mairre

I just got a tank for my seven year old, and am starting to think it's more for me. Seriously, we just went to Petco two days ago and got our tank set up that same night. It's a ten gallon tank and it was a kit with everything included - filter, thermometer, heater, fluorescent light. I purchased some plastic plants, thinking it would be easier for our beginner status to start simply. Worry about keeping the fish alive before we have to worry about the plants as well. The Petco person told us to wait two days before introducing fish. From what I've been reading, the suggested wait period is up to two weeks. Anyway, we found a local fish dealer, whom I prefer to support over Petco. I brought in a water sample last night (24 hours after tank had been set up) and he said I was fine putting a few fish in - African Dwarf Frogs (2), Algae Suckers (2), Marbled Anglefish (1), and Rummy Nosed Tetra (1). Again, from what I've read, this seems pretty early to be adding fish but I'm trusting the local fish shop guy. He suggested I get a few more Tetras and a Gourami (dwarf?). I've been obsessively reading about anything fish related for the last two days and now think I want to grow live plants - I'm an avid gardener so this makes sense. And now I come to my question...

Can I simply add some live plants - phase out the plastic to see how the live ones do?

We are using small gravel as a substrate. Will this support live plants?

Do I need to wait a while until the fish get established?

What are some good beginner plants; plants that will work with above mentioned fish?

Does it sound like I'm putting too many fish in my 10 gallon tank?

With live plants, is it a good idea to change water every week?

Should I wait to plant when I'm doing my first water change since the water level will be lowered then?

I'm sure I have a hundred other questions in there, but I'll leave it at that for now.
Thanks!

bruiser

Welcome To fishlore!

Rule number one (to me anyways..) is don't trust the local fish guy..lol He is way off with that stocking list.. For algae eaters, you don't want a common pleco. they get HUGE.. Something small like a bristlenose pleco would be good. and only 1.. no need for 2.. Angelfish will get up to 6'' so thats not a great idea in a 10g..

Your tetra's will be fine, but they should be kept in groups of atleast 5-6 min. as they like to shoal. And the ADF's will be fine, but make sure they're getting food.. there slow swimmers and can't compete with the fish. And the dwarf gourami should be fine aswell..

But that would be about all I would put in it..

What kind of filter came with it? those kits often come with cheap inadequate filters.. I would upgrade to an AquaClear20. perfect for a 10g.

You can put your plants in right away.. if anything it will help out with the cycle. And you should do weekly water changes planted or not.

Hopefully thats helpful and keep us updated!

Goodluck!

stefjane

1 - Yes, the plants should actually speed up your nitrogen cycle
2 - The gravel should be fine
3 - I don't think so
4 - It depends on your light, though it is probably not very bright. You can try java fern, anubias, java moss...other members should give you more ideas on plants as well
5 - YES, the angel will get TOO big for the tank, and we need to find out what your 'algae suckers' are. Are they plecos? Or otos? or other? The rummy nosed tetras will need some friends as well.
6 - It is general consensus on FishLore that the minimum water change is 20-25 % weekly
7 - It doesn't matter, if you think you can overflow the tank by having your arm in there, then you should lower the water before planting

bassbonediva

As far as what plants you can put in the tank...I'm guessing your fixture is the standard 15W fixture that comes with most 10gal (20") flourescent hoods. That gives you 1.5WPG (Watts Per Gallon), which is pretty respectable and will grow quite a few varieties of plants. Some of my favorites are cabomba caroliniana, anacharis, anubias, java fern, any of the mosses (java, Christmas, willow, Taiwan), and swords. Just about any plants will work with any fish, so it mainly ends up being what you think looks good. To give you an idea of what you can do with the above-mentioned plants, this is my Marineland Hex5 tank that I recently planted heavily for one of my male bettas:

In this tank I have cabomba caroliniana, anacharis, asian ambulia, Argentine swords (nice little find among the tubed plants at Petco...very unusual to find actual aquatic plants there), hygrophila corymbosa 'stricta,' dwarf sagittaria and a tiny bit of java moss wrapped around the columns. (I have 3WPG on this tank).

aquarist48

Hello Mairre and Welcome to Fish Lore!
Ken

jglove276

Welcome Mairre. I don't know much about the plants but what I do know is watch out for the LFS they usually only care about the sell.

jdhef

Welcome to FishLore Mairre.

I'm sorry to say that like most people, you got some bad advice from the LFS.

The Pet Stores all tell people to set up their tanks and let it run for a couple of days, then bring in a water sample. Of course that water sample is always fine, since no fish (or more importantly no ammonia source) has been added. They then sell you a bunch of incompatable fish.

The algae eater (depending on the species) is probably going to get way too big for a ten gallon tank, as will the Angelfish.

Additionally, you are now cycling with fish in your tank, which is very hard on the fish. What you should do is get an API Master test kit (if you don't already have one), and a water conditioner called "Prime". You will then need to do daily 50% water changes using the Prime until your tank fully cycles, which can take up to six weeks. You will know you are fully cycled when you have zero ammonia, zero nitrites and some nitrates.

The reason I recommend that you use Prime is because it will detox the ammonia and nitrites for 24 hours at which point you will be doing another water change.

If you haven't already, I highly recommend that you read up on the nitrogen cycle (if it works right you should be able to click on the underlined words and be taken to a page about it). Many people are given incorrect info about it at the LFS.

Good luck!

Prince Powder

Hello Mairre and welcome to Fishlore!

You received some great advice from our members already! While local fish stores are generally better places to buy fish from since they tend to have better quality stock, they are more often than not just as bad as chain stores when it comes to giving advice. Unfortunately neither chain stores nor local fish stores will inform new fish keepers of the importance of the nitrogen cycle and even if they do, they generally tell you that you HAVE to have fish in your tank to cycle it, which is untrue. They will also not stop you from buying fish that are going to get too big for your tank or from mixing fish that should not be mixed.

Sadly, the angelfish they sold you will get far to large for a 10 gallon tank. If possible, I would recommend returning the angels, otherwise you will need to get a much larger tank for them quickly. It is also important that you find out what kind of algae suckers you have because the majority of them also get way too big for your tank size. The LFS guy was right that you should get more of the rummynose tetras since they are schooling fish that should be kept in groups of 6 or more, however you shouldn't add any more fish until your tank has completed the Nitrogen Cycle and you have returned the angelfish (and possibly the algae suckers if they are the bigger ones). The Dwarf Gourami is a good fish to have in a 10 gallon tank and would make a nice replacement for the angels, however you should only get one gourami since they can get aggressive with each other if there are more than one in a small tank.

The two most important things when starting a new fish tank is learning about the Nitrogen Cycle and getting a good quality liquid test kit, like the API Master Test Kit, to keep track of your water parameters during the cycle. If you are cycling with fish, then the Prime which jdhef mentioned is also very important to have in order to keep your fish as safe as possible during the cycle. Keep in mind though, no matter how careful you are when cycling with fish, some fish are just too sensitive to survive the stress of the nitrogen cycle.

Best of luck with your tank and please keep us posted on how things are going! Everyone here will be more than happy to walk you through the tough times of cycling and answer any questions you may have.

mairre

Thanks for all the great advice. I wish I started here and not at the fish store. So I'm headed out today to get the API test kit. Any recommendation on what to use when changing water? It seems like the Python is a popular choice.

jdhef

Believe me your not alone wishing you started here first. I also was severly mislead, but luckily stumble across this site.

For a 10 gallon tank, a Python is really overkill in my opinion. I would recommend a gravel vac and a 5 gallon bucket.

Prince Powder

X2! I started off with a line of betta bowls with no filters and no heaters.
Thankfully I found this forum and now my boys are all in bigger, cycled tanks with nice warm water and are doing fabulous!

A Python is a great way to go for people with larger tanks, but for smaller tanks they are not really necessary. A gravel vac or siphon like this siphon and a bucket is really as high tech as you need to get. Just make sure the bucket is a brand new one that has never held any chemicals and never been washed with soap!

bassbonediva

In addition to that, Chinese Algae Eaters get large and aggressive (about 5") and will attack the other fish in your tank. I've seen/heard cases of CAEs latching on to other fish and basically eating off their slime coat. *shudder* The only algae eaters I'd recommend for a 10gal tank would be otocinclus catfish, but only after the tank has been completely cycled and established for a while, as they can be very sensitive.

As for the angel, I would return it ASAP. They are also very sensitive to water parameters and if you try to do a fish-in cycle with one, you're more than likely to lose it (I had one temporarily in my fully-cycled 20gal high tank and he died within a week...he was about the size of a half-dollar).

mosin360

One thing I didn't see as I skimmed was that an algae eater should only be bought when you have some algae for them to eat on. A brand new tank won't need any algae eater for a couple months or even longer.

tetralover77

the angel fish will get way to big , the rummy nosed tetra is a schooling fish, and depending on the species the sucker mouth catfish could get two feet or two inches and any where in between the adfs should be kept in a shallower setup i recommend you take every thing back and get 8 neon tetra they are beautiful and relatively hardy fish also they are very cheap. welcome to the hobby it is wonderful fun. by the way real plants are a good idea because they along with filter bacteria help purify the aquarium water.

mairre

What about exchanging the Angelfish for a Betta? Could a Betta be happy in a 10 gallon tank with a shoal of tetras swimming about? Or would a Dwarf Gourami be a better choice?

I still can't get over the bad advice I got from the fish store. It makes me wonder if I can trust anything he says...

1hawaii50

One LFS sold me a chinese algae eater..."He'll be great in a 10 gallon community"...SURE! All was well until it grew to about 4.5 inches, and got VERY territorial and aggressive. I had a peppered cory in there and the chinese algae eater ended up killing it. I took the chinese algae eater and donated him to another LFS.

Then a different LFS tells me "Sure, an angelfish will be PERFECT in a 10 gallon community". I get it home and in the tank...my daughter (it's her tank) gets seriously attached to it, and then I find out here that an angelfish will get far too big for a 10 gallon tank.

I set up my 38 gallon, and was asking yet a 3rd LFS about cylcing. They were pushing Nitromax and Cycle like there was no tomorrow. I tried asking about fishless cycling using Ammonia, and they looked at me like I had 3 heads. "You never want to put Ammonia in your fish tank" they told me....ummmm...this was going to be a fishless cycle? She tells me for the 5th time, get the Cycle, "I use it every week". Maybe she NEEDS to use it every week because it's the wrong kind of bacteria?

All that being said, the misinformation is out there in spades. Luckily we have a great resource at our disposal so we can do our own research. The one thing I've learned since starting fishkeeping is this:
NEVER TAKE THE ADVICE OF THE LFS EMPLOYEE AS GOSPEL!
Go home, log onto Fishlore, and find out for yourself! Good luck with your tank!

Prince Powder

A gourami would definitely be a better choice. Bettas do not make good community fish at all. Many people have tried it and there have been very few successes. In a community setting bettas either get very aggressive and attack your other fish or get extremely stressed by the activity around them which can lead to illness. Some people have success for a short time only to wind up having to separate the betta after a few months due to stress or aggression. They are better off when housed in tanks of their own.

Dwarf Gouramis are very colorful fish who would do much better in a community tank. However there has been health issues with Dwarf Gouramis lately. You might want to read up on The Iridovirus or Dwarf Gourami Disease before getting one though. Other gouramis like a Honey Gourami might be a better choice.

tetralover77

betta would be a good choice or dwarf gourami are good choices rummy nosed tetras get 2'' i think you should return the rummys for neons or other small tetra 1.5" or less neons look stunning with bettas

bassbonediva

I agree with Prince Powder. Male bettas do not make good community fish. I had one in a 29gal with some guppies and platies and he was miserable. Now that's in a divided 10gal with three other bettas, he's much more relaxed and happier.

tetralover77

some male bettas can be very aggressive towards guppies not sure about platties