platyaja

I've had aquarium for over a year now. Only twice my fish had Ich problem, first time when I first started and fish that had Ich died eventhough I used medication and followed the instructions. Now it's happened again. I did same treatment and next day fish was dead. I seperated the other fish with Ich in another tank. 2 days later it died. During the treatment I do 25% water change every 2 days. The water has almost 0 Nitritt. I normally change water every 7-10 days and do Nitritt test once a week. The tank is 54 Litre or about 40 Gal.
I have now 8 Mollies and 2 Platys. Last week I had 10 mollies, 3 guppis and 3 Platys.
It seems to me that once fish infected with Ich, it's already too late to cure with medication.
You can not save it.Medication only kills free-swimmimg Ich that already fall off fish, right?
Did I/do I have too many fish?
Thank for any answer

Nags1965

Have you read any of the threads on ICK? I also think one of my fish may have ick. I did some reading last night.. I bought some ICK treatment today and have put it in my tank.

Be sure you check around on some of the threads about ick.. some good info there..

sirdarksol

Welcome to Fishlore.
I'm not a wiz at measurement conversions, but 54 liters seems like it would be far less than 40g. If I'm right, the tank was heavily overstocked.
A heavily overstocked tank, in turn, stresses fish, making them more susceptible to infection/parasites.
Fish can, indeed, survive ich infestation. Some fish can be pretty heavily infested and still survive, but their environment needs to be very healthy (zero ammonia, zero nitrites, nearly zero nitrates, enough swimming room, a lack of heavy metals, etc...)

Yes, meds, as far as I know, generally work on the free-floating parasites, either the adults or the un-hatched cysts.
The same result can be had by raising the temp to 82-84 degrees. The parasites can't reproduce at this temp.

My info in this area is second-hand, and I'm sure I'm missing something. Someone else will probably be along pretty soon to give you more complete info regarding ich.

susitna-flower

HI, WELCOME TO FISHLORE!

Up at the top of this page under "ARTICLES", there is a link to an aquarium calculator....just plug in your aquarium size, either in L, gal, or inches and you will know just exactly what size your tank is.

A 54L tank is either 14.27 us gallons, or 17.+ UK gallons.....usually I figure the stocking rate for us gallons as they are fewer, and will be on the safer side....SO according to the 1"/ gallon rule for stocking, you have twice the number of fish you can safely keep in your tank....This is figured on the ADULT fish size, even if your fish are not full grown yet.

If it were me, I'd get the API Master test kit for freshwater (liquid), and start charting your readings for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate....

Your tank has been established long enough it should be thoroughly cycled, but just to make sure, is your ammonia and nitrite 0?

If your nitrate is over 20 you have to do as many water changes as it takes to keep it down between 5 & 20....this might mean 50% every other day, or even more! Do you vacuum the gravel? This is also a must in tank maintenance.

As for the ick, if you raise the temp up to over 82F and hold it there for at least 2 weeks it will kill the parasite in your tank.

Good Luck, and let us know how it all goes....

platyaja

Thanks Susitna-flower, You're right, my mistake, only 15 Gal. I live in Germany, been used to with Litre system. it's unintended overstocked. Mollies multiply like crazy, that's why. I have temp in the tank up to 82 degree for 2 days now. It seems Mollies doing ok.
Platy slowdown a bit. I'll let you know if Platys will survive.
Thank for all advice

susitna-flower

Be sure you are doing those water changes also...the warmer temperatures deplete oxygen in the water. So lots of water changes will help the water conditions, and de-stress the fish, and add the oxygen they need in the warmer conditions.

Germany, I have some friends over there! ONE of these years I'll do some traveling....... We really do understand about the livebearers....I have them too. I must admit every now and again some go into my 125 gallon tank, survival of the fittest and all.....they usually end up as lunch for my bigger fish, though a few have survived.....

COBettaCouple

Welcome to Fishlore.

The process to cure ich is to raise the tank temp to 82-84F and keep it there for 2 weeks at least. Change 25% of the water every day or 2 and clean the substrate at least once a week. Increase the aeration in the tank to compensate for the lower oxygen. No meds are needed really and many do more harm than good.

Steve113

Hey guys, nice to 'meet' you all.

just thought I'd tag my White Spot question to the end of this thread to save creating a new one.

I noticed the first signs of white spot disease in my tank about 3 - 4 weeks ago, unfortunately, I was working late/night shifts at the time and was unable to do anything about it until about 4/5 days after I noticed the initial problem. By this time, I could see evidence of the parasite on most of my fish.
My aquarium had not long been set up and so understandably, this was quite upsetting.

Anyway - long story short, raised the tems and threw some Anti white spot meds + aquarium salts into the tank (plus very frequent water change) which really quickly seemed to clear it up.

All the fish in the tank seem to be clear now - all that is except for my 3 clown loaches who have become very lethargic and quite frankly look quite pale and speckly.

I took the decision to move these 3 to a separate tank in a hope to isolate them (and prevent them re infecting the others).

They have been separate for 3 days now and I've medicated them (as well as keeping meds + high temp in the large tank and they seem to be calming down a little - certainly seem more ebnergetic.


- I just wondered:

1 - How long before I can safely re introduce the loaches to the large aquarium?
.
2 - How long should I keep the large aquarium medicated + hot after signs of the parasite have dissapeared.
.
3 - my tank is a 200l tank and so water changes are hard (as only a small ammoundt can be changed at one time as the water must stand overnight to dechloinate apparently)
.
4 - I've read in a couple of places that once a fish has been cured - they are more resilient (almost immune) to further White spot infection; this seems unlikely, but is there any truth to it?
.
5 - And finally, what are my best steps to ensure the whitespot doesn't flare up straight away when I lower my temp and remove my meds?

(oh, and incase you needed to know)

200l freshwater Tropical Aquarium.
at the moment i have:
1 betta
2 Silver Sharks
2 Sword Tails (1m,1f)
3 glass catfish
7 neons (had 14 but they all seemed to dissappear!)
6 Harlequin Rasboras
1 Plec (he's tiny! :P)


~ Steve

(oh and 3 clown loaches - separate tank atm)

ThisGuy

for question number 3 you know you can buy water conditioner it is relatively cheap and it works instantly that would help with your dechlorination issue. As for the rest of the questions i will let someone with more experience with white spots ow and...

WELCOME TO FISHLORE

ThisGuy

And you might want to repost because a lot of ppl scan the new posts...

Cheers

susitna-flower

HI, STEVE, WELCOME TO FISHLORE!

I suggest when you find your way around this forum that you try to post new threads under headings that fit your situation.....you will get more response from fresh posts, than adding on to someone else's post.......AND you didn't introduce yourself! GIVE US A CHANCE TO SAY HI!!!!!


Your clown loaches may be one of the most sensitive fish, with no scales they are easily harmed with medications, hopefully what you chose to use didn't "burn" them. That is one of the reasons we recommend using the heat treatment, any time you can avoid using chemicals, and there is something that will take care of it 100%, that is what we are going to suggest.....

So for ick, OVER 82F for two full weeks, with daily or every other day water changes of at least 25%. It also helps to add more aeration, that and the water changes help to replace oxygen your fish need at the higher temperatures.

The two week treatment kills the ick. It shouldn't be back, unless you add more fish with a new infection.

As for the loaches, they are a good indication of ANY water quality problems. That behavior you described could have been from the ick, or other things not yet addressed.

Using a water conditioner like Prime will allow you to do as many water changes as necessary to maintain good water quality.

You state in your aquarium info that you know about the nitrogen cycle. Was your tank cycled before you added fish?

What are the results of the water test now. You need to be doing as many water changes as it takes to keep the fish healthy, and this may be quite a few if your tank isn't cycled yet.

The bad news is that your 200l tank is approx. 53 gallons which means you can stock it with about 53 " of fish (even if they are young you have to count their expected adult size), this means your tank is over stocked, and will always be unhealthy for your loaches.

Here on fishlore, there is a freshwater fish profile section, up under the heading "ARTICLES", where you can research how large your fish will get. The 'silver sharks' for example.....if they are bala sharks get to 12"+ each.....they also shouldn't be kept in a tank less than about 72" long as they need lots of swimming room....the clown loaches also get over a foot each...

The reason I bring all this up, is that unless you relieve the overcrowding you will be in for a lot of problems, and sickness.

WOW, that was long winded! Sorry, I hope your fish recover. It sounds like you really love your tank, and want to do things right. Good Luck.......

Steve113

Bad news,

got home from work this morning (night shift again)
and all 3 loaches are belly up.

I'm kinda lost as to why as they have been showing signs of improvement for the past 3 weeks and have had no adverse effects from the anti white spot solution.

In reply to your post though flower;

Yes, my tank was cycled. And I am aware that the tank will be overstocked when the fish reach full maturity -but I am prepared for this in thatI have arrangements for my fish when they become too large for the tank. My tank is rather large in my relatively small lounge and I must admit, that with it's current stock -It barely looks as though there's anything in it - which is quite depressing.

I've had pretty goodwater test readings of late also, all being acceptable.
although I did check ammonia levels today when I got home and they are showing a reading of approx 0.25 in both tanks. however, I have over fed for the past few days which may account for the increased AMM reading...

Prime? I don't know if that's something I can get here in the UK - I haven't seen it on the shelves in the fish shops, but I may be wrong - As for water treatment - I have been leaving 6 buckets of water for a couple of days with about a teaspoon of stress coat in each in order to prepare water for the tank. - but even 6 buckets is hardly near 1/4 (0.25%) water change.

- on a side note, As for creating new threads, Basic forum etiquette would suggest that I scour the forum for a similar topic - otherwise folk will just endlessly repeat themselves in several seemingly identical threads - hence my adition to this one.

Your help is much appreciated, and I mean that sincerely -although I cant help but get the sense that many questions here are replied to what appear to be canned responces - Maybe that is because theproblems all have similar solutions, I dont know...

As for my introduction,
How rude of me :P

Name's Steve, 22, I come from Aberdeen, Scotland.
I'm relatively new to fish keeping - and hope to, as soon as possible have an aquarium I can be proud of although I always seem to be at work with no time to tend to my new friends! Hopefully with help from various sources, including the folk here at fishlore I'm well on my way to that goal of mine