Speedy

Hello Everybody
I'm going to say this is going to be a long thread and I'm sorry but I don't want to leave anything out. First I would like to say that what ever is wrong with my angelfish is driving me crazy and I have never had a problem not knowing what disease it is but this one has really thrown me for a loop. It all started about a month and 3 weeks ago. When I added to the tank two live plants one was a java fern the other was a amazon sword plant. The java fern I done a bleach and water dip 3 times then I let it soak in clean water over night in a bucket. The sword plant I didn't do that with because I called the 1-800 number on the plant that was in a sealed container that said parasite and snail free the guy at the 1-800 number said to raise it real good with warm water and it should be fine. Well, I was stupid and did what he said because I didn't know any better. I have never had live plants before these two but I have learned my lesson on that always do a dip just to be safe. I have 3 angelfish in a 44 gallon tank with a rena filstar xp2 and I have checked the water many many times since this has been going on and every thing reads as follows---ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 5, pH 7.2, Temp at 82,Copper .05 not .5. I was doing a 25% water change every 7 days but I up that to 40% every 7 days because I also have been having some problems with some very tiny white thread like worms in the tank and no one seems to know what for sure they are. I wasn't to concerned about them until my angelfish got sick I don't know if that is part of the disease or not.
I took one out and looked at it through a hand held microscope it was a 30X magnification with a lens dia. or 9mm and the worm looked like a earth worm but a lot smaller even moved like one. Anyway moving on to the fish they are all females for sure now I wasn't for sure before but now I have seen there breeding tubes. The first female has develop more symptoms since this whole thing started. But I'm just going to list them all that she has now--Rapid gill movement and sometimes only one side of the gills move and the other one does not,not eating hasn't in 3 weeks, twitching her side fins and all of her fins,resting on bottom, stringy white poop and is very thin and pale. It started out with just one now two of my angelfish are sick. I will also list what medications I have tried -- Maracyn-Two thinking it was gill disease but it didn't work. I tried General Cure thinking it was gill flukes didn't work then I tried Pro Quick Cure but not for Ick but because I thought it was chilodonella but I didn't finish with the treatment because I read that it was gill flukes or gill disease and I thought I was treating them with the wrong medicine. I'm thinking if it is gill disease that maybe the Maracyn-Two didn't work because it is a antibiotic instead of a medicine and maybe it wasn't strong enough. So here is where I'm at now. I have done a 50% water change and I have only added Prime and nothing else. I was thinking about Clout or fluke tabs but I'm not sure if that is the way to go. I'm so frustrating and I want to make the right choice on medicine this time but my time is running out so please if anybody has dealt with this and know for sure what it is and what medicine I should use let me know asap. I have also cut down on feeding and added more oxygen to the water but hasn't helped.
I just feel so bad for the little girls they have been suffering for a long time and I feel hopeless and I think I'm going to lose them if I don't find out what it is fast.

Lucy

Hi Speedy, I'm really sorry your angels are doing well. They're such pretty fish.
I don't know that much about angles.
The stringy white poo sounds, looking thin and resting on the bottom sounds like internal parasites. If I'm not mistaken this could also account for the rapid gill movement.

Have you tried a medicated food or Jungle parasite clear?

Good luck, I hope they recover quickly.

catbtony

I agree with Lucy, sounds like internal parasites-Jungle parasite clear is a good product-I had to make a mash for my fish due to the large size of the pellets-fed mine 3 times a day for 7-10 days and nothing else-and daily water changes for 3 days-it helped my fish-good luck

Speedy

Hey Lucy
I have some medicated fish food it is anti-parasite by jungle but I cannot get the two females that are sick to eat. I'm going to try again and see if I can get the one female that is not sick to eat it. I have decided to give the parasite clear fizz tablets by jungle a try. I was going to go with the clout but it says on the back that it may harm the biological filter bed. I also read that it could harm live plants but nothing was to clear to me. I read that it could kill live plants then I read it was safe. Same goes for the biological filter bed but what turned me against the clout is that it did say it could harm the biological on the box so that is for sure. Thanks for the help. I will let you know how they are doing. Talk to you soon. Take care.

Speedy

Hi Brenda
Thanks for the advice and the luck. Like I told Lucy I'm going to give the parasite clear a try. I will let everybody know what happens. Take care.

Lucy

That's the problem with the medicated food, you just can't force the fish to eat it.
You can try soaking the pellets in garlic juice or blood worm juice.....yummy!

catbtony

I soaked mine in Nourish FW vit. and water in an empyt fish food bottle and kept it in the frig. but garlic juice sounds like a good idea have not tried that, but I only used OTC oral meds once with my betta fry...."you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink" somebody said that? but Who and when your fish are sick they don't feel like eating...bummer..hope your fish get better...good luck

Speedy

Hey Lucy and Catbtony
Well, a lot has happen since I decided to add the parasite clear. Here is how it went. I put the parasite clear in around 6:00 pm I checked all my water readings they where all great. I had just completed my 40% water change and cleaned the canister filter and waited. I watched them until up to 2:00 am in the morning they didn't get worse but I didn't see any sign of stress or that it was even working except they had not been shaking there fins as much. But it all went down hill I guess in the middle of the night. I was still in bed when around 9:00 am my husband came in the room and said one of your angelfish is going to die. I jumped out of bed and sure enough she was swimming around and around and hanging up side down she was just awful. I didn't panic but I thought she was not going to make it because I have seen this before and I have never saved a fish when it got to this point. But I knew right then what it was. I'm thinking they had two infections some kind of parasite and a bacterial infection. I know you are suppose to treat a bacterial infection first or that is what I have always thought I could be wrong but anyway I was thinking it was to late. I pulled my 10 gallon tank out and filled it up and got it ready and put both the little angelfish in there with a medicine called T.C Tetracyclinc within 10 minutes I could not believe my eyes she was still breathing hard but she was swimming just fine. It was a miracle. I was so happy I was crying and laughing at the same time. That is some great medicine. Anyway I'm treated the big tank still with the parasite clear because she was still flicking around but she is not sick like the other two. She is eating and swimming around just fine right now. But if she starts acting like the other ones she will get the medicine as well. I'm going to keep a close eye on all of them. So that is my update for now. I guess that is why I was getting confused on what they had because it was two disease instead of one. Boy this fish stuff can get really frustrating. They are not still out of the wood yet one of them is still breathing hard. They sure are little fighters.

Lucy

Thanks for the update.
Sometime diagnosing fish can be tough. So many illnesses can look like another.
I'm glad you're making progress....here's to continued improvement!

soldieroffortune1974

Speedy Have a look at this: Medications-ingredients-disease treated

Tetracycline is an awesome antibiotic (same medicine given to people) that should clear up the 'nasties' making your angels sick.

If for some reason the Tetracycline doesn't do the trick, my suggestion would be Kenamyacin.

The white thread like worms,could be either Planaria (not harmful and good food) or immature horsehair worms (parasitic)

treating with the antibiotic 1st is a good idea,you always want to treat a bacterial infection 1st.It weakens the fish so other nasties can harm them more than normal.A double whammy definitely.

Sounds like they may be coming out of it.I would go ahead and treat the other angel as well.Even if it's not showing any symptoms,it can still hold the parasites and pass them onto other fish.So treating them all is your best option.

Good luck

catbtony

Glad to hear your fish are improving and darn those secondary infections

Speedy

I have some bad news. Everything was fine when I went to bed last night but I got up to go to the rest room and to check on my fish and oh my god everything went down hill again. I looked in my 44 gallon tank which had the adult angelfish that had the parasite clear in it and she was resting on the bottom not moving at all I thought she was dead. Then I looked at my two younger angelfish that I have in the 10 gallon with a divider in there because one was sicker then the other and I didn't want them picking on each other. That poor little girl was swimming around and around again she looked so sick.I thought water changes quick I'm changing both of the tanks at the same time at 6:00 am in the morning. I changed 50% in the 10 gallon and put the T.C. Tetracycline in again within about 20 mins she was o.k. again. Then I also changed 50% in the 44 gallon and I also was running carbon as well to get all the medicine out as soon as I put the active carbon in my little powerful thing you hang on the side she starts to move so now the big angelfish is o.k. she is doing great. So I thought o.k everybody is going to be fine well I watched them to about 8:30 and everything was o.k so I went back to bed but around 4:00pm that same day the little girl in the 10 gallon starts with the bad swimming again for the 3rd time so I just repeated the process over again but this time it didn't work she is still swimming like that and there is nothing I know to do at this point except maybe put her down.
The other one doesn't look much better she is not swimming like that or breathing hard but she has red sores on the inside of her nose and has some red patches with some red streaks around the outside of her body. I thought for sure it was parasites and a bacterial infection and that this medicine would do the trick but one is good as dead and the other one isn't any better. She has also started just bumping into everything. I'm so sad and lost I feel so bad that I can't help them does anybody know anything I'm missing here.

Lucy

I'm really sorry, Speedy, I wish I could help.

soldieroffortune1974

It almost sounds like Hemorragic Septicimia with the red streaking and red patches in the nose and mouth,eratic swimming,rapid gill movement. It's a bloodborne bacterial infection.

I would recheck your water parameters for ammonia and nitrites,nitrite poisoning can lead to Septicimia. I would continue with the tetracychline treatment,and continue doing water changes every day.

I hate to say it,but at his point all you can do is continue treatment and wait and see. I hope they get better soon.

Speedy

Well here is an update on my little two teenager angelfish. I lost one of them on Christmas eve around 4:00pm. I done everything I could to save her she was sure a little fighter. But I have some good news so far the other one keeps improving I'm still treating her with the TC and I have one treatment left which that means I done a total of 8 all together. I will keep everybody posted. Got to go.

Lucy

I'm so sorry, speedy. You tried so hard to save her.

I'm glad to hear your other angel is showing improvement.
Hang in there.

soldieroffortune1974

Sorry to see you lost 1..........hopefully the other angel gets better.

Speedy

Thanks Lucy. I will miss her but at least she is not suffering anymore. I will never forget her I guess what makes it worse is because she is one of them I raised.

Update on the other one. She has gotten better but I don't know if she will make it or not. She has started a new symptom I have never seen before. She has like these spasms and jerking thing going on. I have been doing 25% to 50% water changes everyday I don't know what could be causing that. Today was the last day for the T.C. and I'm running carbon to get all of it out then I will see how she does after that. She still has the rapid breathing and not eating and is very pale. I sure hope she makes it.

Speedy

Thanks. She has gotten better but like I told Lucy it could go either way. I just wish fish could talk.

Speedy

Hey everybody
Just giving an up date on my angelfish. She is doing better I'm now treating her with Triple Sulfa. But I haven't been able to get her to eat it has been over 2 weeks and I have tried everything. Flake food, blood worms, dried shrimp, and I have even tried garlic juice from a real garlic on her food nothing. I don't think it will make a difference but I'm going to get some garlic guard tomorrow and add some to the tank and to her food. But I'm also going to try hatching some BBS but I think they will be to small but it is worth a try. I also thought about live food but I don't like to use them because of disease. Does anybody else have any food ideas that might get her to eat I have tried everything I can think of.

Speedy

Update on my little angelfish. She died about 30 mins ago.