Eve_ill

Hello everyone,
First off, big thanks to anyone who replies...
My situation has to do with cycling. I acquired a 55g tank from a neighbor who was moving, along with an established 10g. The 10g was his quarantine tank used to transfer the fish to our place, so we had to start from scratch with the 55g. The fish are: 4 SAE, 4 lemon tetras, 6 x-ray tetras, and 2 black neons. My husband and I set up the 55g on Oct. 2nd, used dechlor, and let everything run overnight. In the interim, I proceeded to read up on the nitrogen cycle. The next day I moved a huge piece of wood (previously in the 55g when the neighbor had it) from the 10g to the 55g as a way to seed it. I couldn't use any media since the 10g is a marineland eclipse and the 55g runs on aqua clear 200, and he took all of the gravel; not sure why.
Fast forward 24 hours (and a visit to LFS only to get confusing advice) later and this is where the first mistake was made. The guy at LFS said that I could essentially go ahead with adding the fish, given the introduction of the wood, then he recommended Hagens Cycle. This even after expressed that I was worried about cycling with fish! I picked up Tetra Safestart, but he said Hagens was the same. Yeah right. So, like a dummy I walked out with hagens as well as Tetra Aqua Safe (wasn't sure if the dechlor I used initially was enough), still not entirely sure what I was doing.
Went home, added both products, let them run for an hour, had a stable temp of 79 degrees so I (hesitantly) introduced the fish, all except the black neons. As of today, all of them seem ok, but I know that the ammonia spike is coming.
Biggest question is: How bad did I ruin things by using Cycle? Is my tank forever doomed? How can I fix this if it is a problem? Also, can I add Safestart at this point, or is it not necessary? Was the wood even sufficient to seed with? If it is, does this mean I might have a smoother cycle?
By the way: hubby is out right now getting a master test kit, so I don't have an accurate reading to post yet. I did use Jungle test strips the neighbor had, but I know how notorious those are for giving inaccurate readings. Here they are anyway if it helps:

Oct. 3rd- (before fish, Aquasafe,& Cycle)
nitrate: 0
nitrite: 0
hardness: 75
chlorine: 0
kh:120
pH:7.8

I hope someone can help me - I feel like such an idiot for not listening to my gut and just doing a fishless cycle like I planned and wanted to, and an even bigger idiot for using Cycle after I read up on it. By then it was too late, I already added it to the tank. I'm sorry if I left out any other info that will help.
I will post test results shortly...Thank you all so much for listening!
Melissa

Lucy

Hi Melissa welcome to Fish Lore
It looks like your research has answered most of your questions for you.
Not sure how much Cycle would have effected the benefical bacteria on the driftwood.

My suggestion would be to stop using cycle (though, I think you've already decided that for your self) and test daily.
When you start to have ammonia readings start to do daily wtaer changes, usually about 50%. Use Prime as your water conditioner. That'll detox the ammonia for 24 hours between water changes. It won't effect the cycle, it'll only make it safer for your fish.
Continue that until your readings are 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, with some nitrites showing.

Or you can do a big water change to get rid of the product Cycle and go with tetra SafeStart. If you decide to use TSS, you might want to use whatever water conditioner that's recommended.
Don't feel like an idiot, many members started out the same way, some even worse.

Best of luck and post some pics when you get a chance

Tony G.

Lucy has ya covered
Welcome to Fishlore!!!


form what lucy has said, i would do the following.
I woud start over with TSS...

that´s what i would do, cycle wont work, and TSS does most of the time, and you wont have to do WC´s at al for 7 days and it will keep your water safe for the fish while it cycles...

navyscuba

to FL.

bolivianbaby

Welcome to Fishlore

Meenu

Hi, I just wanted to say that I'm new here too, and my posts have been similar to yours... so... welcome to the club!! <mommybaby295 is waiting for you to join her in the timeout corner - did you bring your dunce cap? if not, she has an extra.>

Tony G.

Lucy

Now now, given all the bad info out there you'd at least think a fish store wouldn't steer you wrong.
Both of you, out of the corner and throw away those caps!

Meenu

The two things I can say for sure after a week on this website: don't buy Cycle and those who sell fish know nothing about them, at least in my area.

ynaggo

Yeah What Lucy said, obtain some Tetra SafeStart and do about a 90% water change and adding the correct amount of SafeStart

If you can you can get some prime, this product will treat like 4000 gallons in 1 bottle and will last you a lifetime, What it does is dechlorinates the water and detoxifies the ammonia for 24 hours until you are ready for a next water change if necessary.
I believe its 1ml per 10 gallons and it comes in 500ml bottles.

jdhef

As other have suggested, I would do a big water change and use SafeStart. Daily 50% water changes with a 55 gallon tank will get old really fast. BTW are you familiar with a "Python"? It's not just a snake! A Python is a gravel vac with a loooong hose that you hook to your faucet. Then by turning on the water, a vacuum is created and it starts siphoning water out of your tank and into the sink. Then you turn a lever of some sort (I don't actually own one since my tank is only 36 gallons) and it starts to fill your tank with tap water. No buckets required.

And one last thing...No one here will think you are a dunce! Pretty much everyone on this forum started off on the wrong foot because they listened to the "Professionals" at the pet stores. It truely amazes me how much bad information they give out.

SWilkins

Welcome to Fishlore...no dunce cap required here LOL.

aquarist48

Welcome to Fish Lore Melissa. I would like to add that if you decide to do a 90% water change (which would be a good idea in my opinion)...Once you fill it back up use the Prime first and wait 24 hours before adding the Tetra Safe Start (TSS). The Prime will keep your fish safe as mentioned for the 24 hour period. Use the entire bottle of TSS. Once you add the TSS don't do any tests or water changes for a full 7 days. The readings will be all over the charts during this period. Keep us posted. We're here to help any way we can so don't hesitate to ask questions.

Please don't feel too badly. Many of us have been where you are and it will get better.

Enjoy your new tanks and I hope you enjoy the site.
Ken

jprime84

Be sure to monitor the pH and temperature of the water if you do a big water change. You run the risk of shocking the fish if conditions change too rapidly.

Lucy

Good point.

Eve_ill

To everyone:
Thank you sooooo much!! This is one of the most helpful forums I've ever been on! I suppose all the great help is exactly due to such bad info coming from the LFS people!
Okay- We got the safestart, and are doing a massive WC today! We also got an API master kit. I tested both tanks. The 55g is doing fine, which I suppose it would be since the ammonia spike hasn't started yet. However, the smaller tank was off the charts. Ammonia was 4ppm, NO2 2.0, NO3 was 5.0!!! Talk about emergency...I know that this was due to having all of the fish in there for almost 4 days. It was way too overcrowded. Also, the neighbor had a serious algae problem when he had the 55g. When we first looked at the tank, the entire front was virtually impossible to see through. I can't tell you how long it took me to clean it. He also admitted to being notoriously bad at not keeping up on WC's as well as overfeeding. I feel bad knowing that those guys were all in this 10g in horrible water, even though it was clear as a bell, it was hurting them. Of course that was before I started reading all about aquariums, so it was out of simply not knowing...
I will definitely keep everyone posted as to how things are going! Once again thank you so much; I feel at home here already!
Melissa

Thanks!! Yes, actually we had the luck of getting a Python from the neighbor as well. I guess as a newbie I'm lucky to bypass the "initiation" of bucket carrying and water splashing! Yay!!

Melissa

Lucy

Good luck Melissa, please keep us informed.

Eve_ill

....I can't believe how much these people at the LFS give out bad advice. Why is that? Even the guy that gave me the bad info said that he only works there on the weekend to pay for his hobby! If most of them are seasoned aquarists, then how in the world can they offer crappy advice?!

Tony G.

i agree... but here´s what i believe. They do have love for fish, but they like the $$$ better... and they preffer to earn money than give out great advise.
Think about it...
someone aquires a ten gallon
the next day they get 5 fish
that same week they die.
They go out to get more fish
and they die...
it just keeps repeating, and they´re earning money

BassNFool

Normally I never attribute to bad what I can attribute to ignorance. However, I think your right. People tend to buy stuff on impulse. Imagine these scenarios:

1. Customer enters LFS wanting to buy a 10-20 gallon aquarium and a appropriate number of fish. LFS owner explains that the customer will have a 4-8 week wait before he can start adding the fish he wants. Whim severely diminished man leaves with nothing.

2. Customer enters LFS wanting to buy a 10-20 gallon aquarium and a appropriate number of fish. LFS sells the aquarium, accessories and fish. Customer returns complaining of dead fish. LFS explains that fish in a new aquarium often have a high mortality rate. Offers replacement fish at reduced price.
Customer either:
a. Buys the replacement fish, 4-8 weeks later fish quit dying.
or
b. gives up

Unfortunate, but I'm sure scenario #2 generally wins.

BassNFool

jdhef

Well here's what they should do:

Customer enters LFS wanting to buy a 10-20 gallon aquarium and a appropriate number of fish. Fish store sells them tank and all equipment and instructs them to fill the tank and let it run overnight and come back the next day for appropriate number of fish and a bottle of SafeStart.

bolivianbaby

Scenario #3-Customer buys aquarium, comes home, discovers Fishlore, goes back to the LFS and tells THEM how to properly cycle and maintain an aquarium

jprime84

I find it greatly depends on the store. I have had more sales pitches from one of the bigger chain petstores, but more honest help and advice from the local (locally owned) fish store (not pet store).

ynaggo

I usually go to Big Al's and they give great advice, One time I've been to a pet shop to pickup some omega flakes and I overheard this girl talking about how all her guppies died, So I interupted and explained the nitrogen cycle and everything, the owner kicked me out saying I gave bad advice.