Eskielvr

Yeah, it is discouraging, esp with all the hardships I've been having. It seems like the all the other posts are being answered except mine.

Anyway, no I don't have a hospital or isolation tank. I'll be getting a 5 gallon one from my sis in law, but my Betta will be going in there.

Terry

Hi. I went searching and there are at least a few other forums similar to this one. One of the two others (and the best of the two) I just signed up for can be found with this link:

http://www.fishforums.net

You'll have to register but it's also free. They even have a forum devoted to Tropical Fish Emergencies which might get you more than the one opinion you've been able to get from one person here (me). It looks like all of the day old posts in this one have been replied to at least once if not more. It's worth a try. It seems like hit & miss on getting a reply here, unless you post an opinion here that someone doesn't agree with - then you'll get people coming out of the woodwork!

Terry

By the way, in addition to the other post I just put in, I just went & searched on neon tetra disease & it doesn't sound like that's what your neons have:

http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/di...eondisease.htm

So much for the incorrect comment by that one pet shop.

Using Google.com to search for a lot of this stuff can be more valuable (and quicker) than getting reponses in a forum. I'm not sure if you use Google or some other search site already, but if not try it. I just went to google on this one and typed in "neon tetra disease" and the search found a lot of sites with information.

Eskielvr

Ok, thanks. I'll look into those sites. Maybe people just don't like to respond to me? I have a hard time getting responses on my other forum too, except like you said, when something gets stirred up or I say the wrong thing.

Yes I've been using google a lot, as well as been on the phones with the Foster and Smith fish techs and technical support people. I'm so tired of being on the phone! I'm going to make one more call to the fish store where I bought my Ich medication and ask if there's a shelf life to it. I've had it since 2000 I believe. The one Neon definatly has some white spots to it now.

Well, so much for that. He just died now. I saw him swimming in circles upside down and before I could get to him he was already dead stuck in the filter. Now I'm left with 6, which was what I started out with. I've now lost 7 Neons and 1 Bumble Bee shrimp.....about $20 worth. Everytime I try to maintain an aquarium and do what you're supposed to do, water changes, etc, I can't keep fish. But when I neglect my tanks they thrive. Go figure.

Terry

Hi. Anything new on the neons or the other shrimp? Gimme some good news!

Eskielvr

Well, I didn't loose any today, but a couple of them have white spots now, too so I don't know. Today was the last day I'm supposed to use the Nox-Ich so I don't know what to do. I had to turn my lights back on because my Swords were starting to twist and one of my Anubias Nana's was starting to turn yellow. My last shrimp survived the dosages though

I'm think, tomorrow I may do a water change and put the carbon filter media back in and let it run for a while. I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do after that though.

schiz

I am by far not an expert, but I have had some experience with fighting Ich, if indeed that is what is wrong with the neons. My mollies, who seem to be my most sensitive water condition fish, are always getting ich about once every two months. I use a product called Quickcure which is suppose to cure ich in two days although the fastest I have seen it work is about 4-5 days. I am not sure if others on here will recommend it but it is cheap, about $2.50 and generally easy to find. I always remove any sick fish from my main tank, although most people do treat ich and usually only ich in their main tanks. I do not because I have ghost shrimp and most medications with copper will kill invertebrates. I have a 5g bucket that I use as a quarantine tank. I just drop my heater in there and do manual water changes while I am treating if it is a short period of time. Saves me the trouble of removing carbon and all from my filters. It also seems that since I have been keeping my temp at 80 I have had less trouble with ich. I work at night so I have not run across this thread before now, but maybe by keeping it recent someone who knows more will drop in. I hope your neons respond to treatment and become their perky selves. I myself have no luck with them, or anything from the tetra group. The three I have now are doing well but I will not be getting any more since its obvious a tetra keeper I am not. Rest of my fish have survived all my mistakes and are thriving.

On an unrelated note is that an American Eskimo Spitz in the pic to the left? It looks just like one I used to have, goodness I miss that dog.

katy68did

Hello and I'm sorry to hear about your fish and shrimp.I am a newbie when it comes to neons but I had problems with mine too.I bought 4 originally then added 2 more.I am now down to three.I noticed ich on 2 of them and treated my tank and did a partial water change but still lost 3 of them.My husband suggested(and it seems to have helped)filling large jugs with water and adding the start right or which ever brand you use and let the water sit for a few days before adding it to your tank.Since I have started doing this I have had no disease in my tanks at all and no out of sight level changes either.Hope things get better for you.

kalika

Hi there. I have been reading all of your postings and I too have had trouble in the past with ich/stores giving bad advice. I'm not sure what to do about yur neons but I can tell you that the difference between water being heated or not is the heated water naturally will dechlorinate itself as it ages. Or I should say, heat helps it do that faster if yu were to use aged water for partial water changes. What the person was probably thinking about when saying warm water has more minerals in it could be that hot water as it runs through your pipes and can pick up more minerals/metals than cold water will. I believe this is very old advice but then the age of your pipes could be part of it. Older homes (ancient) used to have lead pipes and so in the '70's when the CDC or whomever figured out that lead was in our water and was being drunk by people, it was toxic and over time could make someone very sick. It's the same lead that is in paint that was used or purchased before 1976. WHy pediatricians still test our small ones at the age of 18 months to 2 years for lead blood poisioning. Most pipes now-a-days are made of copper and other problem free materials. THe heat of your water isn't the problem. You may want to see what your pipes are made of but my guess is you are just fine and if your fish have been fine up until now, I mean, they have lived a decent time like 3-6 months at least, that isn't it. You could also call your local water company to see if they have changed their ways of treating the water but again, this has nothing to do with heating the water either before or after it is in the tank. I hope I helped a little in this regard. At least makes it so you have one less thing to worry about. Good Luck!!!

Eskielvr

Hi. Yes, that's an American Eskimo Dog. A Spitz is actually referring to any type of dog that has pointed ears, a wedge shaped muzzle, a tail that curls over the back and a double coat. So, Poms, Keeshonds, Sammies, Akitas, etc are all Spitz, too. It's just a classification such as Hounds, & Terriers. I also have a Shetland Sheepdog (Sheltie). Both are great breeds, but I'm definately fond of Eskies


I didn't post yesterday because we went to my sis in laws to pick up that 5 gallon aquarium for my Betta. But, before we left I had to euthanize yet another Neon. That left me with 5 but I could only find 4, but then last night I saw the 5th one. However this morning I only counted 4 again so I don't know where he's hiding. The one that had to be euthanized was another one with white spots on it. So far the rest seem to be doing good though.

My Nitrate test came yesterday and I tested it and it was either 20 ppm or 40 ppm, it's really hard for me to tell. If I held it against one light it looked like 40 ppm but when I held it against a different light it looked like 20.....so I'm not sure. I'll need to run to Petsmart to get new connectors for my Python since it broke. The last time I tried to change it without the Python I stirred up the gravel, but still didn't get much of the debris.

On a different note, I set up the 5 gallon aquarium and it's running. How long will it take to cycle with the Stress Zyme? Also, the filter that came with it is some kind of Tetra filter, that looks like a mini Whisper filter. But when I put the filter cartridge in it didn't have the foam that I believe it's supposed to have like the Whisper one does. I wonder if I can get the foam pad at Petsmart? It's basically just to give the beneficial bacteria some place to grow on. Right now all they'll have is gravel.

Oh, I also tried to use that Garlic Xtreme stuff made by Kent. It says to soak 1 teaspoon of food in 2 drops of the garlic stuff, but that's way too much food and causes the flakes to sink. It says you can add it directly to the aquarium water though, which is what I've been doing instead. I don't know if this stuff works or not but it sure does stink! I put the jar back inside the plastic container it came in, and then dropped that into a plastic zip lock bag and I can still smell it. Maybe I'm just smelling the drops I put in the aquarium? Either way it stinks!! lol

Terry

Hi. Sorry that the neon situation continues. Hopefully the ich attack will subside soon. No idea on the cycle time with the StessZyme. I've used it too but don't recall how long it took. I wish I could find Marineland BioSpira near me. I think there's one shop in Charlotte that has it but it's not close. Try some StressZyme in the tank with the nitrites - worth a try even in established aquaria. Not familiar at all with the Whisper filter types or the stink garlic med! Phew! Hope it works! Just pretend you're in an Italian restaurant.

Terry

I was interested in the freshwater shrimp and found this:

3. ICH TREATMENTS AND COPPER USUALLY AFFECT YOUR SHRIMP! Shrimp, inverts and most scale-less fish are sensitive to most Ich medicatons and other chemicals containing copper. (Read on) Amano shrimp and Tiger shrimp can sometimes handle Ich treatments when used in 1/2 dosages, the tough will usually survive, the weak ones will expire. The tough ones will molt shortly thereafter, so you won't want to treat again too soon. A better idea, buy a small hospital tank for your sick fish. (i.e. Eclipse makes great, inexpensive, and complete 2 and 3 gallon tanks) Check for additives like methylene blue, and malachite green that you put into your aquarium (usually ich meds), that goes for ingredients in your food too, check the ingredients label on your fish food, if Copper is near the top of the ingredients list, it is usually going to harm your shrimp and shorten their life! Copper is usually introduced from your tap water's HOT side, never use it, instead, if using tap water, use the COLD side only. We are testing a product that WILL be safe for scale-less fish and inverts, that we will be offering here soon as soon as our testing is complete.

I remember you lost one - this may be the reason? It also mentions using the water heater water - maybe that's what the lfs was talking about?

http://www.azgardens.com/shrimpfactory.php

Eskielvr

I heard that the Nox-Ich kills the beneficial bacteria in ponds, so I'm assuming it probably killed my beneficial bacteria then, too, so I didn't want to add the Stress Zyme until after I do a water change. I put the carbon filter back in yesterday so that probably sucked up a lot of the left over meds, if any.

One of the Neons is now chasing the others again so I don't know what's going on. One Neon has been staying close to the top with his mouth opening and closing rapidly. I think I'll just wait for them to all die off and then get some German Blue Rams or something. (After I do several more water changes and let the tank sit a while to make sure all the other stuff is gone.) I really wanted Neons, or something blue and colorful like that. Are Cardinal Tetras hardier? Maybe I'll try some Cardinals instead, since they're the same colors I wanted as the Neons.

The two medications I used didn't hurt my Cherry Red Shrimp, so at least I know that one's ok. I'd like to get some more sometime. I'd like to get more Bumble Bee shrimp too, but they like slightly acidic water and my water Ph is more around neutral. Or, I wonder if they'd adapt to the Ph like all the other fish have done?

tan.b

dont get too excited i'm no expert either, but i'll add a few thoughts at least! your nitrate needs to be no higher than 20, but preferable much lower, so i guess 50% water changes every day will get them down. high nitrates (or ammonia or nitrite) can cause stress and thereby cause disease. also, a non medicinal way of getting rid of ich which onw of the mods on here uses is high temp (about 80 i think) and 50% water changes. the temp speeds up the life cycle of the ich, and the water changes physically remove the ich paracites from the tank so they cant re-attach to the fish and multiply. i however had dying fish (not through the ich though! i had another disease in the tank too!) so was lacking patience for this and medicated which worked in about a week for the ich. i used medifix (antibacterial - for the other disease i had in the tank) straight after the ich treatment as didnt have time to lose with waiting a week or so before introducing a new med and they didnt harm the fish mixing those 2 meds together. i think tetras can use medifix, but just a reduced dose if ever you need it - always check first!!

anyway, assuming your tetras have ich, is it tiny white dots like a pin head? thats what was on my fish and it was just on their tails. if the white dots are really small its probably ich. if there's any bigger cotton wool looking white stuff going on with your fish it's probably fungal which will need an antifungal treatment.

i struggle with whats bacterial and whats parasite and whats fungal - i guess time and experience will teach us those! i've found very little in the way of pictures of diseases. just descriptions which are all quite vague and similar sounding!

also, i use water the same-ish temp as the tank when i add water to the tank so as not to chill and stress the little fish. i use a mixture of water from the hot and cold tap and add a dechlorinator to the bucket of water too before chucking it in the tank. i cant see whats wrong with hot tap water. its all come out of the same reservoir!! the cold mains pipes are prob made of copper same as the hot water pipes. anyway, my fish seem happy with it (now i've sorted out the ich and other disease which i think was columnaris, but i will never be sure!)

anyway, ramble over! keep us posted with how the tetras are doing. good luck. who said fish keeping was easy?! i was surprised how tricky it got when they got ill!! *
anyway, sorry i'm no big use. if i could help you i would!