haedra

My tank was initially cycled, when I decided to add a bamboo shrimp and a golden mystery snail exactly 8 days ago.

And for these 8 days, I have been back in the depression of ammonia Land; back to worrying what I'm going to wake up to every morning, back to obsessively counting my creatures and making sure they are all alive.

I have been testing twice daily, and doing daily water changes while treating with Amquel+ and Novaqua+. And still my the ammonia readings keep hanging on.

To give a brief synopsis; the ammonia started creeping up slowly. It took probably 2 or 3 days to increase to .5ppm. But since then, even with daily water changes, it continues to rise; and this morning it was 1ppm.

I don't know what else to do... I DO vacuum the substrate, but I do it gently.. so while I am getting alot of random bits coming out, the gravel isn't getting so disturbed that I might be killing off bacteria living on its surface. But this is just my opinion.

The only brown on my hornwort looks to be a very little bit of diatoms on a few leaves. The rest of it looks quite healthy, so I doubt that there's rotting plant material in there. I feed my tank lightly, too. So I guess I just don't understand.. I know snails poop alot, but don't people successfully keep them in 2.5 gallon tanks with a betta?? And this is a 10 gallon...

I am so frustrated, and so worried over my corys that they are going through this again, after having been through the whole Safe Start process (the other thread I've got up). While I know it's a bit of favoritism, they are my FIRST PRIORITY. The shrimp and the snail are cool, but I love my corys; and I don't want to lose them. So I guess you could say I am at a bit of an impasse. I still have another empty 2.5 gallon that I am desperate enough to put the snail and the shrimp into, just so I can get the corys living comfortably again, at least as a temporary solution until I can come up with something better. I don't know what to do. I know I could keep on with the daily water changes, but frankly I just don't want the corys living in any ammonia readings for another day.

I realize there could be something else going "wrong" here, but I just don't know what it could be.. if my hornwort looks healthy. I've even been probably more careful then I need to be taking care of it. Not only do I take it out every week or so and shake off loose needles in clean water, but that clean water I dechlorinate first... so I am never adding residual chlorine to my tank.

I am very sad and frustrated right now. (I felt this required 3 hair pulling smileys).

haedra

Ok, how bout this...

There is a small amount of hornwort needles that get sucked against my filter intake. Would this be enough to cause the problem with the ammonia? Or is it still likely the snail and the shrimp..

Shawnie

awwwww haedra..im sorry you are going thru this again!!!

the only thing I can think of is the bio load was too much for the new cycled tank..but I cant imagine that 1 shrimp, 1 snail, and your 4 cories would overload a 10 gal that bad...but maybe because its relatively newly cycled, it did ..snails do have a bioload of about 2 gals per snail...I dont think your plant would be the reason unless you see alot of decay...what are your nitrate readings? that would jump too if your plant was dieing...I hope everything works out for you

haedra

My only other thought was what you had suggested; about the tank being newly cycled.

I haven't tested the nitrate in a little while, as I've almost been too scared that I feel like I can't trust the results, for the following reasons. One, I had apparently filled my tank initially with a high nitrate reading, even when it had no fish in it; as my tap water comes straight out of the tap with about 30ppm of nitrates. Once I discovered this, I started treating my "new" water (for water changes) with Amquel+ to detoxify the nitrate going in the tank. Kordon told me that the nitrate detoxing works just like the ammonia detoxing; in that all it does is break the bonds, so that it is "safe" for fish, but the plant can still use the detoxed nitrate. Thus, I feel like my tests for it would be as unreliable in that sense, in that my test kit will still detect the detoxed nitrate and I cannot get a true reading on what is in there.

Honestly, the only time I felt I had a little sense of what was going on in the tank with the nitrate was 5 days after I added the hornwort initially, before the tank was cycled enough to produce a fair amount of nitrate (in my opinion), as the nitrate readings actually went down by 10ppm from the initial 30-40; so I took that to mean that the "nutrient sponge" hornwort was using it.

So along with having started with 30ppm of nitrate, then adding a hornwort, then the cycling getting underway and completed... I fear I have no idea what is really happening with that byproduct in my tank.

haedra

Ok, here is another thought, though I am probably over thinking this!

Both before and after I work in my tank, I wash my hands and arms with antibacterial soap (as most bathroom soap tends to be). However, I rinse longer than I wash, in an effort to remove ever last trace of it. I also dry my hands and arms well before I plunge them in the tank.

Could this be an issue?? Or am I sounding really stupid right now.

Shawnie

no not stupid at all..and i do the same thing and worry but hmmm, i guess it could be an issue if the residue isnt gone...but again, extra rinsing and wiping usually takes care of it...im still going to go with an overload of waste for a newly cycled tank...I cant think of anything else unless the test kit is giving you false readings...those cories of yours are tough cookies!!

sirdarksol

I'm gonna agree with Shawnie: Too much bioload (you mentioned dead plant needles, which will add to the bioload as they rot). I don't think you necessarily overloaded the tank, it was just a bit too much, too soon. It wouldn't take much to swing the numbers, and cories are sensitive little fish.

cerianthus

I must have missed your other threads. How old is the tank since you added first fish? How are pH, nitrite (NO2) readings?

What I meant was how are pH and nitrite today since experiencing some NH3 problem after what seemed like cycled tank. It could be the added bioload but checking pH and NO2 as well wont hurt, imo.

haedra

For a very long and detailed explanation of every ocurrance, check my safe start thread in my blog. I can't imagine there's any information missing there.

I think you guys are right. Being too soon seems like a likely explanation. As far as the hornwort, while it seemed to be growing well, I have taken it out for now. I'm not confident that it wasn't losing needles beyond my scope of vision, because when I did the water change today and moved my airstone there was alot more plant stuff floating around that was not visible before. I am now afraid that I might have shot myself in the foot by taking it out, possibly due to less surface area being in the tank, or because of the at least a little help it was probably doing to keep the readings lower than they might have been. I might go back to java fern. At least I know that won't make such a mess, and it can grow in the average light I think I have.

The corys.. they have been troopers. While I know people have had great success with safe start, I don't think I'll ever use it again; except for circumstances you cannot avoid, like mini cycles, or disrupting the biological filter be medicating. I think in that circumstance, it would be a great product; but I'm unwilling to use it on a new tank again.

Sorry for all these edits...

On that token, should I choose not to go with java fern; any other fast growers (since I know java fern is slow), that preferably float, and aren't messy.. that would also be ok with the 15w fluorescent bulb in my 10 gallon tank?

sirdarksol

Anacharis is supposed to be a good floating plant, but I've had bad luck with it. I can never keep it alive.

haedra

What about duckweed? Or is this so prolific as to be a pain in the behind?

sirdarksol

Yes and no. Duckweed, if it can survive in your tank, will likely grow to entirely cover the surface of the water (which isn't always bad, but that depends on your stock). It needs to be thinned out periodically.
However, in most aquaria, duckweed won't survive, because it can't handle current. HOBs generally produce enough current to inhibit its growth.

haedra

Ah, well then duckweed is out for sure. The surface in my tank is fairly well agitated.

I don't know. I really really want live plants to work, for all the benefits they provide. But I don't have a green thumb to begin with, so I'm considering just giving up on them and going with fake plants.

sirdarksol

If you want a ridiculously easily-cared-for plant, get a bundle of Java moss or Christmas moss.
Buy a bag of oranges (the kind that come in the orange plastic net). Eat said oranges. Cut the top and bottom of the bag away, and cut down the side so you are left with a large sheet of the stuff.

Place the moss on whatever you want it to grow on (a new terra cotta pot works well), and wrap in the plastic net. The net will hold it down, and the moss will grow out through the net in a few weeks, until you have a big ball of moss in your aquarium.

haedra

That seems like a great idea! I will keep that in mind, for sure.

The only thing I am slightly afraid of is killing the java moss. I had a bunch of it in my small tank.. I thought I killed it, but now I don't know. The color didn't look right, and there were tiny pieces of it that got EVERYWHERE.

I really meant it when I said I didn't have a green thumb.. LOL. My house has been filled with fake plants since 1992 due to having killed everything green.

haedra

Not sure if this has been the source of my problem, but thought I would add additional information.

Upon doing my daily water change I moved the two ornaments in my tank to opposite ends for aesthetic reasons. When I did that, there was a whole lotta multi-colored crap (by that I mean debris, not just poop) floating around the water. Should I make a habit of lifting up decorations to vacuum underneath them?? I guess I was assuming wrongly that there shouldn't be anything congregating under there.

In part, I've been trying not to disturb the gravel TOO MUCH because I didn't want to lose any bacteria in its surface.. but if my tank is remaining too dirty this way, maybe it's a catch 22? If the bulk of the colonies are on the filter media anyway, should I just be more thorough and vac underneath these items?

For the record, seeing all that gunk go up my siphon was supremely satisfying, lol.

Shawnie

what color is your gravel? thats probably what you are seeing...and every other vac I lift everything

haedra

My gravel is black, the debris was all shades of white to brown. For all I know what I was sucking up was planaria remains.. I don't know. I did have visible planaria on my glass for only maybe 2 days early on in the first two weeks of my cycling; but whatever on the glass either retreated or was eaten, as that was a time period where the corys were obsessively nibbling at all the glass, and decorations.