DSwofford

Ok, hopefully someone on here can give some insight because everyone at my LFS is baffled.

I have a 125 gallon freshwater tank, filtered via two emperor 4oo's. My water is about 60 days old and was cycled without fish. I added start rite and a container of bacteria by Top Fin.

After my water cycled I started with 3 tiger barbs and 3 silver dollars. After 10 days passed my water parameters were still in the normal range and I added a pleco (no algae problems, I just like plecos) After 14 days passed my water parameters were still in the normal range and I added 3 more tiger barbs and 3 more silver dollars. (all fish came from the same store, except the pleco).

Two days after I added the last batch of dollars and barbs they all came down with ICH (except the pleco). I treated the tank with "rid-ich" per the label and did a 25% water change at the end of treatment. 3 tigers died during treatment. The day after the treatment the remaining 3 tigers died within 20 hours, followed by 2 silver dollars. 24 hours later all the silver dollars lost all of their fins and died. (Their fins were fine and literally disintegrated within 24 hours). All fish were dead except the pleco which was carrying on as business as usual.

LFS said I most likely had a virus in my water or some "unknown" parasite and the ich and "fin rot" ( I have fin rot in quotations since I have never seen fin rot take off fins in less than 24 hours) as they called it were secondary infections.

Pleco is still in tank and doing fine. I bumped my temp to 90 degrees and let it sit for 14 days, during which I performed 2 25% water changes (once at the start and once at the end). Tested my water myself and all was fine. Took a water sample to my LFS for second opinion and indeed, my water was well within acceptable parameters. My lone Pleco "Trooper" as I have come to call him (since he has been such a trooper in all of this) is looking pretty lonely in the tank by himself so I purchase 2 pictus cats on 2/27/09. Monday 3/2/09 the pictus show signs of ich. I set up a 10 gallon hospital tank using the same water from my 125 gallon tank. I bring it up to the exact temperature as my large tank and transport them to the hospital tank. I give them half the recommended dose of rid-ich. This was at 3:00 in the afternoon, by 11:00pm one of the cats was laying on the bottom and his gills were going a mile a minute (temperature was 75 degrees and had plenty of air in the tank) He was dead by 2:00am. By 8:00am Tuesday the second cat had dropped to the bottom and was also rapidly moving his gills. He died at noon today. Neither of them had white spots on their body anymore.

Trooper the pleco is still alive and shows no signs of infection.

LFS said must be the same virus or "unknown" parasite in your tank. I have a problem with this and really want to call BS on it but I would like some of your ideas and opinions on this.

Any insight??

Thanks in advance.

Amanda

What were your water parameters during treatment?
Ich cures are known to kill your cycle.

CHoffman

Hi and Welcome to Fishlore!! SO sorry your having problems...It sounds like to me what happened was everything was going fine but you didn't QT you last batch and they might of brought in the Ick..84 degrees is suffiecient for treating ick...90 degrees IMO is way to high...The higher the temp the less oxgen in the water. Do you have a air pump or anything to help with that...When you added the ICH meds, it probably crashed your cycle....and losing fins and dealth could be caused by ammonia poisioning caused by the crashed cycle..That would be my guess...For know..Turn your heater down to 84 degrees, leave it there for two weeks, do frequent gravel vacs to get all the ICH spores out and then when getting new fish Quarintine. I hope these problems end soon for you so you can enjoy your nice big tank.

DSwofford

From what I remember (sorry can't find my log, my 16 month old has done something with it)
pH was in the 7.2 range
ammonia was in the 0 PPM range
nitrite was in the .25 ppm range
nitrate was in the 0 ppm range

Toxic

Sounds like ammonia posioning, what are your water parameters. Tank may not have been cycled or it was crashed by the meds.

DSwofford

I know 90 degrees is high but I have seen so many variances on what temp Ich can't reproduce at. 84-88 degrees so I set it at 90 (don't worry pleco is not in tank).

Amanda

If nitrate was at 0 - the tank either didn't cycle or your cycle crashed.
That would explain the deaths & fin loss.

Toxic

should have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10 to 20 nitrates, nitrates are a sign that the tank is cycled. I would do 50% water changes daily with prime until the nitrates come up and the ammonia and nitrites test at 0


Edit: Amanda beat me to it

tomchitown

[quote=DSwofford;541148]From what I remember (sorry can't find my log, my 16 month old has done something with it)
PH was in the 7.2 range
ammonia was in the 0 ppm range
nitrite was in the .25 ppm range
nitrate was in the 0 ppm range[

your nitrIte should be 0
and unless you have live plants in there you should have some nitrAte reading
5-10ppm

she beat me too ...lol

AlyeskaGirl

I am so so sorry for your loss!

DSwofford

Let me find my log book and get actual readings. BTW I have live plants (3 bamboo plants) in the aquarium.

Amanda

Bamboo plants are actually bog plants. The roots can be in the water, but the leaves must be above the water for them to survive.

thecolumbianshark

I'm sorry for your loss! That's a lot of fish.

DSwofford

Nice. LFS said they could be totally submerged. I have had them in there for over a month and they look as healthy as the day I bought them. When can I expect them to die? I am getting used to all the death in my tank.

Amanda

They'll last a few months in the tank before they begin to break down.
Some people somehow attach them to the tops of their tanks so that the roots hang down but the leaves are above water. That way the roots will feed on the nitrates in the water, but it will thrive.

FishCreek

Sounds like the meds killed the cycle and then everything died as a result of ammonia poisoning. Do you check your own water parameters or rely on the LFS? Best to get your own Liquid test kit if possible (if you don't already). Also did you raise the temp up gradually? Best if done slowly so fish get used to it. 90 is way too high though. Sorry for your problems. If you don't want to do something else with the bamboo ( Its really a type of dracena), take it back to the LFS cause they told a lie.

agabr123

i'm sorry you lost your fish everyone else has you covered on the possible problems, good luck getting everything back in order!

Shawnie

welcome to fishlore!!

IMO the issue was what you used to seed the tank..the top fin and start right do not contain a self sustaining bacteria the only one existing for now is tetra safe start which is formerly bio spira...and then the meds probably finished it off ...as long as you continued to use the product, the cycle would be fine...although a pain in the bum, using prime or stress coat + with daily water changes will get you through the rest of the cycle...unless you purchase some safestart, thats about the only way to finish up the cycle..it will be done when you have 0 ammonia and nitrites and under 20 nitrates...goodluck!