armadillo

I am so annoyed with him. He just didn't understand the cycling process, so just proceeded to go to the petstore behind my back and buying 5 goldfish!

I am reeling right now. Typical of my dad.

This is after he'd said 'Of course we'll buy my little female betta together. It's our project'



So I got really annoyed with him and gave him a piece of my mind about having ignored aaaaaaaall the advice I gave him (1st was do NOT listen to the petstore). I also made him promise he'd give away 4 of the 5 goldfish, or get a way bigger aquarium.

jack11

Wow that must be infuriating. Wat were u planning on keeping in there?

Jack

armadillo

Thanks for understanding. He just totally didn't get my reaction.

He wanted a really easy fish, in a relatively small tank, so I got him a 60L (about 15G) for a female betta. That way, really limited risks of beginner's problems.

capekate

LOL Armadillo, that is so typical of 'dads'.... Ohh well.... Anyway, maybe he just likes goldfish?? They are an easy fish to take care of ...
Remember how hard it is to have a tank running without fish in it? Guess he is just excited about getting something into the tank. But I wonder why, if he was at the fish store that he didnt just pick out a betta? Maybe the thought of only one fish in the tank didnt do it for him.
It is soooo hard NOT to walk out of the LFS without a fish or two hehehe...
~ kate

Allie

Goldfish are great for cycling...maybe one he sees how boring they are he'll be more interested in betta

armadillo

Well I see it as something more sinister than that. I see it as a mini-betrayal. Call me a drama queen, but that project was kind of important to me. Am not close to my dad whatsoever and I thought I could at least have something in common with him if he started to enjoy fish-keeping.

So we went out and bought his set-up together, and I gave him all the info, and told him if there's three things you need to remember about fish-keeping that is:
- Always understock
- Never listen to petstore advice without double-checking
- Do not hurry and do research before doing anything.

I also said: You WILL wait for me so we can buy the betta together, won't you? And he said that of course he would, that it would be a great father-daughter outting to choose the fish together.

It's just typical of him: totally unreliable. It would be funny if it was an isolated incident, but he's always like that. Always promising, never doing. Always pretending he's listening, and actually never really doing so.

It's also for the fish. He treats it like a commodity, overstocking and impulse-buying like that.

He also is really not showing much respect to the time I spend researching about fish. You'd think he would realise that my advice in this domain is worth something.

Am really really really annoyed.

Chief_waterchanger

It is none of my business, but I think you should probably sit him down and explain to him what you just said about him. If you haven't that is. Hurt his feelings a bit, make him realize he is being the same unreliable person you've always seen him as, and you are coming to realize he will probably always be that way. Maybe a bit of an emotional jolt will make him take a step back and analyze his decisions and how they may or may not affect people. But by the same token you would have to go into that knowing he may not see your point of view and it may make a bigger rift between you two.

Anywho, I will get back out of your business now.

armadillo

Thanks, Ross.

That's how I see it too. Am a great believer in honesty. A message said calmly and objectively can have a great impact. That's why am waiting till I've calmed down.

Also, he'll probably do his usual trick of pretending to listen, and do the same thing next week. But I want to know that I gave him a fair chance to udnerstand.

It's just a shame that I could still believe something could bring us closer together, and he's, once again, made it cause a rift. Not exactly what I had designed.

I had kind of closed the door for years, and that's why am so annoyed as well. He was warned in no uncertain terms about how much this meant to me. So I think it might be time to close the door again for another 5 years. Shame, but there comes an age when you can't let your parents hurt you.

capekate

Hi Armadillo
I am sorry you are feeling such frustration, and I do understand what you are going through. I was in pretty much the same type of situation just a little bit differently. I have had pretty much estranged relationships with both of my parents since I was 18yrs old, and that was a loooong looong time ago btw. I had many years of no contact at all, due to a clash of wills you may say. I am just generalizing here for the forum sake. But the thing I would like to leave you with is a bit of my own advice. When you let go of your Expectations of others, you also leave out the disappointment they can cause you. It always seems that our expectations of what someone should do or not, leaves us with either disappointment or enlightenment if we are lucky. You were giving too much credit due to someone who has repeatedly caused you disappointment. Let it go.. and if you approach your father with no expectations, then you do not leave yourself up to be hurt.
You tried to do something that was in part doomed to failure as your past experience with him has shown you. It is commendable that you did try and that is a wonderful thing, but it has caused you hurt in the process. I learned long ago that you cannot change your parents, they have had a long time to develop their personality traits and you cannot fix what is ingrained in them. Approach them (him) with only what you want to give.. knowing what you will get from him and save yourself from any future hurt.
BTW, when my father passed away it was during a time that we had not talked for ten years. Could things have been different for us had I been in contact with him during those years? I doubt it. He is what he was.. as your dad is what he is. You have to think of yourself and what brings you peace in the world and that includes not harboring a lot of anger, since that is not healthy for you.
My thoughts are with you,
~ kate

armadillo

Thanks Kate. I've read your note carefully and will continue to think about it. We all have surprisingly similar experiences with our parents when we begin to open up. It's funny, in a way. How similar stories unravel in different generations and on different continents, and how some of us manage to break the patterns, like you evidently did.

Being scared of leaving our relationship as it is until he dies (he's only 65, but hey) is what motivated me to try again. And the fact that he's made amends for some of his letdowns from when we were kids.

It's so much better for you to be in harmony and to trust your parents, that's also why I tried again. The anger is tiring.

Am thinking if I have no expectation, how can I have love and respect? I worked so hard to get out of negative family patterns, and that makes me find moral fiber very important in people. I have really high expectations of myself, and those close to me, because I couldnt' trust my parents when I was a kid, so am always making sure am surrounded by really trust-worthy people.

I haven't cracked the code. That happy middle that would allow me to carry on an honest relationship with them, yet not have any expectations that he'll behave in a trust-worthy and dignified way. I just don't really get it. I know it's good to do it, but I just don't really get it.

It feels so much clearer and less risky to just close that barely-opened door, rather than risking being sucked in to their dysfunctional games again.

It's a shame, so I"ll think about it a lot and won't make a rash decision, plus I'll give them a chance to know how I feel, but basically I am no longer ready to open myself up to be let down again, like I was when I was younger.

I don't really need them emotionally anymore, and if they're not going to build me up, but put me down, then so be it. I've learned long ago to do without and become the adult that I am off my own guidance. I have a really good bunch of friends for that now. I am wary of re-entering a relationship that will only bring disappointments and conflict (if I keep my expectations of some decency). On the other hand, having no expectation at all, doesn't it mean having no relationship at all? That's the bit I can't crack.

It's funny how a small fish story can cause all of this, but it's just soooo very typical of them (my mom was in on this too), and I'd sooooo given him a chance and was very explicit about the risks if he was screwy on this one. He just didn't get it. His loss.

sirdarksol

Ugh...
That's really all I've got to say.
Ugh...
I can't really relate. I was lucky with both of my parents.
I'm sorry.

armadillo

he he he, you're lucky, Sirdaksol.

But I think that even if you were brought up in the most terrible conditions, it's no excuse for your failures. What I mean is I am normally pretty upbeat about it. Only this one's really bugged me.

What I mean is I don't normally let it get me down anymore, you know. I just want to decide if I want to continue to put up with all this stuff, and I need to be clear to them.

The problem is they have absolutely no clear limits. So to them, it was perfectly acceptable to transform my baby grand piano into a vertical cupboard when I was away at university because 'it was out of tune'. That sort of stuff. Or if your bedroom was untidy, it was OK to make what they called 'the big pile' and break everything in the bedroom, then throw it out of the window. Lovely stuff like that. Just people with no clear idea about right and wrong. As soon as I could, I left the house, and years later (nowish) they've made amends, so I thought, you konw, maybe, let's give it a chance. But I think a leopard can't change his spots.

Am not really upset about it, just, well, kind of bitter in a way. And definitely disappointed. But not surprised.

Chief_waterchanger

I'm glad you're atleast able to not be as upset as you could be, it would just tax your health if ya were. I know in a way what you are going through, but like you said, we all have our weird relationships with our parents... or atleast most of us do. I think you are on the right track. You have to learn that you can not change their behavior, and once you accept that it becomes easier. I don't have the answers for you, but I can give my view points and hope it helps.

I had resigned myself to being happier as long as I didn't have to be around my parents, so I moved almost 4 hours away from them and saw them only twice the year after I moved... They fell on hard times and moved in with me, so I have to see them several times a day now, but I must admit it was much easier when I didn't have to see them, didn't have to be involved in their drama... but I am happy, in a way, that I will spend more time with my father before he dies. We figure he has less than 2 or 3 years left, and it is kinda bittersweet. It would be easier to deal with if i didn't have to be around them or see them, but I'm sure I would hate myself for not being around them by choice after they are gone.

You have to decide for yourself whether not spending time with them is something you think you'll be fine with after they are dead and gone, or if you'd rather put up with their stuff and spend more time with them while you can knowing they will probably continue to be set in the same ways you've always known them to be.

armadillo

Well you've put your finger on my biggest motivator. I've lost two people who were very close to me and that's not been a negative experience in the long-run. It contributed to my philosophy of life in a good way, you know? As in what doesn't kill you makes you stronger and all that?

Anyways, all this to say that when some of us, like you, have been affected by mortality and disease from closer than in movies, I guess we are very aware of how flimsy it all is, and how fast people can get taken away from us.

What am trying to say is that, although my dad didn't get that out of our losses (not to screw people up because you don't live forever), I think I did, so I want to find a happy middle between letting them having a negative influence on my life, and totally cutting them off.

That balance is called humouring them and not trusting them one bit. I'd love to reach more, but I don't think it entirely lays with me, and I honestly think I'm doing what I can to salvage what's left of our relationship.

Up until recently, I spent 3 days a week with them for 3 months becauise of a project I was doing back in Belgium, and that co-habitation actually went surprisingly well. Because I decided to trust their intentions a little more. Now that's kind of gone a bit.

I totally hear you about life not being eternal, and I admire you for putting up with the complications and frustrations that daily life with your parents must bring. Am sure it will at least mean you don't have any regrets when the time comes to say good bye. You'll have been there for them, and you'll have given them more than most people would.