stargirl6878

Hi,

I have been lurking in this forum for the last week or so (trying to read as much as I can to get some of my questions answered) and finally here I am with my first post

Ok, first off...

I bought my 1.5 gallon tank at petco and set it all up last night...only to find out the dumb air pump that comes with it and runs the filter, barely outputs any air and will not make the filter run...needless to say, I emailed Tetra about this and have yet to receive a reply...will update when I get one...

So, I want to do this tank the right way and do a fishless cycle...I have a betta that I rescued (well I thought I rescued him) from petsmart. I added him to my 5 gallon tank and in about 2 - 3 days he was not looking very happy...he started to show signs of either fin rot or Edward the ACF was trying to eat him...I don't know...the betta is bigger than my ACF...

I took him out and put him in a 1 gallon bowl that I do 100% WC on every other day...he is in there with 2 small guppies that also started showing the same symptoms only way more drastic...as in their tails are almost completely gone

Ok, so I started treating the 1 gallon with Melafix...a little less than 1/4 tsp daily...today is day 4 of treatment and the guppies look a little better I think...but the betta does not appear to be getting better...not really worse, but not better either...

So, I got the 1.5 gallon just for the him and as I said I want to cycle it first...and now I have the problem of the pump/filter setup not working at all...so my first question is:

1. Can I cycle the tank without a filter...? I read about jump starting the cycle with gravel, which I don't have...I do have red glass beads in the 5 gallon tank though...can I use some of those? If so, how much? And how long would it take to cycle the tank without a filter?

2. If I do not use the filter after I add the betta, how often should I change the water and how big of a water change?

3. I read about how Melafix is bad for bettas, so should I stop using it? What should I use?

On a different topic...when I started the 5 gallon tank it was really cloudy (I did not cycle it and added fish way too soon, so now I am having problems), so I went to petco and the employee there told me to buy Nutrafin Cycle...and that he uses it in his 90 gallon tank and has never had a problem...I asked him about Prime and he said it was ! even though almost everyone here suggests it...maybe he meant that Prime wouldn't help the cloudiness...I don't know...it just sounded like he had never even noticed the bottle on the shelf...lol...I stopped using the Nutrafin Cycle (I only used it like 2 days until I read that using it is bad because it doesn't actually help to create a true cycle)...I got a water test kit and tested the water about 2 weeks after using the Nutrafin...so finally my question:

1. If I only used the Nutrafin for 2 days, 2 WEEKS ago would it give me false readings on my ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels? or would it be safe to assume that with the water changes I have been doing that most of the Nutrafin is out and would not affect the test...my levels were 7.0 pH, 0 ammonia, 2.0 nitrite and 5.0 nitrate on 1/18/10...6.8 - 7.0 pH, 0 ammonia, 2.0 nitrite, 5.0 - 10 nitrate on 1/20/10...

2. How often should I test the 5 gallon tank? Every other day?

Ok...that is all for now...

Sorry for the looong post...and thanks for any help you can provide in advance

Tigerfishy

Welcome first of all! OK, I'll try the best I can, but I can't promise to know it all!
1. In short, no, you cannot cycle without a filter. When you cycle a tank you are essentially cycling the filter. I.e allowing the bacteria to gather in the media to remove ammonia and convert it. Adding gravel/decorations from an established tank can speed up the cycle as it has the good bacteria needed already on it from the established tank. So basically, you would never cycle without the filter.

2. I would say to you that bettas need a heated filtered tank, so please do not keep him without a filter, most members here would agree too. Also the minimum tank size recommended for bettas is 5g, but 2.5 will be sufficient if you cannot manage 5g. (both of mines have a 3.6g each)

3. Melafix should not be used, many people have had bad experience with it and bettas, it is to do with their labyrinth organ I believe, it can affect this and harm the fish, even kill it. I have heard people use bettafix, but most bettas can heal surprisingly well if their water is kept pristine. They do not react well to medication and I personally have never used meds on my boys, and one was on deaths dorr for a while. It is surprising how well they can bounce back!

4. I would imagine most of the Nutrafin is out now, but we would all highly recommend Prime. If your tank is not cycled, daily water changes using Prime as the conditioner will work wonders for the fish, and is the best you can do until the cycle. Prime not only conditions the water, making it fish safe, but it detoxifies ammonia and nitrites for 24 hours until you change the water again. Also it is very economical, for your tank (full tank) you would only need about 2 drops to condition the tank. (It does stink though lol!).

5. As for testing the 5g tank, if you are doing daily water changes with Prime, do this for a week or so, then I would test just before the water change each day (because Prime detoxifies for 24 hrs, there is no point in testing for 24 hrs as there will be none to test for...) Then when you reach ammonia=0, nitrites=0 and nitrates=about 10ish then you're done, it can take weeks, it can be a month or so, be very patient and it will be so easy once you have got your cycle!
Now if I've missed anything, someone will add it, or correct me if I'm wrong. Any more questions, get them up and we wil help you out!

aquarist48

Good morning and Welcome to Fish Lore StarGirl.

Great information from TigerFishy. I'm going to post a few links for you that you may find helpful.
To back up TigerFishy's response to Melafix:
ALL BETTA/Gourami OWNERS READ!!!!! MELAFIX ALERT!!!!!! READ!!!! READ!!!! DANGER!!!!

Bettas:
Important Betta Topics - Read First!
Betta Fish Care Guide
I agree that the Betta should have a home of its own, heated and filtered.

Something that you can use is Tetra Safe Start (TSS). This may help you to cycle your tank in 10 days. Many members here have had great success with it. However, some have not. It's the only product that I'm aware of that may cycle your tank quickly. Other products like Cycle, do not contain the necessary bacteria to sustain the tanks cycle without adding it for the life of the tank. Once you stop using it then chances are you'll get a build up of ammonia that can be fatal to your fish.
Q & A With Tetra about Tetra SafeStart

Best of luck. I'm sure you'll get more responses. We love photos!
Ken

Tigerfishy

Thanks for posting those links (melafix and TSS) Ken, I'm saving them to my favourites, they're so useful to have! I could NOT find that melafix one. Prob cause I have to be sneaky as I do this while at work !