... fish are living things that need room to swim and appropiate living condionts, not objects.

jgon_

Rainbow sharks are agressive and need a larger aquarium to feel secure with lot of hiding places and an area it can claim for its own. In a 10g, that would spell heck for your other fish.

platy ben

Rainbow sharks need a large tank so they can have there own territory, if they were kept in small tanks they would attack any fish in their territory and their territory is normally large so most of the fish would be attacked in a small tank.

Butterfly

Swordtail has a small body mass and low bioload.
A rainbow shark has a larger body mass, heavier waste producer . also needs more swimming room.
These are a few of the things that need to be considered when choosing tank size for fish, not just over all length. When measuring fish you don't measure the caudal fin (tail) so in this case there would be more body to a RS than ST.
carol
Ok I just read the profile for the Hillstream Loach. As I have kept them before I thought 55g per fish was a little odd also. But the way I read the profile a group needs to be kept in a tank at least 55g.
From my own experience they need fast moving water, lower temps and hiding places. There are critters called aufwach that grow in algae and on plants and rocks. They don't actually eat the algae but these critters that grow in them.

Regal

You beat me to the punch Alessa, I was going to suggest that dark fin go to the zoo, see some full grown red belly pacus, and see if that changes his mind.

dark fin, are you sure that is a common pleco you have had in that tiny aquarium for 8 years? I stupidly allowed my little boy to pick out a cute little 1 1/2 inch pleco for my 75 gallon and after about 9 months I had to find him a new home because he was 10 inches long.

I think it's best not to overcomplicate things with talk of water composition and just ask you this: how about if we stick you in a glass elevator-sized box for a few years or so and see how a full-grown Oscar feels in a 30 gallon? I bet you’ll survive.

Could you post links to the references you found on the web?

Mike

I find it better to be conservative when recommending a minimum tank size for the fish profiles - taking into account their temperament, future adult size, schooling needs, water flow, decor, etc. I'm sure some have kept oscars in a 30 gallon tank, but I think it would be a disservice to the Oscar and to the new fishkeeper to recommend a 30 gallon tank for long term success.

The profile pages are simply recommendations given what we know about the species. Folks are going to do what they wanna do. We just try to give as much info as possible to help them make the best decisions for their fish and to make the hobby more enjoyable for them as fishkeepers.

agabr123

if you do a little more research, you will find that it is NOT just fishlore that recommends these size tanks for these fish......

Hillstream Loach - a little hard to find on the link, but at least a 3 foot long tank is required in order to create a "rivertank" which is supported by the second link
http://www.loaches.com/articles/hill...-the-fast-lane
http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fres...Loach.htm#Care

Pacu - first link has it in liters but it comes out to 260 gallons, second link has it at 300 gallons
http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_pacu2.php
http://www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/prof...bellypacu.html

Ranbow Shark - again second link comes out to 52 gallons (listed in liters), note on 3rd link that juvenile sharks can be kept in a 20, but adult sharks should be kept in a 55
http://www.peteducation.com/article....+1953&aid=2602
http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_frenatus.php
http://www.elmersaquarium.com/10shark_redrainbow.htm

Swordtail - liters on second link come out to 15 gallons, and on the first link the "20 inches long" for the aquarium size is in the range of a 10-15 gallon tank
http://badmanstropicalfish.com/profiles/profile27.html
http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_sword.php

Finally, the Oscar - liters on the first link come out to 529 gallons (saying that they need to be kept in a group of six)
http://www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?h=oscarfish
http://badmanstropicalfish.com/profiles/profile16.html
http://www.cichlid-forum.com/article...r_cichlid2.php

Shawnie

oscars cannot survive its life in a 30 gal...it would be like you living in a small bathroom ....and other sites have opinions just as this one does...we DO NOT reccomend them in anything smaller than 55 as some of us have kept them and know 30 gal wouldnt work ....if you want to choose to do so, thats your choice but the forum isnt going to change because another forum says so

buffinoz

i dont know to much but some of it comes to territory too
i had 4 rainbow chiclids of 2 inch in a 10gal
then oneday there all started fighting , killed all other mollies and swordtails in thetank so i now have 2 in a 33gal and 2 in a 23 gal with 3 danios.
fish need space too.
you could live in a room with a kitchen and a bed and a shower in 25square feet, dont think you would like it much

aquarist48

My brother had a red belly pacu in his 125g...the fish grew to 26" and out grew the tank...I've kept Oscars (2) in a 29 gallon tank for years. They were wonderful. Eventually I moved them into a 55g.

KyWildFish

I want to point out that this website has been the best source of information I have found for taking care of all my fish. The minimums that other sites post are not a good idea whe it comes to taking care of fish. If antything over-kill in space is always the way to go. I have a community that I know is overcrowded and the water requires water changes twice a week at times.
Also there is no need to get frutrated from conflicting advise. You will find a bunch of opinions out there on stuff and not all of it is truth. Being in the science feild I was once frustrated too when I started finding conflicting studies on the same subject. You have to become as educated as possible about something before making any conclusions because of cases like this.
Try and relax and enjoy the hobby, perhaps all your problems can be solved with a bunch of tanks, but then again I might be enabling.