atmmachine816

well gues both my cories are dead now and i am ready for a new bottom feeder this time i would like to try loaches. As much as i have read they like to be in groups and i havent found one smaller than 2 inches. Are they just like corys as they are fairly large and like to be in groups or are there any out there that stay small or dont mind being alone because i dont have a ton of space for them. So basically what i am saying are there any small ones 2-3" that like to be in groups of three or are there any larger one 4-6" that dont mind being alone and will they take care of flake food on the bottom? I am debating on getting loaches or shrimps.

newbie101

hehehehe kuhli loaches are 2-3 inches and like to be in small groups. They're like cories but they're loaches and cuter IMO

atmmachine816

yes but they like sand and i think it was butterfly who said the angels might view them as food so thats not good and i dont have sand so why torcure them

newbie101

do you have angels then? And yes they prefer sand but they will be happy in gravel too, as long as they have company

atmmachine816

yes i have angels my tanks are on my website you can look if you want

atmmachine816

i am on the chatroom on it too if you wanted to talk that way

Gunnie

Go to www.loaches.com and click on loaches species index. I can spend hours looking at those beauties and reading their profiles.

newbie101

wow, I just looked on there and hillstream loaches are cool! Now I want one They only grow 3 inches and are pretty much loners?

AnnaEA

I am in love with the http://www.loaches.com/species_pages...thermalis.html.

Even if my LFS calls him a 'Indian Leopard Loach.'

I'm going to get some for my tank -- start out with two, and if they seem happy at that number, then add a betta. If they don't seem happy (they're supposed to like 'groups') then a third loach, and I've got a species tank.

Anna

newbie101

Um I think you could still add a betta with 3...correct me somebody if I'm wrong...

Butterfly

Yes Emma the Hillstreams are really cool!!! I have nine in one tank and seven in another. They prefer an unheated or fairly cool tank. they look like little space ships swimming from one place to another.
When looking for loaches atmmachine816 a couple of things you want to look for are temperature requirements( some like it cooler), temperament (some are little hoodlums- Skunk Loaches) and some get huge(clowns).Sidthimunki's (think I spelled that right) are the smallest loach at probably 2 inches. but they are hard to find.
First you need to figure out why the cories died and make sure your tank is in good shape before buying more fish.
Carol

AnnaEA

I don't think I could have three loaches and the betta, Emma -- that would be 12 inches of fish to ten gallons.

Maybe if I were more experienced at this all, I'd give it a try, but right now I am a chicken newbie who doesn't want to risk over stocking her tank

Anna

atmmachine816

well i think the cories just died from old age but i have decided to not get loahes and just get a variety of shrimp as i have become very interested in them, right now i plan on ghost shrimp and amano shrimp and am doing research on others

0morrokh

If you want a better method for calculating inches of fish you can have, take the length of the tank (inches) times the width to get the surface area, and then divide by 12 in. This is based on each 'average' tropical freshwater fish needing 12 square inches of surface area per inch in length to support them with enough oxygen. In other words, a 20 long can support more fish than a 20 high. The volume of water doesn't really tell you how many fish you can keep. If your 10 gal is a standard 20x10x12, that gives you 16.6 inches.

AnnaEA

Another method I've seen for figuring it is 4 square inches of surface area per inch of fish -- by that measure, I get 12.5 inches of fish!

*lol*

But I'm a newbie, and chicken, and don't want to overstock my tank and end up with dead fish.... So I'm going with the lowest estimate!

0morrokh

I wouldn't call you a chicken, just sensible...a huge mistake of many newbies is to overstock.
Another thing to keep in mind is you can probably have more fish in a planted tank than an un-planted one. Wait...how did you get less inches with that 4 inch rule?? Shouldn't L x W / 4 be more than L x W / 12?? What are your tank dimensions?

atmmachine816

Yes i am using a rule similiar to that I wrote about that in my book reading diary and that's what i am doing, though antabotaids/labrynth fish need only about half as much as all other fish and small fish like guppies need 1.5x1.5 square inches of fish and so on. I find the book very interesting.

AnnaEA

Hrmmm... my math was wrong. The other rule of thumb I have seen is that each inch of fish needs a 4 inch by 4 amount of surface - which is 16 square inches, not 4.

Sorry -- math isn't my strong point.

My tank is planted... which is why I'm willing to push it to nine inches of fish in a ten gallon tank -- a lot of other rules of thumb I have seen for the newbie/small tank situation suggest that for a first tank (unplanted) I should try to keep it around 2 gallons per inch of fish.

*shrugs*

0morrokh

Don't worry about it, just add as many fish as you're comfortable with. At 9 inches, I do think you'd be perfectly fine adding another fish, but only do it if you want to. Or maybe wait a while and see if you want another one. But anyway, have fun with your fishies!

atmmachine816

Ya from what I can tell the inch per gallon rule is a good guidline to follow in standard tanks

vin

A standard 10g is 20x10x12. Based on that calc you can have 16.6 in of fish, though I would think that to be a little crowded......

For example, my 15g is 24x12x12. According to the calculation, I can have 24 in. of fish in that tank, but with the 8 fish I have in there now, it's pretty crowed at 15" when you factor in the decor and plants......And I only have one hollow peice of log, a cave and a small boat.....

Personally, I prefer to stick with the 1"/gal rule as it forces you to stay more aware of the tank's limits.

atmmachine816

Right now I am going around what my grandpa's book said since that's what he did and all his fish lived long and healthy lives. Works for me and I and my fish are happy, it's everybody's opinon

0morrokh

Well, everyone just use the method they want to, they all work. I think my method is better for if smaller fish than bigger ones--with anything over 2.5-3 inches I would probably cut down on fish. It is kind of wierd though, because in smaller tanks you have a bunch more inches than gallons, in medium tanks it's about the same, and in big tanks it gives you less inches than gallons.
bla bla bla, sorry I'll shut up now...