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September 14th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| Is this ich or not?
From reading the fishlore articles on ICH and this thread, I think I'm doing the right thing, but wanted a second opinion.
72 G tank with one cat (mainly to start the cycle on August 1) and a Paratheraps Bifasciatus about 6 - 7 inches. Everything has been fine in the tank up till a couple days ago.
The Bifa has a bunch of white spots, mostly around the left eye, but one on the right, too. He has been in the tank for about a month.
Water has been very stable. Temp 78F, pH 7.6, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 10. Weekly water changes.
I have increased the water temp to 84F and added an airstone to compensate for the increased temp.
I purchased "ICH-X" made by Aquarium Solutions but have not added it yet. What are your thoughts on what I have done so far and whether or not I should add the medicine? | 
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September 14th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by vamedic11  From reading the fishlore articles on ich and this thread, I think I'm doing the right thing, but wanted a second opinion.
72 G tank with one cat (mainly to start the cycle on August 1) and a Paratheraps Bifasciatus about 6 - 7 inches. Everything has been fine in the tank up till a couple days ago.
The Bifa has a bunch of white spots, mostly around the left eye, but one on the right, too. He has been in the tank for about a month.
Water has been very stable. Temp 78F, pH 7.6, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10. Weekly water changes.
I have increased the water temp to 84F and added an airstone to compensate for the increased temp.
I purchased "ICH-X" made by Aquarium Solutions but have not added it yet. What are your thoughts on what I have done so far and whether or not I should add the medicine? | I would give the temps 2 weeks to work..2 gravel vacs a week also....meds and fish dont usually mix well and most always kill the cycle....great looking fish btw!! Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry1809 One platy dead this morning :-( | have you turned up the temps and done the other things jerry? sorry for the loss  | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by vamedic11 From reading the fishlore articles on ich and this thread, I think I'm doing the right thing, but wanted a second opinion.
72 G tank with one cat (mainly to start the cycle on August 1) and a Paratheraps Bifasciatus about 6 - 7 inches. Everything has been fine in the tank up till a couple days ago.
The Bifa has a bunch of white spots, mostly around the left eye, but one on the right, too. He has been in the tank for about a month.
Water has been very stable. Temp 78F, pH 7.6, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10. Weekly water changes.
I have increased the water temp to 84F and added an airstone to compensate for the increased temp.
I purchased "ICH-X" made by Aquarium Solutions but have not added it yet. What are your thoughts on what I have done so far and whether or not I should add the medicine? |
Idk about anyone else...but that doesn't look like ich to me. I'm not sure what that is. | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanda Idk about anyone else...but that doesn't look like ich to me. I'm not sure what that is. | the pic wasnt coming up when I commented but I agree that looks different for sure....its more raised and more cyst like..unless the pic is super enlarged? | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| That's what I was thinking - they look like cysts. | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| I did not enlarge the pics. I did zoom in to focus on that area. When I get home tonight, I will post a couple more pics to see if that helps. | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| ich is more like grains of salt ...not really raised as much so maybe its just a great camera...are the temps raised and such? is he doing any better? | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by vamedic11 I did not enlarge the pics. I did zoom in to focus on that area. When I get home tonight, I will post a couple more pics to see if that helps. | Ive moved your thread out of jerrys thread as I know you dont have a 20 gal with this issue and it might help members know more of whats going on with your tank...mixing it up with jerrys might confuse (me especially)  | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Keeper
| Skin Flukes maybe? Not ICH nor Velvet for sure. | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Agreed that it isn't ICH. I wish I could tell you more. Best wishes to you and your fish. I hope it's going to be alright. Sure is a beauty!
Keep us posted.
Here is a link you may find helpful: JBL - Online Hospital  just to let you know there are some graphic photos of sick fish at this link.
Ken | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| No real change from yesterday. Here are some more pics that may help. By looking at it closely, the white dots are MAYBE 1mm max (not diameter, but depth). There is also that little patch where the scales seem to be gone above the "dotted" area.
Any more thoughts? Should I leave the temp up if it might not be ich? | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| wow im not really sure what it is....he is one amazing fish ...the warmer temps might not hurt anything but you deffinately need extra aeration ..but im not sure it will help either....im stumped and I so hope other members might have more info!!!!!!! see if this link will help at all http://www.fishlore.com/Disease.htm I wish you a ton of luck! | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Wow... i have never seen anything like it.. it is DEFFINATELY not ICH. It seems like some sort of pimple... 
beautiful fish BTW, i jope things work out for you | |
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September 15th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| After reading the JBL site and the disease section here on fishlore, I figure it has got to be:
1. a fungal infection. One of the spots has a piece of...something...coming out from the center of it. Not to be gross, but it almost looks like an adolescent pimple that is out of control.
2. Parasitic infection. If not ich, then one of the others mentioned.
The characteristics I am observing are more consistent with a parasite than any thing else but I am going to continue my home work.
Thank you for all the help (KEEP IT COMING  ) I just hope I can figure it our before it is too late. | |
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September 16th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| hmmm great suggestion ken but it doesnt look like that either...at least not in the form ive seen it..but i guess anything is possible......im going to see if lucy or sds can look at this thread and maybe recommend something...I know they have knowledge about gram negative / positive type of meds..im clueless with meds... | |
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September 16th, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Hi vamedic11 Welcome to FishLore
You have a beautiful fish. Unfortunatly, I can't be much help here.
I'm not sure what it is.
Are there any other tank mates? Do they have symptoms? | |
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September 16th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| bumping to try to get more members opinions! Im so hoping we can figure this out! | |
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September 16th, 2009
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| | Moderator
| I'm not positive. Could be some kind of parasite (there's a parasite in the local lakes that does something kind of similar, but the bumps are black), could be some kind of tumor, or it could be a fungal or even bacterial or viral infection.
My thoughts (and others may have given some of this advice already... I haven't completely read the thread):
Keep the water as clean as possible. Lower nitrates means the fish can devote more energy toward staying healthy.
Give the highest quality of food you can. From what I've seen, that fish is typically herbivorous. Omega One makes high quality food, and you can supplement with fresh veggies.
Garlic juice or GarlicGuard provides nutrition, as does VitaChem.
If it is affecting the fish's ability to move/eat/breathe/whatever, you may want to consider trying PimaFix or MelaFix, as well. | |
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September 17th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| This little guy is going to drive me CRAZY :P
I wish I could post more pics, but I left my camera at work.
The spots have remarkably decreased in size but still fairly prominent. HOWEVER, his left eye is markedly swollen. It is distended roughly 2 - 3 mm greater than the right eye. I would think popeye, but there is notable swelling around the eye as well pretty much the same area the spots were in. The eye is still working in coordination with the other, the iris coloring and pupil size and coloring are identical, there is no cloudiness indicative of a bacterial infection (although I am not ready to rule out a bacterial infectinos just yet).
No fin rot. No holes similar to pix I have seen in HITH (but I'm not willing to rule that out yet, either). No scale loss, no coloration changes. No behavior changes (since the spots were noted). Not scratching angainst any rocks.
Water quality consistent. pH=7.2 | ammonia=0 | GH=120 | kh=120 | nitrite=0 | nitrate=10| temp has been increased to 84F for two days now.
Heavy sigh...I am going to keep researching and watching and hoping for the best! | |
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September 17th, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Keeping my fingers crossed that Joy has found the answer! It sure sounds like a good possibility and it's great to see that it isn't life threatening and will go away on it's own. Good research Joy!
What do you think VaMedic?
Ken | |
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September 20th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| The right side is back to normal, but the left side... It is gone from the several small areas/dots to this one massive area. I swear it looks like he got "sucker punched" on the left side of his face. You swelling is blatently obvious, and look at the left eye compared to the right 
The pink hue you see is the aquarium lighting, his color is actually quite good. Besides having not had any appetite, his behavior remains unchanged.
Water quality has remained very steady. pH=7.2 | gH=120 | kH=120 | ammonia=0 | nitrite=0 | nitrate=10
I have increased the tank temp to 82 degrees and am doing daily 25% water changes and twice weekly gravel washing.
His tankmate, a catfish, is not showing any of these signs/symptoms.
Maybe Joy does have it. I can live (and so can he) with a non-lifethreatening disease. Got some more reading to do.
Thanks again all! | |
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September 21st, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Hello Vamedic. Glad to hear that the right side is back to normal. Such a beautiful fish. Amazing the difference in size of his eyes. More good wishes coming your way! Hopefully the other side will return to normal "soon" too. I'll be watching for updates.
Ken | |
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September 21st, 2009
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| | Fish Helper
| i would say that it is most definately hole in the head. i dont have my fish medical book on me but you should be able to find a cure online | |
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September 21st, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by katetnies i would say that it is most definately hole in the head. i dont have my fish medical book on me but you should be able to find a cure online | It appears to me to be precisely the opposite of hole in the head disease (Head and Lateral Line Erosion, or HLLE, which is easier to write, so that's what I'm going to refer to it as for now).
HLLE starts with small holes around the head, not pimple-like cysts. The body seems to eat away at itself. This is actually a swelling of the area with a number of cysts or other growths.
Hopefully it's not HLLE, because there is no known cure for it (the cause isn't even known). There's plenty of ideas for prevention and treatment, many of them common-sense things that should be done for all of our fish, but no actual cures. | |
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September 25th, 2009
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdarksol It appears to me to be precisely the opposite of hole in the head disease (Head and Lateral Line Erosion, or HLLE, which is easier to write, so that's what I'm going to refer to it as for now).
HLLE starts with small holes around the head, not pimple-like cysts. The body seems to eat away at itself. This is actually a swelling of the area with a number of cysts or other growths.
Hopefully it's not HLLE, because there is no known cure for it (the cause isn't even known). There's plenty of ideas for prevention and treatment, many of them common-sense things that should be done for all of our fish, but no actual cures. | HLLE is another name for hole in the head. which the fish deffinately has. it has a popeye and more importantly, the lesions located on the fish head.
below is a cite with some good info. http://www.peteducation.com/article....+1791&aid=2586 | |
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September 25th, 2009
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by katetnies | I also do NOT think its HITH ..doesnt look anything like it....those 2 lesions on his head between his eyes are normal for the fish...oscars have the same thing...HITH doesnt start by the side of their eyes/cheeks and cause popeye but popeye could be caused with the same reasons as HITH ...which is feeding live sick feeders, bad water quality and all around bad diet..none of which the op has .... Oscar_Scotland_Cruise_105[1].jpg<-- HITH Disease DSC03739.JPG<--NORMAL type of lesion on large cichlids
I am glad hes doing a bit better....it look a ton better...prestine water like you are doing should help clear up his popeye unless it has something to do with the cyst ..goodluck! | |
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September 25th, 2009
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by katetnies HLLE is another name for hole in the head. | That's what I said. Quote: |
which the fish deffinately has. it has a popeye and more importantly, the lesions located on the fish head.
| Here's where I (and at least one other member) disagree. You say that this is "definitely" HLLE.
I'm seeing areas of inflamation, like pimples or boils. Hole in the Head, on the other hand, presents as... well... holes in the head, much more like what Shawnie posted. | |
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October 10th, 2009
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| | Fish Lore Newbie
| Well, after much deliberation, and the fact that it looked as if he was getting worse, I decided to treat for a bacterial infeaction.
After running the course of treatment, I have noticed no improvement and the disease seems to be prgressing.
I am going to put the charcoal back in there and clean out the water (and bacterial medication) and then after a couple weeks of clean water I think I will start treating for a fungal infection.
If you look at the picture, you can see the "fuzz" just below and behind the eye, the eye itself is looking more cloudy, and the are just behind the lip.
Wish me luck! | |
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![Oscar_Scotland_Cruise_105[1].jpg](http://www.fishlore.com/fishforum/attachments/freshwater-fish-disease/32629d1253907279-ich-not-oscar_scotland_cruise_105-1-.jpg){kind=link}
